Well, hello, good morning. I'm so happy to be here. Yeah, like Reverend Hozon said, this is my home temple. I did Chukai here, and I was ordained here, and I was married to Reverend Galleon here. But I was shuso at Tazahara. But Mel led the practice period. That's the most recent practice period he's led at Tazahara. It's 05. Anyway, it's really nice to see so many familiar faces and some new faces. So this morning, I'd like to talk about kshanti paramita, the practice of the perfection of patience or forbearance, as it's usually translated.

[01:17]

And I'd like to talk about engaged Buddhism. And I would like to talk about the prison work that we do, our ministry at San Quentin, And I like to talk about the appropriateness of talking about politics from this seat. So that's a lot. We'll see if I actually do talk about all that stuff. But in case I bit off more than I could chew, maybe we could try to leave some time for questions at the end and we can all chew it together. So, maybe starting from the abstract and going to the specific. The paramitas, let me see, who here has heard that word before? Pretty good. These are the practices of a bodhisattva, and usually there's a list of six paramitas, and they are dana, meaning generosity, ishila, meaning morality or ethical behavior, kshanti, meaning patience or forbearance, as it's usually translated, virya, meaning energy,

[02:46]

or resolve, and jhana, meaning zazen, basically, and prajna, meaning wisdom. In, well, I'll tell you the way this one thinks about, this is kind of like, share my understanding of what paramitas are. In Buddhism, we often talk about the two truths. the absolute and the relative, samsara and nirvana. You know, on the one hand, we are really one body, but on the other hand, you know, there's Greg and Eric and Charlie and Alan and Mel, Andrea and so forth, but actually we are, the reality is, the absolute reality is, we are not separate. Self and other are not two. And I think that our practice of zazen sort of encourages that understanding.

[03:52]

But you can't really hang out there. You can't hang out in the world of, oh, it's all one man. Because actually, we live in the relative world. We live in the world of samsara. And what we do does make a difference. but the Paramitas as I understand them are those practices which a Bodhisattva does which kind of reconcile the two truths or bring them together or kind of soften the edges around them. So we practice Shila Paramita, we practice ethical behavior because it does make a difference because we are one body. You know, it makes a difference how we behave in the world. So, the paramita of kshanti, which is hard to say, spelled K-S-H-A-N-T-I, I believe, meaning, usually translated as patience or forbearance.

[05:05]

is sometimes, well, I was reading Thich Nhat Hanh's commentaries on the Lotus Sutra, which I forget what the name of the book is, The Heart of the Cosmos or something, I can't remember the name of the book, but Master Thich Nhat Hanh wrote this commentary on the Lotus Sutra and he talks about the Paramitas towards the end of that book and he talks about Kshanti and his understanding of the word Kshanti I like a lot. He says the ideogram in Chinese for the character meaning Kshanti in Chinese is it shows like a heart with a sharp object above it. meaning the vulnerability, and sort of putting up with, enduring the difficult thing.

[06:13]

But Master Thich Nhat Hanh translates it as inclusiveness. He says if you can make your heart big enough to include the difficult thing, to include the difficult person, the difficult situation, that endurance is there, forbearance is there, and then it's easy. It's easy if you can make your heart big enough, if you can just be inclusive, include the difficult one, you know, practice that, you know, that's a practice you can really get a handle on. That's something you can really sink your teeth into, which, you know, I think all of these are. So, you know, our practice is not just Zazen, it's just, there's just sitting, but then there's when we come off the cushion, you know, how is our practice in the world? How do we relate to people, relate to things, relate to the world, our planet?

[07:23]

These are things I think about a lot. So, engaged Buddhism, What's that? I'm not really sure. It's a phrase many of us have heard before. I certainly have, and I don't really know much about it. When I thought, well, I'm going to Maybe talk about engaged Buddhism. My first thought was, what do I know about engaged Buddhism? Not much. I don't know anything about engaged Buddhism. Then I thought, oh, wait a minute. I go every Sunday night to San Quentin. I think that's an example of engaged Buddhism. I think. I think so. So maybe I could talk about that. Actually, that is the main thing I want to talk about.

[08:25]

I want to invoke the presence of one of our ancestors, Meili Scott, who left us on May 10th, 2001. Meili was a teacher here. She was Tanto at one point. She was a teacher of mine. And, Then, of course, she went on to teach in Arcata for a little while, but not nearly long enough before she left us for good. But, you know, Meili's still around. As long as we think about her and remember her, she's still around. Sometimes I dream about her. Anyway, Meili got me started on doing prison and jail work back in the day when I was just coming to here.

