If something, just some little thing happens, you know, like somebody drops their spoon or something, that it causes us to start laughing. And laughter in that way becomes sometimes uncontrollable. And it's a way of letting off the pressure. So there are lots of ways of letting off pressure. So how to keep ourselves contained and watchful and aware that what happens is that we fall for the feelings that we have. We take them seriously when actually they're just like the thoughts that come into our, that are continually bubbling up in consciousness, they have no real root, but it's like static or fantasy.

[01:11]

And we can easily create a fantasy around some characteristic that we take a dislike to, or where we think people are doing something wrong. And when we come to a place from someplace else, you always, you know, if you go to another zendo and go to Sishin, you'll inevitably think that people are doing things wrong, because every place does something different. The way, you know, when I'm in Berkeley, we do things in a certain way. When I go to San Francisco, it's different. When I go to Tassajara, it's a little bit different. When you go to Green Goats, it's a little bit different. I have to remember how to do everything in four different ways. And I'm really bad at remembering things anyway. So I'm continually having to make this adjustment, you know. But when people go to another place, they don't know how to do it.

[02:19]

They're doing service all wrong. The serving is all wrong. And so we have all these critical comments that come up. So we get kind of caught in small mind. Small mind is continually creating this kind of critical attitude. And we fall for it. And then when we fall for it, we lose our sense of humor. And when we do something, the other side is that it's easy for us to do something wrong. And when we do something a little bit wrong, someone will criticize us. Because there's always someone ready to tell us that we've done something wrong. And it's not necessarily that someone's telling us we did something wrong, but if we're doing something and someone says, no, that's not the way to do it, then we feel criticized.

[03:29]

And during sashim, if someone tells us, no, that's not the way to do it, because of the pressure and the focus, we feel crushed. So these are two sides. One is being crushed, and the other is crushing. And sometimes we're on both sides. Sometimes we're on one side. So we have the problem of right and wrong. So there's a way to do things, wherever we are, there's a way to do things. And when we start enforcing the way to do things, then we start falling into the realm of right and wrong. Rebecca, do you want to say something? No, I just want to take a look at me. So, when we're sitting in Zazen, you know, it's like, this is the unconditioned realm.

[04:47]

This is the realm, the absolute realm, where there's no right and wrong, no good and bad, no way to judge. When we proceed to do something, there's a way to do something correctly and a way to do something incorrectly. So we have right and wrong. So we're operating in these two realms. We're operating in the absolute realm where there's no right or wrong, and we're operating in the relative realm where there's a right way and a wrong way. So this is the existential problem. Usually in our life we are mostly operating in the realm of right and wrong, the realm of differentiation, the realm of comparison.

[05:55]

We rarely think of the realm where actually everything is just as it is, which is the realm of suchness or absolute quality or absolute equality. So in the realm of right and wrong, Either thing is correct or it's incorrect. But in the realm of suchness, everything is just as it is. Not right, not wrong. Not good, not bad. Just as it is. So when we sit sasheen,

[07:05]

we're sitting in the realm of suchness, even though within that suchness there is right-way and wrong-way. So, both exist at the same time. And if you fall into everything is okay, if you fall into the realm of the absolute, where everything is okay, then You can't do things correctly. And if you fall into the realm of the thing is either right or wrong, then you lose your base and you just get caught up in right and wrong. So right in between these two realms, which is one realm. is where our activity takes place, where we have to be very careful.

[08:07]

This is what the Five Ranks is about. This is what Genjo Koan is about. Right here, right in that place is where Genjo Koan arises, moment after moment. So on each moment, we have to deal with the fact that everything is just as it is. And at the same time, there's a right way and a wrong way and a good way and a bad way. And we're right in the middle. So what do you do? This is our co-op, moment after moment. Sometimes it's better to let everything go and just let it be as it is. To suspend judgment, so to speak. And sometimes you have to catch something and make sure that it's done right.

