Today Micheline and Christiana were nice enough to get us a pass to this Kirchentag. Christiana und Micheline, die waren also so nett und haben uns für heute eine Tageskarte besorgt für den Kirchentag. So we saw and we were able to get in somehow and see His Holiness the Dalai Lama give a talk. And you were both there. Yeah. And I haven't seen him for some years, so it was quite nice for me to see him again. And the title given to this seminar is the great meaning of living Buddhism.

[01:03]

It's a line from a koan we will look at to some extent during the weekend. But it's rather long, tiresome to read koan. So I'll actually probably not expect you to read it, but I'll take some parts of it and we'll use them in our practice. But Christian is coming as he has to every seminar this year. And he's bringing a German translation of the koan.

[02:31]

But I don't think you'll get here until later this evening. But so it doesn't confuse you, I don't think I'll pass it out until Sunday night, maybe. And then you can use it, see if it makes any sense after the seminar. But you know, when I went to this talk, Even though I love the... It seems funny to say I love his holiness. But I know him moderately well and I have a deep affection for him. So I went there feeling... A little bit sorry for him, actually.

[03:51]

Because I thought, boy, am I glad I don't have to go and talk to a huge convention in the middle of Munich about something. And now he's so famous and he has such a major political and peacemaking role in the world. That he has to go and does go from city to city much of the year all over the world. And it's very common that he speaks to the rotary club in a city. So I thought, my goodness, I felt, again, I felt sorry for him that he had to do this, and what would he do? But he was great. He's like a big chipmunk.

[05:11]

And he kind of looked at her, but he was just as angry. You can translate that. She won't call His Holiness a chipmunk. You're not translating that? It's not a pun on monk. But he had a wonderful physical presence in the room. And I think he probably made most people feel... very easy with him or familiar. At one point Ulrike said, it's like if we're having coffee or tea with him.

[06:15]

And when You went to get the day pass, is that right? You said that all of these people were, because it's organized by Protestants. We're speaking about his holiness. I don't think there's any Protestants who are called His Holiness, are there? So it's interesting to see that this person affects people independent of whether he's a Buddhist or not. Or perhaps we should say independent of whether he's a Protestant or a Christian or not.

[07:30]

So maybe he's independent being a Protestant or a Christian or a Buddhist because he's a Buddhist. And a couple of weeks ago, we were at Thich Nhat Hanh's retreat. And Ulrike translated for Thich Nhat Hanh. And I think Thay also has, he's called Thay, often it means teacher. Thay also has this quality of you feel quite familiar and at ease with him right away. No, we couldn't stay for... We stayed till nearly five, I guess, but we couldn't stay for all the questions.

[08:54]

But there was a point when they allowed people in the audience to write questions and pass them up. And of course they get many, many pieces of paper. And they said that a large percentage of the questions dealt with if Let me start over again. His Holiness spoke about the goal of everyone's life really is happiness. The qualities of our life are often based on hope, And hope is based on some kind of desire for a greater happiness.

[10:03]

And he thought that really our basic nature is... is not aggressive but affectionate or compassionate. So naturally, quite a lot of questions were about this. And this came up at Thich Nhat Hanh's seminar too because he asked people to consider taking the precepts and he presents them in a fairly strict way. And people resist the idea in the groups we met in, people resist the idea that we're always happy or always smiling or always gentle and so on.

[11:12]

And so people asked questions about, isn't it natural for the baby to be aggressive toward the mother? And if the basic human nature is compassionate and so forth, why is there so much suffering and horrible things in the world? And these are not easy questions to respond to. And the Dalai, His Holiness, talked with this young man who is a Western monk, was translating back and forth and explaining what was being said in German to His Holiness.

[12:36]

And it was interesting to see, too, that he didn't just have some pat answer. It took a while. Everybody had to wait while he was being translated, and Helenus was pondering what to say. And it was so nice to see that he didn't have any pre-made answers, but that the translation went back and forth, and he thought about it, and you could see how he thought about it. The basic question was how did evil, how does evil come into the world? Yeah. As Ulrike says, one aspect of the question was where does evil fit in and so forth. And he said, well, if you think of evil as coming from Satan, well, he said, I don't know anything about Satan. Well, there's actually no easy way to answer this kind of question.