[09:38]

I started coming here in the beginning of 96. And I don't think it was, maybe a year later, I asked Maylee, I heard that Maylee was doing this in the jail, in the Oakland jail. And I asked her about doing that. And she said, I had a feeling you were gonna ask me that. which I thought that was pretty sweet. And more recently, of course, I was a monk at Tassajara for six years. But while I was at Tassajara, I had a pen pal correspondence with a guy in San Quentin named Vincent Russo. And Then I was asked to, Linda and I were asked to move to the city to take up jobs, practice positions rather, at the temple at City Center. And I've been the treasurer at City Center for the last three years.

[10:39]

So when I knew I was coming to City Center, I was, well, not my first thought, but I had this thought, I can't write Vince anymore. because I knew that I'd be able to go to San Quentin. And you can't have a correspondence with someone you're actually seeing in person. Can't do both, it's against the rules. There's a lot of rules, really a lot of rules. I would compare the San Quentin administration to the Soto Shu, maybe. They're equally kind of dense and hard to understand. So, the San Quentin Buddha Dharma Sangha actually got its start with a lot of help from Alan back in 99. It was this guy who was my pen pal, actually. I did not know, but it was Vince Russo.

[11:44]

He's a lifer. He's a term lifer. He lives in North Block in San Quentin, where most of the lifers in San Quentin live. There's many different prisons within the prison in San Quentin. It's different levels of security and also, you know, it's where California's condemned live, 677 condemned men live in East Block and Death Row as it's called. The North Block is kind of medium security, but they're all lifers, term lifers mostly, you know, long sentences and totally institutionalized for the most part. And they all have, you know, they have good time, they have good behavior. They're allowed to participate in these programs, such as coming to chapel and participating in Buddha Dharma Sangha. But before it got established, Vince had just been sitting zazen in the yard.

[12:46]

He just sat Zazen by himself in the yard and people noticed him and like, well, you know, what are you doing? Zazen, what's that? It's Buddhism. They got to talking and some of them decided, you know, maybe we could get a group going, you know, actual chapel group. And so they contacted the Buddhist Peace Fellowship and Alan helped, facilitated which means to make easier. He facilitated them getting a teacher who is Sado Lee Debaros. Sado Roshi is our teacher at Buddhadharma Sangha. And so people ask me what I do there. I say, I just, I help him. When I first started going there, I was going with John King. And that was like when just before John started getting sick, another great Bodhisattva who's left us, I don't think many of you know John, knew John, but he was a great, I would say even Buddhist saint, the most generous person I ever met, who gave of his time.

[14:00]

energy and money and all the resources he had. He didn't only go to San Quentin, he also went to San Bruno and County Jail. Anyway, and then John started getting sick, you know, he died of esophageal cancer. And so I thought I'd better get a brown card, which is a permanent gate clearance. It means I can run the program if Seito Roshi isn't there, which sometimes I have gone. Usually we bring other people in. Being a brown card holder means I can also be responsible for people who come in on gate clearance. My friend Brad is here today. He's joined us in San Quentin a couple times. Other people, you know, come pretty regular. And there's a couple of people for whom, that's their Sangha, actually, is the Buddhadharma Sangha inside San Quentin. They don't go to any other Buddhist Sangha.

[15:01]

And there's been a couple of times when it was just me and the guys, actually. So I try to go most Sundays and I do go most Sundays. And it's a high point of my week, actually. It's an incredible boost to my practice. We sit zazen for 20 minutes, we do kinhin for 10 minutes, have some kind of chanting service, then we have a break, and then we have some kind of dharma talk or class by one of us, usually Seto Roshi, or maybe it'll be one of the guys. So it's really, it's a wonderful program. And I've been getting more and more involved over the last three years. So, I said I also wanted to talk about talking about politics from this seat, right? So, I think that's something that's happened sometimes, particularly in this zendo.

[16:11]

Sometimes Sojin talks about politics a little bit, and sometimes he's had some feedback about that. And, you know, when I went to Houston Zen Center, the abiding teacher there, Galen Godwin, as I was about to give a talk there, Galen took me aside and she said, don't you talk about politics. This is not Berkeley. This sangha is 50-50, red state, blue state. And she was serious. And I said, cool. I hadn't intended to, but thanks. Then I thought, you know, well, it should always be like that, I think. If we're talking about politics in terms of like coming down on one side or another, actually, I don't think that's so appropriate for myself.