[09:11]

In this realm, I'm always very aware of what everybody's doing. And there's a way to do things and a way to not do things. And I'm very aware of how everybody is either doing something right or not doing something right. And I used to be very critical. I used to be much more critical than I am now, even though you may think I'm critical. You know, whenever I come into the zendo, I always adjust the incense bulbs on the altar, which is can be construed as a kind of criticism. And in a way, it is. It's not a criticism, but it's a... My intent is not to criticize, but to keep things in order.

[10:24]

This is the order. And when I offer incense, I like the incense to be right in front of the Buddha. When I bow, I like to have the mat right in front of the altar. So I have this kind of feeling for alignment. And so I feel that this is the way that I like to have it. So I adjust it that way. And secondarily, I feel that this is the way I'm teaching without saying anything. But the third thing is that it's a kind of criticism. So it's a kind of koan. Is this worth it to criticize somebody? Or somebody may feel criticized by me doing this. Maybe I should just leave it alone, and not say anything.

[11:30]

That would actually be more magnanimous, in a sense. So, when we do things... Actually, most of the time I don't say things. I don't react to what I see not being done. If I reacted to everything I saw that wasn't done correctly, I'd be constantly at people. So more and more I just let things go. And I don't look, even though I see something's not happening, I just don't say anything. I kind of let it go. And I think, well this isn't right to let it go, but on the other hand, the feeling is better if I let it go.

[12:31]

So I kind of opt in favor of the feeling rather than in favor of making it right. So I don't know which is right. Sometimes one is right and sometimes the other is right. So there's no formula for how to act. We have these two polarities between the absolute way, which is just let everything be as it is, and the relative way, which is it's got to be this way. This is the right way. This is the wrong way. So I have to take every situation and decide which way to go with it. But they exist together, and you can't forget the one or the other.

[13:35]

So, one side is... And you can't say which is compassionate, because sometimes being very strict is compassionate. And sometimes letting things go is strictness. But what I find is, more and more, that if I let things go, they take care of themselves. And more and more I trust that by letting things go, they take care of themselves in a certain way. And letting go is a kind of trust.

[14:42]

You know, when we hold on tight to things, it's because usually, or often, we don't trust that things will be taken care of. So we take a very tight rein. But the more that you can trust a situation, the more you can kind of let go of it. And even if things aren't going right in the small sense, in a big sense, they will come around things have a way of cycling or circling around and when they come around again somehow they balance themselves out or upright themselves or something. So I think more and more I trust the big picture that it's not necessary to always adjust every little thing all the time.

[15:49]

But in the process, things will adjust themselves as they come around. And not so much need to worry about things. And not so much need to have so much control. that the Absolute indeed will inform the relative and ask compassionately to take care of these decisions? Well, yeah, because the relative side is an expression of the Absolute side. But they're not two things. But the Absolute side is the foundation. And if you take care of the foundation, then it takes care of, the foundation will take care of its offspring.

[16:55]

Or if you would, the relative from the absolute, not the absolute from the relative. I've noticed that critical thoughts have I notice them right away when I have one. I go, who am I to think this? I'm hardly even close to being one to judge. I'm a baby in this practice. Here I am looking at someone else's ankle. And as soon as that happens, I go, I'm going to jump back. And then I'll be OK. And then a little later on, another one will come. I'm not getting caught up in it. I'm not just going on and on and on. I notice it, and I go, hmm, that's not how it should be.

[18:01]

And I was wondering if you could say something more about why this arises or how this happens. I have the feeling that it's the ego in the wrong place, not in its proper position, which we were talking about before, but I'm not sure. Well, see, I think that often we have our own self-criticism. And if we turn it around, you know, yeah. So in a sense, when we start criticizing, we're really judging ourself in a way. But we use the other as a projection. So we have to be careful, you know. And when we start doing that, we maybe start thinking, well, what is it about me? And it's not necessarily that I'm bad, It's just that I feel inadequate in a lot of ways. So we tend to point out the inadequacies of others rather than look at it in ourselves.