[13:46]

We have this question that is the title of this seminar, The Great Meaning of Living Buddhism. And we could say, what is the great meaning of your life? But it's pretty difficult to ask yourself a question like, what's the meaning of your life, the great meaning of your life? I think it's good to ask such a question, but we need some way to ask it, to ask ourselves such a question. And Buddhism is a way to be able to look at ourselves. Mm-hmm. So one of the ideas in Buddhism is that everyone's already enlightened.

[15:42]

Or that our essential nature is always present. And if that's so, why are we Did you drive? Came by train. If that's so, why are we estranged from it? So this weekend I'll try to look at this koan. And how Buddhism and Zen Buddhism can be used as a way of looking at yourself. And how in a sense it's possible to tune into compassion.

[16:50]

Or tune in to yourself. Almost as if you were changing stations. Yeah. Let me ask, does anyone not have any experience with meditations? Yeah, so you need some instruction or something like that. Okay. Yeah. Okay. And so we have to figure out a schedule for tomorrow. Okay. I think getting around in the city starting at 10 o'clock is probably good, don't you think? And I guess this restaurant, if you like eating with horses, will be open tomorrow?

[18:14]

And there's other restaurants in the neighborhood? so we can have lunch in the neighborhood so and we'll go till about five or six in the afternoon and how many of you were at the talk I gave last night Quite a few of you, yeah. Because some of that I'd like to go over with you, but I don't wanna have to find a new way to talk about it, so I don't bore those of you who've heard me already.

[19:19]

Because the most, what I talked about last night was this phrase from the koan we looked at last weekend. That great peace has no sign. And I tried to take that phrase and open it up so you can see how that's very particularly Buddhist. Now, one of the things His Holiness spoke about, by the way, let me say, I always call him His Holiness. You may find that funny. I could call him HH maybe. But I really believe that practicing respect is important.

[20:29]

So this is a title given to him, respect, so I just always call him His Holiness. But it's kind of complicated if you ask him if he wants a cup of coffee or tea. Well, Your Holiness, would you like a cup of tea? Anyway, one of the things he said was that we're not born Christians or Buddhists or Muslims. Yeah. But we're born wanting affection from our mother and our father. So he was presenting Buddhism as really a whole kind of teaching that in the end It brings you to the point of realizing affection from not only your mother and father, but from each person.

[21:52]

And in this sense, Buddhism disappears. So I'm speaking about Buddhism and Buddhist practice, but I'm also speaking about it in a way that I hope it disappears. He also said when he was young, living in Tibet, which is rather remote, as we all know, He read about other religions. And I think what he was saying was that reading about it and living there, he felt, well, they're interesting, but Buddhism is better. Then he said, through actually knowing Christians, and he mentioned Thomas Merton's name, and he said, now I've come to know that Buddhism is best for me.

[23:14]

But it's not best for everybody. So anyway, seeing him today makes me think about what we're doing here. And So again, I'll be talking about Buddhism this weekend, but in a way that I, again, hope it disappears. And wondering with you how we as Westerners take on a teaching like Buddhism. What shapes your, as I would say, lived body? The body that your culture, your psychology, your personal history has given you. And this body that is your lived body, which is not the same as your physical body, is shaped by how you perceive

[24:49]

what attitudes you have, what practices you follow. So the question you're asking yourselves by coming here is, do I want to shape my lived body with Buddhist teachings? And will I do any irreversible damage Can I stop at some point? I think for the most part, one can practice meditation and hear Buddhist teachings, mostly whether you're Christian or Buddhist or whatever, beneficially. What does it mean to try on, this is what we're doing, trying on Buddhism? Having our lived body try on Buddhism.

[26:28]

What is the great meaning, this question of living Buddhism? And how do we bring our mind and body to a First, so that our mind and body talk to each other. How do we bring our mind and body to a point that it, how can I say it, that it's a focus in the world? That you feel your mind and body in focus. And it's a tangible feeling by which you focus the world. We have in our culture the idea of the birth of language as a metaphor for the ordering of the world.

[27:58]

And most of us order the world through language. We order our perceptions, everything really through language. And practice is a way to find another way to order your world. And if you could find a way to order your world, that wasn't through language, then you would have discovered the living meaning of Buddhism. And then you could drop Buddhism. And going back to feeling the affection of your mother or father or friend. So we started it.

