Well, last week, today, actually, I want to apologize for talking so much, but Hosan, our vice abbot, was supposed to talk today, and he asked me to talk for him instead. he had to go back east to his oldest friend's funeral. So, I'm taking his place. So, last time, last week, I talked about—I read several stories from Dogen's Heihei Shingi. Shingi, as you may know, is a collection of anecdotes and stories about how the various monks had enlightenment understanding

[01:18]

through their positions, the tenzo, the work leader, and the various positions in the monastery as examples of how you take care of yourself and how you take care of others and take care of the practice. So one of the stories that I read is a very controversial story. and I'll remind you of it. Everybody has a little something that comes up for them when I read the story. So, after I read the story, I'm going to ask you what you think the point of the story is. So, Priest Shizian of Guixin, this is the teacher, was a stern, cool, and aloof old teacher.

[02:27]

He was respected by the monks. A group of monks, including Zen Master Fa Yuan of Mount Fu, in Xu Province, and Zen Master Zi Huai on Mount Tianyi in Yue Province, pardon my Chinese, came to practice in his community. This was before they were Zen masters, when they were novices. It was a cold and snowy day. When they met Master Xue Ziyan, he yelled and drove them away. Not only that, He poured water around the visiting monks hall so that everyone's clothes got wet. This is in the middle of the winter. All the visiting monks fled, except Fa Yuan and Zi Wai. So this teacher only wants sincere students. He does not want to bother with anyone who is not a sincere student.

[03:39]

So all the visiting monks fled except Fa Yuan and Zi Huai. Fa Yuan and Zi Huai arranged their robes and sat Tangario in the hall. Tangario is, you're sitting for a week before you enter the monastery, and they give you some instruction, but mostly you just sit Zazen all the time, day and night, without doing something like Qin Yin. It's the entrance exam, partly. So Fa Yuan approached the master and he said, no, I'm sorry. Fa Yuan and Zi Wei arranged their robes and sat Tangario in the hall. Fa Yuan approached the master. He got up and he said, I would like to talk to you. And said, the two of us who stayed,

[04:45]

Came hundreds of miles to study your Zen. How could a dipper full of water drive us away? So that was pretty courageous. Even if we get beaten to death, we will not leave. So I call this story, you have to be careful what you say. Shizwan laughed and said, you both need to study Zen. Go and hang up your bag. That's a term, a Zen term is hang up your traveling bag. And that means you're going to stay someplace. So, you know, I have some footnotes that I had here that I wrote down. that Shazian demanded complete sincerity.

[05:58]

And a good teacher can bring out more spirit in you than you think that you had. And that was my experience with my teacher. That's why I appreciated my teacher so much, because he brought out a lot of spirit that I didn't know that I had. So later, the teacher asked Fa Yuan to serve as Tenzo. At that time, the assembly was suffering his aloof style and unappetizing food. One day, Shizian, the teacher, went out to the nearby village, and while he was away, Fa Yuan, the Tenzo, took the key to the storehouse without permission, and took some noodles and some oil, and made a delicious breakfast for the community, all on his own.

[07:07]

Then Fa Yuan said, I'm sorry, after breakfast was over, I'm sorry, I have to find my place here. Okay, he made this delicious breakfast for the community. But Shezian, the teacher, returned early. And without saying anything, joined in the zendo meal. He just sat down and started eating with everybody, as if nothing happened. After breakfast was over, he sat outside the zendo and sent for the tenzo. Shizyon said, did you really take noodles and oil from the storeroom and cook that meal for the community? Then Faiwan said, yes, I did. Please punish me. So this is sincerity, right? I did this, mea culpa. whatever punishment you mete out, I probably deserve."

[08:14]

Shazian told him to estimate the price of the material and compensate the community by selling his robes and his bowl. That's pretty severe. He then gave him 30 blows and kicked him out of the monastery. for doing something kind, right? I mean, wow. Here he's trying to, you know, give the monks something. The food is bad, you know, and it's sparse, even though there's some in the storeroom. So Fa Yuan, the Tenzo, stayed in a nearby city and asked his Dharma brother to plead with the master to pardon him. But Shazian would not forgive him. Fa Yuan also pleaded, even if I'm not admitted to return, I'd like to at least request to be in line to enter the abbot's room.