[19:06]

It's not that we don't want to, it's just that there's some blindness. You know, people are just correcting, but we feel not the force of their criticism, but the force of our own self-denigration. Yeah, I think that's right. We feel denigrated when someone corrects us. We feel lowered in some way. You know, in psychoanalysis, the critical faculty is called the super-ego. And the energy that it lives off is aggression.

[20:08]

So it's sort of a vehicle for expressing aggression. Right. And we don't always necessarily think that we have aggression. And aggression can take subtle forms. Especially since it appears to be a sort of justified vehicle for aggression. That's right. See, we have the justification of our position, or the justification of this is the right way, and we're the righteous ones. Self-righteousness is a very aggressive form of self-justification and aggression. And this is one of the... I think in Zen practice, we really have to be careful about self-righteousness. Because, you know, there's a right way to do things, and we try very hard to do things the right way. And when you have a right way of doing things, then you just really get caught by self-righteousness.

[21:14]

And you want people to toe the mark, you know, and blah, blah, blah. And then we get raped. And it's just a vehicle for our aggression. And what I'm finding is that their freedom does allow self-correction. That if I'm allowed to, if I'm told what the goal is and generally how to get there, and I'm free to watch myself and how I do it, that a lot gets smoothed out just with self-correction. And there's a lot less damage to the spirit in the process and a lot less spinning like wheels over what's correct and by doing it and what's going to happen to me and all that.

[22:33]

The energy is more focused. The interesting thing I find about noticing mistakes that others make is that I feel that they're gifts to me because I realize I'm not being mindful about what I'm doing. I'm paying attention to what somebody else is doing. And even though I feel that I make more than enough mistakes in trying to keep to form and everything, it's nice to have these other reminders. That's the other side. That's right. So, we have to be very careful that we don't fall into one side or the other, and that they actually balance each other. On the one hand, it's really good to let, to allow us to find our own way, you know. On the other, we need some reminder. We need some way, some parameters, some reminders, you know, do we do it this way or not this way?

[23:43]

Otherwise, everybody just kind of falls into doing their own thing. If there is a structure, then there's something that you can't work into. But if you lose sight of that, then it's just, we kind of wander around, which is okay, but The main thing is to be able to find complete freedom within the structure or the stricture. The structure is not a cage. It's a space in which to find freedom. And without that structure, you maybe feel free, but actually you're just wandering around. Because freedom takes place within a structure. Even birds have a structure, even though it looks like it is flying arbitrarily around.

[24:45]

I'm not quite sure how to get this. I mean, all of my life I've been a fairly I feel like looking at the aggression, beneath the aggression, there's fear, which is, at a deeper level, the way I feel personally, that's what it is for me. And I'm thinking back of a discussion in the practice committee when we had to discuss a situation in which we were sort of postulating that we were going to have to criticize each other. And it seems to me it's tricky because some people, like you're teaching, and other people are in roles where they're supposed to be actually working with people, teaching them and learning from them.

[25:59]

So it's really interesting to see. I think you need to really check out your fear first before you And I think we have to speak to each other standing in the absolute, standing with a recognition that each of us is complete and that the action is not, any action that's done is not the same as the person who's standing in front of you. So you really have to accept that person and practice kindness. As Suzuki Roshi used to say, we should always be standing in big mind. We should always be coming from big mind. Which means something like, we should always recognize the other as ourself.

[27:07]

And no matter what's going on, between you, you never lose sight of this fact. I don't hear so much, maybe I just missed these talks, but I don't hear so much about another side of this sticking, which is, I really like the way he does his orioke. I really like his feet, or I really like the way he moves, and how that arises in the same way when we're so sensitive here. We get fascinated. Yes. With something. Infatuated. Infatuated or fascinated, yeah, that's the other side. Or fall in love, you know, and I was kind of obsessed with, you know, somebody's

[28:11]

looks, or manners, or body, or something. That goes on all the time. You kind of focus on the types that you like, or that you're attracted to, because you see them all the time. You watch the way they walk, and the way they... Chant. Chant. Open your eyes. And so we create a whole world of fantasy around each other. But it's good to realize that that happens. And that it's just a fantasy. And it's just, at the end, you have to let everything go. You have to let all that fantasy go. And so what we're working with constantly is equanimity.