[29:04]

Seven about. It's now eight. Maybe we'll take a little break. And the two or three people who want some meditation instruction, you can ask. I'll speak to those people here if you want for a while. Anyone else can participate if you want, but at least those few people. And there's a couple toilets, right? Okay, then we'll start again in about 15 minutes or something, just for a little while, and then we'll end for the day. Okay, thank you very much. Well, the basic posture is to sit in a way that your back can be easily straight.

[30:33]

So you want to put a... a pillow underneath you so that your back can be easily straight. And it's better as a beginner to start with a high cushion and then work your way down as your legs get more flexible. Can you hear okay over here? You can also sit this way. Or you can put a cushion under yourself like that. And if you plan to sit along, if sitting becomes something, a practice that's just part of your life, it's better to learn to sit cross-legged.

[31:50]

But if you sit, you know, occasionally you're not so sure, this is quite a good way to sit. And it's a good way to sit because it allows your back to be straight easily. And any of you have eaten in a Japanese restaurant know, traditionally, that they've based their whole culture on this posture. And that's worth thinking about a little bit, that a culture bases its architecture, clothes, everything on a posture. And that's worth thinking about a little bit, that a culture bases its architecture, clothes, everything on a posture. That suggests that posture means a lot more in Asian cultures than it does now.

[33:03]

And one of the reasons we sit this way with our legs crossed And you can sit either way with either foot up. It depends on whichever you find easier to do. Or you can sit with both feet up if you're more flexible than I am. And the reason we sit this way is really the same reason that we have our back straight. Because the posture is really about how your energy works. And you're much more likely to touch your energy or touch your energy body if your back is straight.

[34:20]

And your body's heat and energy are closely related. So we fold our legs together not only because it's a more stable posture, but also because it folds your heat together. And for the same reason you put your hands together. And you can put them together any way you want, but usually the traditional posture is left hand on top and thumbs lightly touching the oval. And on the one hand, the exactness of the posture in Zen especially is quite important.

[35:34]

And why the exactness is important becomes clearer later on. But at the same time, everyone has their own posture. And you don't want to force yourself. So on the one hand, there's a dialogue between a kind of ideal posture and your posture. And so the idea is not to sit rigidly or some imaginary posture, but rather You sit the best you can and relax. So we sit with a lifting feeling through our back.

[36:37]

And a lifting feeling through the back of the neck. And then you let a kind of relaxation come down through you, a feeling of something melting down through you. And then you bring your attention to your breath. So what I've spoken about so far is outer posture. But when you start bringing your attention to your breath, you're developing a kind of inner posture. You're actually making a first step toward educating and opening an interior consciousness. Not something our culture emphasizes much. But through sitting still and finding out how to sit still, You develop, you build a kind of emotional and physical confidence that you can sit through mental and emotional disturbances.

[38:05]

So when you sit, you try to sit for some period of time, 10 minutes, 15 minutes, and then if you have to move, you move a little, but then you sit still again. And again, without forcing it, you bring your attention to your breath. Usually counting your exhales. And then the other things we'll talk about this weekend are really other teachings that affect your inner posture. Or your inner reality or inner consciousness. And how that joins you, joins you, joins you in the world. And with the world. See, that's enough. So basically, you just try to sit with your back straight and sit comfortably.

[39:39]

If you can do both at once, it's good. So if you can find a little ease in yourself in the sitting. Maybe you should mention the eyes. Hung at the roof of the mouth. It actually joins energy in your body. And this meditation is not waking and it's not sleeping. So you don't want your eyes to either remind you of sleep or remind you too much of waking consciousness. So generally you have your eyes a little bit open, just enough to lie in, but you're not enough to start conceptual consciousness going.

[40:40]

And not closed enough to start dream consciousness. Anything else I forgot? Okay. You didn't get a break, so now I... I didn't have a break, that's why I'm still here. So we spoke about meditation posture with more than four people. And I'm told by Christiana that quite a few of you are fairly new to this world.

[41:46]

So it helps me to have some questions or some comments from you. And I think it helps everyone because we need to find a way to get some orientation in this kind of world. And realistic questions do that. So if you have any... Who did you get into Buddhism at first? Me? Yes. Yeah, I don't know if it's useful to anybody, but it's my grandfather told me when I was about four that if you get up early enough, you could see the squiggle mumsy swallow itself.