[09:22]

In other words, to have dokasan. But Shazian did not approve it. One day Shazian went to the city. and saw Fa Yuan standing in front of a traveler's shelter. Monasteries often had outside, in the nearby town, shelters and places for people to stay. Shunzhen said to him, this shelter belongs to the monastery. How long have you been living here? Have you paid your fees? He asked Fa Yuan to calculate his fees and asked him to pay. Fa Yuan was not disturbed. This is a very key thing. Fa Yuan was not disturbed. He had no resentment against the master. He carried his bowl to the city, in the city, collecting food, which he sold and then made his payment to the monastery.

[10:26]

Later Shizian went to the city and saw Fa Yuan begging. He returned to the monastery and told the assembly that Fa Yuan had a really true intention to study Zen and finally called him back. So what is this? What do you think is the point of this story? Okay, John, you can be first. Well, that's good. Okay, what else? Question your ideas. Okay, so what I get from you is that this is about feeding the community, about, I don't mean about his, is that what you mean?

[11:34]

No, I mean it's about that he thought he was, you know, what he was going to do was, you know, a good thing. He thought that was good. Okay. So, any other? Yes, Peter? Yes, and how would you express that? I mean, how would you clean that? Well, then you will have another opportunity to express your sincerity. Okay. Maheen? I'm just wondering the difference between determination and sincerity and letting go. Because the beginning, the beginning people Okay. Jerry? I think it sounds like the same thing that happens in

[13:16]

Um, Sue? First of all, no good deed goes unpunished. But when we carry out an act of kindness, sincerely, very much saw that he needed to be in this practice. And? It's about intention and living with the results. OK.

[14:36]

But if it had ended there, there might have been room for ego to come in again at any of those points. So just when you're ready to say, oh he accepted, this is great. catching up. The only way was just to totally give in. And when someone is defiant and go with a good heart, there has to be some discipline or, I don't want to say punishment, so that the priest who

[16:07]

Roshi hadn't provided that discipline, how would there be that learning? I think that the question, your answers could keep going on, but I think there are enough. Denise, okay. When you make some yield for the accommodation through this taking that's not his to give, and so he's actually violating the precept of taking. And in the second example, where he's only in town, I know the story from another version of him. Okay.

[17:47]

Thank you. Okay, so what my observation of this is, there are two points. The obvious point is cooking the meal, taking the stuff and cooking the meal and taking the consequences. But I think the major point is not that. The major point is this. Even if we're beaten to death, we will not leave.

[18:54]

That's what the, although the teacher uses this incident of cooking the meal as a way to teach fazian, shazian, The real test is, even if we get beaten to death, we will not leave. Do you really mean that? Do you really mean that you won't leave if you're beaten to death? Of course, if you're beaten to death, you leave anyway, but... But that's the point that I see as the main point. And the dinner, the cooking thing is an excuse, or not exactly an excuse, but a teaching point for the teacher. I don't think anybody said anything wrong.

[20:00]

Everyone had their observations, which I would not judge as wrong, but the main point is how sincere are you that you will be beaten, that you will, even if you're beaten to death, you won't leave? So, and Linda has a question. If which was you? But I wouldn't tell the story in that way to make that point.

[21:12]

Well, it depends on what you think is abusive and cruel. Yeah. Thank you. Okay. Yes. Yes, exactly. Two thoughts. The first is, Something about the interplay of intention and impact. So, you know, we could change the context of a wife who continues to go back and never leave, and the husband could beat her to death. Yes. And there's way too much of that going on, so that's really not... But she didn't say that. I will stay even if you beat me to death. Well, some women do. Yes, some women do. That's why I say, you have to be careful what you say. interplay of intention and impact is a story I heard, I'm trying to remember who it was, but I believe it was a woman during the Civil Rights era, an African American woman, who said that when they were in a very key sit-in, or they were on the road to sell something, where there was going to be, you know, they anticipated a lot of violence and they would be beaten.