[17:19]

I don't feel good about that as a clergy person, as someone who's like talking from the Dharma seat. However, and I think we should always assume that the assembly is 50-50 red state, blue state, whether we know better or not. I think that's a good way to go. I would not want to be exclusive in any way. Right? Inclusive, shanti paramita, inclusiveness. So, there could be somebody here who thinks McCain is a swell guy, you know? I voted for him. What are you talking about? Could be. I wouldn't want that person to like stomp out of here and say, well, I'm not coming back here because of that. About a year ago, I was up in, Portland, Oregon, and Kogan Carlson, the teacher there, gave a talk on this very subject.

[18:23]

And he said, for himself, I'm a political animal. I have politics, but I don't share those politics with people. However, I do make exceptions. So he said in 1992, there was this totally heinous ballot measure in Oregon called Measure 9 that this group called the Oregon Citizens Alliance, I don't know if any of you, I mean, we're not in Oregon, so maybe you never heard of it. This is in 92, but he said, I actually wrote down the entire measure. It says, all governments in Oregon may not use their monies or properties to promote, encourage, or facilitate homosexuality, pedophilia, sadism, or masochism. All levels of government, including public education systems, must assist in setting a standard for Oregon's youth which recognizes that these behaviors are abnormal, wrong, unnatural, and perverse, and they are to be discouraged and avoided.

[19:27]

And that measure was defeated, not by a huge margin, but it was defeated. And it did a lot to galvanize gay rights in Oregon. And Kilgun said, when that measure was on the ballot in Oregon, he had a lawn sign and he had a big pink triangle in his window at Dharma Rain Zen Center. And he said, it was a human rights issue. It was not about one person or another person or one party or another party for him. This was a human rights issue. This was appropriate for Bodhisattva activity in Kyogen's view. And I like that point of view. I agree with that point of view. So, I was going to mention this most recent election, because I want to talk a little bit about something that I can't be politicking because election already happened, right? And Proposition 9 passed with a comfortable majority.

[20:34]

It passed with 53.4% of the vote. Proposition 9, Proposition 9, Proposition 9, also known as Marcy's Law. This is now on the books, it's now a statute, or I guess it's an amendment to the Constitution of California. And it overturned a ruling that gives parolees the right to counsel if parole is revoked. And it gives parole boards the power to deny a parole hearing not a parole hearing, the possibility of parole for up to 15 years at a time for anyone with a term of life sentence. So it seems like anything with the word victim in it is pretty much a slam dunk. I mean, the Democratic Party

[21:35]

recommended against it. A lot of people recommended against it. I know I voted against it, but I wasn't even really paying attention to it, to tell you the truth. I noticed when I said Proposition 9, you all went, eight? No, nine? I want to talk about Proposition 9. What was that? This Well, so I had not been to San Quentin for two Sundays in a row, which I don't like to do, but it so happened we had a board retreat in Tazahara one weekend, and then the next weekend, I actually went to Nevada to do a little canvassing for one side, you know. I don't want to talk about that. But I was in Nevada, you know, so I didn't go to San Quentin. And then I came back, I came back the next Sunday to San Quentin, and our guys were just like, totally crestfallen, you know, and I didn't even get it.

[22:44]

And I was ashamed of myself. I was so ashamed. I have in my notes here, it says my ignorance. Be sure to talk about my ignorance. I really didn't know. I knew that I voted against it, but it's huge effect on their lives. And boy, they were just like, whew, bad news. I mean, okay, here's an interesting statistic. In 2007, 62 prisoners were granted parole in California, which is less than 3% of those eligible. 62 lifers or 62 people? Prisoners. Period? Yeah. Well, maybe term lifers then. Yeah, probably that's true because the statistic I got was from talking about Proposition 9, so that makes sense. So less than 3% of those people eligible.

[23:46]

But this thing has even taken away the possibility, the hope for many of them, a great, great many of them. And it's gonna cost hundreds of millions of dollars a year to enforce. Nobody knows how many hundreds of millions. And we already spend over $10 billion a year in California on our prison system. And even though I'm treasurer of San Francisco Zen Center, that still feels like a lot of money to me. The prison industrial complex has kind of a stranglehold on this state. And it just gathers power unto itself. This proposition was put on the ballot almost exclusively by one person.