[43:06]

He was such a nice guy, my grandfather. That I believed him. So I've been getting up early ever since. I mean, that's kind of a silly answer. But there's some truth to it. That I had some feeling from when I was very young that there must be some way to enter into this life with a sense of knowing. I had a kind of faith that if we're alive, there must be a way to be alive. So in a sense, I was always asking myself, what is existence?

[44:21]

And then I ran into, ran into, fell into, Actually through reading the poetry of Ezra Pound. My 14-year-old daughter called me up the other day and said, I hear you know something about Ezra Pound. I have to write a paper on it. Will you help me? So I thought it was great that I felt wonderful talking to her about Ezra Pound. But anyway, around 1920, I found a teaching which said, asked, what is existence? Which says, you can't say there's existence.

[45:35]

That's wrong to say, it's not quite right to say existence. But you can't say, well, non-existence. Non-existence isn't quite right either. So you can say neither existence nor non-existence. Or you can say both. So Buddhism says you can't find your life in these categories. So it was very interesting to me to find a teaching which said you cannot find your existence in any categories.

[46:36]

So this practice is how to find your existence life, your own existence, outside of categories. And it engages your body, your breath, your perceptions, your thinking. And more subtle states of mind, they don't fall into the category of thinking. So last night I spoke about again this phrase from this other koan, great peace has no sign. And I've talked about the difference between naming or labeling permanence. In contrast to naming or labeling impermanence.

[47:48]

And how this beginning to practice or notice impermanence opens us up to a subtlety in our life. And I think that last night I found a way to speak about this, which is almost as simple as giving instruction in breath practice. And breath practice is the very beginning of Buddhist practice. And yet awakening the subtle body or realizing a subtle body is the most advanced part of Zen practice. But there are also two sides of one door.

[49:03]

So I, anyway, saw the door of Buddhism when I was, I don't know, 19 or so. And I've been opening the door ever since. And I'm still on the threshold. But I invite you all to join me on the threshold. So thank you for your question. Some other question? Yes?

[50:04]

When you said you did not close your eyes totally, you just had them just close them a little bit and see a little bit. Do you want to say that in German, Jim? Well, just try it. And it's, you know, if your eyes are closed sometimes, it's okay. Mine are closed sometimes. But there's a certain Zen practice asks, Zen is a form of Buddhism developed by the Chinese that tried to bring all the Indian teachings and the various schools of Buddhism

[51:45]

Together in a, including Vipassana and Samatha, together in a single way of sitting meditation. And a particular way to use language in practice. And so the posture is characterized by, in every aspect, doing it in such a way that a certain amount of attention is brought to your posture, but at the same time in such a way that relaxation is possible. And if you feel that, you can understand most of the ways in which Zen does things.

[52:47]

So when we do walking meditation, Some people can be very rather quite formal or even rigid. Or you can be quite relaxed in the way you put your hands. But generally you put your hands in a fairly relaxed way, but then you turn them slightly, which brings a certain attention. Again, Zen practice and Buddhist practice is not based on waking mind. Nor is it based on sleeping mind.

[54:01]

It's based on a kind of mind that includes both. It's an adult capacity for wisdom. that you can realize through mindfulness practice and meditation practice, and which you discover in many ways, physically and mentally, is always present with you anyway. So your eyes are neither in the sleeping position, as I said, nor the waking position. So there's a certain effort to have your eyes a little bit open, but not open enough to start conceptual thought or borrowed consciousness. But not so closed that you drift into dream sleep.

[55:19]

So if you have that feeling, it's okay if they're closed. Or open. Or closed with a feeling of light coming through your lids. The important thing is you're talking to yourself with your eye posture. Does that make sense? That when you take a posture, you're talking to yourself. But you're talking to yourself through your body.

[56:20]

Okay? Thank you. By the way, it's really a pleasure to be back in this festive city of Munich, now full of rain. Yes, by the way, it is really a pleasure to be in this festive city of Munich, even in the middle of the rain. Yes? Can you say something about time? Krishnamurti, for example, says that psychological time is Egyptian. So perhaps it belongs to the living body. Is time existing yet? How does a Buddhist experience time? Could you say something about time? Krishnamurti says that the psychological time is a kind of deception. How do Buddhists experience time now? I remember driving in a car with Suzuki Roshi, my teacher.