[23:06]

that she said, it's not that any of us wanted to be beaten or had a death wish or anything, it's just that there comes a time when you just know what you have to do. And, you know, we could say this about the monks in Vietnam who immolated, you know, set themselves on fire, and we might agree or disagree with that upaya, that skillful means, but I think this thing of really being cognizant of context and container for any right action. You know, who can say? Yes. So this is the container for this action. In a different container, it would have a different meaning. Yes. And I think that that's really important. That's very important, that it's within this particular situation. Okay, John.

[24:09]

Megan had her hand up before. I think it's important, not only what was the teacher's action and intention, but that the student understood it. Yes, that the student understood it. That's right. And it was not meanness. It was a teaching, yes. Okay. Was there a part of maybe celebrating the month he broke the rules, like he acted from his own compass, in his own sense of, like there was an etiquette there, but he sort of believed in his own actions, so he sort of within, I don't know. He thought within. Like, yeah, he believed in his own sort of notions of what he should do and things, rather than listening to someone else, you know, as kind of a celebration of that maybe. The thing about Fa Yuan is that he knew he was doing something good for the students, but he knew he was going to pay for it.

[25:19]

So this story has a lot of different aspects to it. That's one aspect. But we tend to focus on that as the meaning of the story. It's a kind of secondary meaning. I think the fundamental meaning is we're gonna stay no matter if you kill us. That's the primary, because he's testing, is that really true? So, this is the kind of teacher he was. If you say something, you have to prove that you mean it. Of course, he didn't kill the student, you know. Yes? Didn't he really not stay the moment that he broke the rule and made it real? I don't think he said that, no.

[26:36]

He just did it. He wasn't supposed to do that. Yes, he was not supposed to do that. So he broke the rule, you know. And that gave the teacher an opportunity to focus on what he had said in the beginning. Yeah, well, they test each other, of course. Yes, the student is always testing the teacher and the teacher is always testing the student. It goes both ways. Because he said, I realized I did this, you know, and I did it out of my kindness of my heart. And the teacher said, well, anyway,

[27:37]

This is your punishment. So the punishment seems really severe. I mean, it's like, why punish the guy this far or this much just for doing that? Right? I mean, does the punishment fit the crime? As Gilbert and Sullivan would say. I wonder, student testing the teacher, this guy came with a wanting label, right? Everybody knows that he's a dour and difficult guy. That's right. So is he just a guy with an attitude, or is he a guy when you get a dour response from him, he's going to be giving you dharma with it? Well, of course, the teacher's always giving the dharma. But he found out that it wasn't just an attitude, it was this guy's sincere effort. Yeah, it wasn't just an attitude. I see somebody's hand up there.

[28:41]

Oh, yeah, Margaret. Ask him what? Well, when it comes to speculation, I can't answer your question. So, right in the beginning you talked about that your teacher brought out more spirit than you realized you had. Yes. And I wondered about that and also if that has something to do with it. I'll tell you what I got from my teacher. When we sat Zazen, this was back in 1964. nobody could sit zazen very well. We were just learning how to sit zazen and it was excruciating for everybody.

[29:45]

I mean it still is for some people, most of us, but Suzuki Roshi would say, don't move, don't move, and then he would walk out of the room and nobody knew when he would come back. So this is what And this was like do or die. That's what he taught us, do or die. So, I would have to say to myself, I'm going to do this even if I die. That's why I relate to this story perfectly. This is an ordinary story for Zen. In a way, in a certain way. It's like if you really, if you want the tiger's cub, you have to go into the tiger's cave and then face the tiger.

[30:49]

Well, there's some people waving back there in the back. Yes, wave, yes, but please speak articulately, because otherwise I can't understand what you're saying. Talk to me. Oh, okay. Hey, awesome.