[29:12]

you know, not letting anything upset us. And fantasies can really upset us, you know. Not only fantasies, but taking in, you know, the criticism, what we think is criticism. Sometimes it's not, there's no criticism intended, but we take it as criticism. And then we have to deal with, well it is, you know, we create our world. So, In a way, this is real life. But in another way, it's like a game. And the way it's like a game is that all of the emotion and feeling and thought and so forth that happens here is just that. And when you leave, you just leave it all. There's no root for any of it. But if you hang on to some resentment or if you hang on to some feeling that you have or idea about things, then that's really getting caught.

[30:20]

Because all the stuff that comes up is just stuff. And in the end, we should let it all return to the big ocean. For me, getting a compliment is almost worse than getting a good sex, as far as it fueling that same, you know, good or bad syndrome. Yeah. Well, sometimes it's hard to take a compliment, you know, what do you do with it? Somebody says, oh, you're wonderful, you know, you did that so well, and you say, well, Thank you. It's hard, but there's a way to do it. There has to be a way to do it. There has to be a way to accept a compliment, you know.

[31:25]

And that's good. One way is to say, thank you for saying so. Yeah, thank you for saying so. Just turn it right back to the other person. Thank you for noticing, or kind to say so. For saying so, I think it's a qualifying factor. Because otherwise, if you take a compliment then you don't want to boost your ego, right? It's like handing somebody a hot potato. So you kind of give it back. Thank you for saying so. Generally, if somebody gives me a compliment, I think, oh, I must have been doing it wrong up until now.

[32:33]

That shows you how our mind works. I think here, I mean, serving is just a perfect way to experience all of this double magnification. It's very wonderful, and it's wonderful to do it in this environment. And I know we fall short and we end up criticizing, and we don't get very happy about it. There are no consequences, whereas out in the world, there may be consequences.

[33:50]

How to take some of this out there. I guess a key is being, having that ground to stand on. That's right. The key is having the ground to stand on and not being attached. Not getting caught by anything. See, we're always getting caught by things. And this is what we can, you know, see in Sashim. You know, how we get caught by all kinds of things, you know. And just to be able to let everything come as it comes and go as it goes. yet take responsibility for what we need to take responsibility for, but without being caught by... It's not things that catch us, you know, it's we catch things. We're not being caught by things, even though we say it in that way, but we catch, you know.

[34:52]

We grab things and we... This is our... discriminating mind, being caught by things. We have to discriminate, but discrimination attaches to things. So, little by little we learn about how to go with things without being caught by things, by our feelings, emotions, and opinions. You know, one key, one way you can practice is to say thank you for everything.

[36:33]

Truly, try it. Whatever happens, whether it's something favorable or something unfavorable, you know, it's a compliment or a criticism. Say, thank you. Thank you. That's all you need to do. This is non-discriminating mind. This is the practice of non-discrimination. And it may go against everything that you believe in about yourself. And it will. Why should I say thank you for that? But you just do it and see what happens. That's how you release yourself. And so someone insults you, you say, thank you very much. But if they're showing me where I get caught, then they are doing it. The main thing is not whether the person is insulting you.

[37:40]

The main thing for you is how you're responding. You know, where are you standing? Because otherwise you become a victim of the world. And this is the way to get your freedom. But they insult me and I just go along placidly. They haven't really done me any favor. I mean, they've never even touched me. Not placidly. Say, thank you. That's not placid. That's accepting, you know. That's accepting this blow. It's like letting it go in without retaliating. Even if... It'll hit you. Okay, it's almost time, but go ahead. Yes, I remember you mentioning about when we spend together like this intensely and we get lifted into each other.

[38:51]

But today, this time about Thursday, when I get home, I just realized how peaceful it's been, considering the number of people. Yeah, that's right. Sharing 15 hours a day. I agree. I think about that. Like, here are all these people, a good number of people in a small space for this kind of long period of time, all under control. You know, all controlling themselves. Where was this?

[39:59]

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