[57:34]

And I said to him, having come through a long time of practice in the details of things, And really feeling the spatial dimension of existence. So I said to him, I was driving and I said to him, time doesn't exist. He said, yes, it does. He may have been commenting on my getting him to where we're supposed to go on time. But I was quite convinced that time didn't exist. So he's saying, yes, it does throw me into a whole deeper examination practice.

[58:49]

And maybe we can come back to this tomorrow. When we have time. Does time have you or do you have time? Yes, Julia. He always has a question so I can just ask. I wonder when I let go of breath and I have a feeling I can let it go, but I still have a feeling that it's not enough, the breathing that's going on.

[59:58]

I mean, I know that it's enough because I don't think, but I have the feeling... You're not getting enough air. Yes. So when you let... Do you want to say that in German? Yeah. So what's letting go of your breathing? Yeah. Well, obviously something's still holding on to your breathing. From where you're letting go of your breathing, you're not really fully letting go. So you have to go back into your breathing, inside your breathing. And let go from inside your breathing.

[61:00]

You're letting go from outside your breathing. Your breathing has a mind of its own. We say in English, I don't know if it translates into German, something has a mind of its own. But you'll find out in practice that every part of your body, virtually every molecule, has a mind of its own. And practice is partly just to start having an agreeable relationship to the many parts of yourself. And it's possible. But one of the problems with us contemporary people is that we have so little faith that happiness is possible. We have so little faith that we can't even, that a question like the meaning of existence sounds silly.

[62:21]

What sounds like something you think about in college and forget about afterwards. Or something that you think about in school and then forget as soon as possible. How does the faith come? Maybe one of the reasons is that this practice comes from another culture, from an Asian culture. And my question is why is it so different here? In our culture.

[63:39]

It's quite different. And I think right now, for this evening, it's just good enough to say it's different. But we're very lucky that there is Buddhism. Because Buddhism is a language in a larger sense than just words. That can speak to anyone born of mother's love or lack of love. So anyway, what we'll try to do is, what I'd like to do is sort of get a little bit, discover a little bit of this language of entering into our own existence.

[64:52]

And I don't just mean words. This koan says, wisdom is like a great mass of fire. And can't be entered from any side. It also says wisdom is like a deep, clear pool. And can be entered from any side. It's a funny way to describe things. Why would they describe things this way? How are you going to enter this question of the meaning of our existence and your own existence?

[66:00]

There are some doors. So I hope we can locate them. So we don't have a rainstorm to listen to right now if we meditate for a few minutes. We have wet tires on the highway, on the road to listen to. Mm-hmm. And I don't mean you're supposed to listen to things while you're meditating. But don't close your ears either. Now that you've all had some instruction, meditation should be easier.

[68:13]

And I'd like you to feel free tomorrow to, for those of you who are new, to ask me very basic questions. That's fine. Because if you understand any of the basic points of Zen, all of Buddhism opens up from those basic points. Denn wenn ihr nur irgendeinen grundlegenden Punkt in Zen versteht, dann werden von da aus sich alle anderen Zugänge öffnen. Ahem.

[69:59]

Ahem. That's good.

[72:45]

Guten Morgen. Guten Morgen. And Ulrike is here. Ulrike is here. And Christiana and Michelin and the München Sitting Group are here and helped organize this, or did organize this. Yeah, and I'm here. And we come here, of course, to... really probably mostly to remind ourselves about practice. But also more and more I think we come to enjoy each other's dharma.

[74:25]

And there's quite a few new people new to the Dharma Sangha, at least in this seminar. So, So we have to find out, I have to find out a way to speak about practice that also initiates or brings into practice the newer people here. And we have a new room, more easy to be in I think than the room we had last year. And so far we have cool weather, so the conditions are perfect for practicing today. Yesterday, for about a third of you, I guess, we went through the basic zazen instructions, meditation posture.

[76:11]

Hmm. And of course I spoke about that you bring your mind to your breathing. And this we should be, we have to, I still have to remind myself about. It becomes a habit after a while that you mostly reside in your breath, or as I say, your breath body. But even when it's a habit, it's good to remind yourself fairly often during the day, ah, my breath. So you're shifting, again, your attention.