[24:48]

His name is Henry Nicholas, and he gave $4,845,000 of his personal wealth to, he also was a key person behind the Victims' Bill of Rights, which was passed in the 80s. The Victims' Bill of Rights is probably maybe not a bad thing at all, but this Proposition 9 does not add any more rights to victims. It merely takes away rights from offenders. Constitutional rights, possibly. And this guy, Henry Nicholas, I wanna talk about him because I don't wanna make an ad hominem attack, but what an interesting guy. Google him, Google his name. He's very wealthy and he's currently on drug charges himself. And he throws some interesting parties.

[25:52]

And you know, his sister was murdered. So yeah, a lot of pain. So back in San Quentin, I got educated about Proposition 9 in a hurry. This was the issue of the San Quentin News that I missed. And they had a panel on Proposition 9. The headline, the banner headline here says, Proposition 9 Called Catastrophic. And they had this panel and there was a guy, Troy Williams, who's a member of our Sangha, a person of color. He addressed the audience from a particular position of being both a lifer and the brother of a victim of violent crime. His heart-wrenching explanation of the effects the proposition will have on him and other lifers moved at least two people in the audience to tears.

[26:56]

It's interesting. This panel was sponsored by Father Stephen Barber, the Catholic chaplain. Sorry and you know if I have time I want to talk a little bit about that. So lots of opportunities for these guys. Lots of opportunities to practice Kshanti Paramita. And so how do they understand that? How do we understand that? Is it merely endurance? Is it merely like a stoic putting up with circumstances because they're locked inside? Okay, their rights are taken away. Okay, we're just gonna put up with it. Is that their practice? Is that our practice? In Buddhism, this universe that we live in, our universe, is called the Saha world.

[28:06]

and that's usually translated as the world of endurance. This world is the world called endurance. But is it just a veil of tears to get through? I think not. In chapter 24 of the Lotus Sutra, the chapter called the Bodhisattva Wonderful Voice, The Bodhisattva Wonderful Voice, or Wonderful Sound, asks, he's in a different world. He's in a pure land, the pure world, so-called. And he asked the Buddha who lives there, there's a Buddha who lives in that world, called the Pure Flower Star King Wisdom, that's his name. Pure Flower Star King Wisdom Tathagata, he asks his Buddha, he says he wants to go and visit Shakyamuni Buddha to hear him expound the Lotus Sutra in the Saha world. And the Buddha, pure flourished arcane wisdom, gives permission to the Bodhisattva Wonderful Voice.

[29:13]

He says, yes, you may go listen to Shakyamuni Buddha, expound the Lotus Sutra in the Saha world, but he gives him some advice. He says, do not despise that world. Do not consider it to be inferior to our world. Good man, the Saha world is not even. It is full of mud, stones, mountains, and impurities. That's true. That's true. The Saha world, the world of endurance is full of mud, stone, mountains, impurities, prisons, cars and sirens and garbage trucks and rich people who throw crazy parties and Facebook and YouTube and all kinds of stuff. And I love this Saha world. Actually, I love the Saha world. This is the world of practice. This is the world of engagement.

[30:15]

So I would say not endurance, but engagement. That's where that happens here in this Saha world. When I was talking to the guys once back in, well, this was... during Ramadan. We share a chapel space with the Islamists and the Jewish faith. So we have this little space called the Garden Plaza Chapel. But it was during Ramadan, so we didn't get the use of the space. So we were meeting in the Catholic chapel. The Catholics are very nice to us. Father Stephen Barber is a real Bodhisattva. And we did a one-day sitting and just like... We just started doing the one-day sitting in the Catholic chapel, and Sator Roshi wanted to see people for dokusan, because he could use the, what do you call it, vestry.

[31:22]

The vestry, not the confessional. Not the confessional, the vestry. He was using the vestry for private meetings. So he says, like, Oh, Greg, get to talk, would you? I said, okay, I'll give a talk. So, actually, I was talking about the paramitas with the guys. I said, you know, the word paramita is usually translated as perfection, but it also comes, you know, etymologically, it can be understood as crossing over. crossing over to the other shore. I learned this from Mel. Mel talks about this sometimes. And he also talks about, actually, when you're crossing over, you have one foot on both shores at the same time. This is real crossing over. It's absolute and relative. You don't really abide in either place. And so I was asking the guys, I said, how do you understand that crossing over?