[31:56]

You're perfectly right. But what Judy said was, it's all about the context. It's all about the context. In one situation, this is just the right response. In another situation, it's not. So it all depends on what the situation is, what the circumstances are, who the people are. So yes, punishment does, you know, great if you can do without punishment, nevertheless, It all depends on the circumstances. So in this case, to think outside this box is fine, but it doesn't have anything to do with this particular situation. This particular situation has its own structure.

[33:31]

So there's always a way of thinking in alternatives, and that's fine, no problem. But we should understand the circumstances of this situation and the teaching that goes with it. Yes. Yes. Yes. And at the same time, don't move doesn't mean you shouldn't move. It's encouragement to do your best, to bring out your spirit.

[34:49]

I can't do this anymore, but I will do it. Even though I can't do it, I will do it. I can't stay and I can't leave. What do you do? That's the goal. I can't. And then something breaks, something emerges from that tight situation. that impossible situation, to find yourself in that impossible situation and then to find the way through. That's what it's really about. So that's our life. It's an impossible situation. It's simply the fact of life. It's an impossible, but this presents itself. How do you find your way through an impossible situation?

[35:50]

Is that enough? What? Don't move. No what? No ice water? Well, you know, I don't really test my students. It's like, it depends on our situation. Everything depends on, it's all situational. There are no formulas. Just, you know, you do this, I do that. We just interact. And if there's an opportunity, teacher has to be really present to take it. And the student has to be really present to take it. So, sometimes when the teacher puts himself into, or the student puts themselves into the situation, and it all comes together, and boom.

[37:16]

So that's how it is. In fact, you know, There's no formula and no technique. So that's why we, instead of depending on ideas, we depend on intuition. Intuition, you know, gets a back seat these days because we're really focused on ideas. So it makes it harder. But intuition is to be prepared without being prepared. It means not having any particular idea that stands in the way of intuition. We have an idea, not that ideas are bad or wrong, but they block intuition.

[38:22]

So just being open, having it Open mind. Just an open mind. Did you ever see a dog looking for a mole? They pop up their head. Or a cat, and they just wait, but they don't have any ideas, no thoughts. No thought, just total concentration. And then when the mole picks his head up, boom! So, that's intuition. It's instinct, but instinct is a kind of intuition. Intuition is more than instinct. Yes, yes, it's called Zazen.

[39:27]

Even though we don't sit Zazen to develop that. You know, when we talk about Zazen, it's like not expecting anything, not expecting anything, that's it. Not expecting. You don't expect to, you know, just taught and open and relaxed at the same time. And then when something happens, boom. That's intuition. Charles. Yeah, well, he was smart.

[40:35]

That's right. My first machine, I said, what the heck are we doing here? And I got up and left. I, yes, because there was no place to go. There was absolutely no place to go. I went down, this is in San Francisco, and I went down to the marina, you know, it's kind of a nice place, but I wandered around and it was just, I was not, that was not my world. My world was the Sashin and I could not get out of it. So I went back, finished the Sashin. When you commit yourself to Sesshin, you sit down and you sit for 40 minutes. It can be 25 minutes or whatever it is. You're committing yourself to doing that. You don't get up and walk out because there's no place you can go because you've committed yourself to staying in that place, doing this thing for 40 minutes.

[41:42]

So you can get up and walk around, but there's no place to go because of your commitment. So you learn those things. There's just nothing to do. And so here we are in this world with our circumstances, that's our life, our self and our surroundings. or is ourself. And you can't get up and go to another world. But even though that happens, you have not finished your work here. You can have a whole different life. But it's very interesting. There's a story about a yogi.

[42:54]

The yogi is sitting by the river and stream and this young man is kind of troubled and he comes to the yogi and he gives him food, you know, and he sits by him and he says, what do you think I should do with my life? And then this, I can't remember exactly what the turning words there were, but the young man goes off, and he meets circumstances giving this wonderful opportunity, and he meets his princess, and he marries her, and they have children, and he leads this really lush, ideal life. And then suddenly something happens and he loses the whole thing and nothing but troubles.

[43:56]

And then suddenly he wakes up and he's sitting there by the side of the river with this yogi. So life is but a dream, but it's real. It's a real dream. So it's probably time.

[44:19]

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