[32:25]

What to you, what's the other shore? And two of them went like this. I said, what, San Quentin? They're like, that's some pretty fierce practice. I said, how do you understand the other shore? Two guys did that. So we're really practicing Zen in San Quentin. I want to tell you, that's some pretty fierce practice. Mel also talks about sometimes, he's given us the teaching of the one that comes right after Kshanti is Virya. which is energy or, you know, well, energy, vitality, resolve, you know, putting something into it, as it were. And Melis said that these two complement each other.

[33:27]

They reinforce each other. So our Kshanti that we practice is not just like patient endurance, like, okay, this sucks, but I'm just gonna put up We engage with it. We put our energy into it. So I googled, this is just a prop basically. I googled Kshanti and Thich Nhat Hanh and this book came to the top of the list. It's called Engaged Buddhism in the West. Oh, I haven't read it. But this chapter here is called All Buddhism is Engaged. So maybe actually that's how I understand engaged Buddhism. Practice, practice in this Saha world. How could that not be engaged Buddhism? So here's the quote that mentions Thich Nhat Hanh's understanding of Kshanti I'd like to share with you.

[34:33]

In the context of Thich Nhat Hanh's engaged Buddhism, his teachings on Kshanti are of particular interest. Usually translated as patience, forbearance, acceptance or tolerance, Thich Nhat Hanh in 1997, so there's the date, proposed inclusiveness as a better translation for the contemporary situation. Speaking from his own experience during the war in Vietnam, he addressed directly the suffering caused by racial and other discrimination in the United States. I myself am not a white person. In Vietnam, I felt that I was discriminated against, but I didn't suffer. I didn't suffer at all. Gays, lesbians, Hispanics, black people, they have understood what discrimination is. Many of them have suffered from discrimination, but if they know how to practice the paramitas, they will stop suffering and they will get resource from within in order to help the people who discriminate against them. So when I read that, I was like, cha-ching, that's it.

[35:37]

That's it. That's exactly what I see in Sam Quentin. These guys want to help. They are not actually just patiently enduring their sentences. They want to help. They are doing Bodhisattva practice. So, just much more recently, I was invited to be a part of this Interfaith Roundtable that was sponsored by the Catholic Chapel on reconciliation justice or restorative justice. Now, that could be a whole nother Dharma talk. And I'm not that involved in the restorative justice movement, but it seems to be like sort of, sucking me in somehow. Vince came to me and he said, we need a Buddhist clergy person to do the invocation for... I said, okay, I'll do it. I mean, I hear that practice request. I will totally do it. I'll be there. And it's actually the second one I've been to, but most recently, this is just a few weeks ago.

[36:43]

It was amazing. There were so many Catholic priests there from all over the state. The Catholic Church, these radical Catholics, is like the seedbed of this movement which seeks to completely repair the entire justice system, which is broken. Everybody, especially those on the inside, they know it's broken, it doesn't work. It just doesn't work, this adversarial business where the victims and offenders don't ever see each other or talk to each other. don't even know what's going on, how their lawyers are preparing their offense and their defense, those kinds of words, you know, that's, it's just completely adversarial. And it doesn't work. It doesn't work. And this thing, like this Marcy's Law, you know, very well intentioned, but it just adds to the pain. It's not helping anything. It's not helping anybody. And nobody gets that better than the, I think, better than the guys who are actually doing the time in there.

[37:48]

And so they, like the book says, they wanna end discrimination by helping. And part of the Interfaith Roundtable was these victim-offender education groups that was just incredibly moving. I listened to victim impact statements and offender impact statements. That was pretty hard to take. And it was not some cop show we were talking about, you know, but real people's real lives. And people taking responsibility for their actions, asking for the opportunity to take responsibility for their actions, which are not being given exactly. So, you know, I don't wanna romanticize this too much. They're there, they all know why they're there, for a reason. But, you know, they want to help.

[38:51]

So, When you put Kshanti and Virya together and engage in that way, I would, I'd like to propose that there's a certain kind of deep joy arises from there. And this joy I've also seen inside San Quentin and elsewhere. When I was in Nevada, I stayed up right through the election, and so we went to this victory party at the Rio Hotel and Casino. I was in Las Vegas, by the way. I was staying in a hotel right in the middle of the strip.

[39:52]

That's a different story, too. But we went to a victory party at the Rio Hotel, and actually, the energy at the party kind of turned me off. I didn't like it. Because it was all, we won, they lost. We won, they lost. We're the winners, they're the losers. Just a lot of that energy. Which, you know, they work very hard, the people who were, you know, working on the election work very hard. And so, it's like, celebration, I can understand that. But, kind of, it rubbed me the wrong way. until we were watching the acceptance speech on this giant video monitor, and Obama, what did he say? What did he say? What did he say that made me feel better? He said, to those Americans whose support I have yet to earn, I may not have won your vote, but I hear your voices. I need your help, and I will be your president too. And so that was nice, because right away I was just like, I can breathe, that's better.

[40:59]

It's inclusiveness versus adversarial. So kind of, that's the gist of it. After, okay, I will talk a little bit about Proposition 8 too. Because when it was defeated, Linda and I marched the Friday, right, after the election. We marched up Market Street. It was so much fun. It was this beautiful autumn evening. It was warm up the street in the dark. And it was totally a feeling of joy. Actually, in the, In the most recent New Yorker, the New Yorker that just came out, there's a little piece in the beginning of the New Yorker, and it talks about Proposition 8 passing, and it said, in the days after the election, tens of thousands of people, gay and straight, took to the streets of cities and towns throughout the country in spontaneously organized protest.

[42:03]

But the mood at these gatherings, by all accounts, was seldom angry. It was cheerful, determined, and hopeful. That was totally our experience. We had such a good time. It was a gas. Some of the signs were so witty. One of them said, gay is the new black. One guy was carrying this huge sign, it just said Namaste. I thought that was so sweet. But my favorite was this woman was carrying another really big sign that said, now that I can't plan my wedding, I guess I'll just have to go destroy the prison industrial complex. So, you know, At the Interfaith Roundtable, I did the invocation. They wanted a prayer.

[43:04]

Each of many different faiths, the usual different faiths, offered a different prayer. So I read Meili's peace prayer that I think a lot of you know, and the people really, really liked it. And in that prayer, Meili said, may I continually cultivate the ground of peace for myself and others and persist mindful and dedicated to this work independent of results. So Proposition 9 passed, Proposition 8 passed. It's not the end of the story. It's not a opportunity to go into recrimination or anger. It's an opportunity to like, OK, how are we going to practice with this? How do we engage with this? That's all. And, you know, that's our practice all the time. So, yes, all Buddhism is engaged Buddhism, I suspect.

[44:06]

I suspect that could be true. I think that's all I had to say. If there's a question or I could read Meili's peace prayer or we could just quit. Yes. Not really to make up for it, because it's so harsh, but to give, like, they closed a door, and so to open another one. Well... I...

[45:29]

personally happen to be of the opinion that just sitting upright in stillness is engaged Buddhism and is working for growth and change. I'll say that at the outset, that I just happen to believe, just where I'm coming from, Zazen is very good for the USA. you know, but also we engage, right, in the relative world, like I was talking about. Our practice is grounded in the relative. So there's many things you can do to reach out to these men and women, as Alan can attest to, or Linda, who happens to be volunteer coordinator at San Francisco Zen Center and hooks people up with the prison correspondence project at Zen Center. There's also a correspondence project at Buddha's Peace Fellowship. and you can get involved in the reconciliation justice movement.

[46:42]

We had a Jukai. We've had actually two Jukais in San Quentin. I was told till 11.15 but it's... I was super relaxing. Doesn't mean we can't quit though. Yes. at the bargaining table.

[48:23]

I mean, that's what you do, right? That's what the management and unions do. They come to the bargaining table together. They include each other. That's where the work gets done. Strike if you have to, but the real work is done at the bargaining table, and that's the place to practice inclusiveness, I would think, to recognize that, okay, we do actually all need to Well, you know, it's the Saha world. with patience.

[49:29]

I mean, Kshanti is usually translated as patience or forbearance, right? So the inclusiveness is with the spirit of patience, understanding. Understanding is critical, I think. You have to be willing to put yourself in the other's shoes. Why do people vote that way versus this way? What are their interests? What is security versus change? To understand, that's the beginning. Understanding and then, yeah, patience, tolerance. You know, she says, which side are you on?

[51:23]

Which side are you on? And you know, sometimes actually You know, I was, of the many things I thought I might mention this morning, it occurs to me Trungpa Rinpoche used to admonish his students a lot, don't be so satisfied about being on the good guy's side. You're always on the good guy's side. You think you're on the right side all the time. Be careful of that. He would admonish them to like really be careful of that view. Because, well, that's just not quite how we understand it. You have to take sides sometimes, but you have to like widen your field of vision. Anyway, now Jerry's gone. Being star numberless.

[52:30]

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