[77:24]

You're using attention to shift your attention away from conceptual thoughts. And the easiest thing to shift your attention away from conceptual thought is to your breath because it begins to dimension interior consciousness. But for the sake of this koan that we are going to look at, I want to speak a little bit, I want to speak about shifting your breath, shifting your attention, not just to your inhale and your exhale.

[78:50]

Because your breath is, when you bring your attention to your breath, your breath sort of, what can I say, Normally, your attention sticks to your conceptual thought. In other words, there's a certain stickiness to attention. So when you Get in the habit of bringing your attention to your thought. You're unsticking it from conceptual thought and sticking it to your breath. You mean when you have to help it to bring it to the breath?

[79:57]

Yeah. And sometimes it will unstick with a big snap. And sometimes it will unstick with a big snap. And you'll have a little Kensho, a little enlightenment experience. And you'll feel quite free. And relieved inside very deeply. You know, enlightenment isn't such a big deal. It's that simple. And there's various kinds of enlightenment. This is an important enlightenment.

[80:59]

Sometimes it happens so little, like when you pull a doctor's adhesive tape, bandage, off very slowly. It only pulls out one hair at a time. You hardly notice, if you're careful and slow enough, you hardly notice when it's off. But it's off and you see you're healed and still you have some freedom. But sometimes, according to circumstances and how you practice, it comes off at once. And then you immediately feel, directly feel some freedom rushes in. So this is a very important practice, just a simple thing, very simple thing, of unsticking your attention from your conceptual thought.

[82:25]

But then you're What you do is you stick your attention to your inhale and your exhale. This is a definite improvement. And if you do nothing else the rest of your life, you'll be considered at least a minor adept. And if you're relaxed and a sweet person, you might even be considered a major adept. But what you're considered really isn't very important. Now, sometimes, so I want to use this idea of stickiness a little bit to talk about breathing practice in a different way.

[83:48]

So when you bring your attention away from conceptual thought to your breath, And you're shaping your attention. First, your attention is shaped by conceptual thought, identified with conceptual thought. Und die erste Formung der Aufmerksamkeit geschieht durch begriffliches Denken, damit dass man sie mit dem Denken identifiziert. Now, do you see that? Könnt ihr das sehen? That attention is attention and consciousness, or consciousness turns into attention.

[84:51]

Dass Aufmerksamkeit und Bewusstsein und das Bewusstsein selbst sich wieder in Aufmerksamkeit verwandelt. And is shaped by the objects of thought. And those objects of thought are usually considered to be outside ourselves or to be some kind of real entity. Now, as I said the other night, Usually we name things that are going to be around for a while. We name mountains, trees, U-Bahn stations. So I'll meet you at the U-Bahn station where those trees are. So what we're doing here is naming permanence.

[86:08]

And you get into the habit, if this is what you do all the time, is name permanence, you get in the habit of conveying your lived body to permanence. Now, I'm using some terms here, lived body and last night borrowed consciousness. And what I'd like to do after the break is have you gather in maybe four or five groups with some of the older people in the groups, each group. Senior, I mean, not older like me. And I'd like you to be available to kind of discuss together what some of these things mean.

[87:31]

Because some of the vocabulary of this differently dimensioned world is very helpful. And I'd like to depend on some of you more experienced people to help me with getting everybody familiar with some of this stuff. Now, when I say differently dimensioned world, I mean, for example, if you think that some things change and some things are permanent, And you have a habit of thinking that way.

[88:50]

You'll actually live after months and certainly years, you'll end up living in quite a different world than a person who thinks everything changes and nothing is permanent. it will look exactly the same more or less, but it's quite different. And if you only know one or the other, you won't be able to see how different the other person's world is. So our world is always dimensioned by our views and by our habits of perception. So when you, again, going back to the stickiness of attention, when you, normally we name things because they're going to be around.

[90:19]

In other words, we're naming things into permanence. Now, the difference in Buddhist practice, when in a sense you're pulling Buddhist clothes onto your lid body, Wenn ihr sozusagen buddhistische Kleider heranzieht und damit euren gelebten Körper bekleidet. And the question here is in this koan is what is the meaning of living Buddhism? Und die Frage in diesem koan ist ja noch einmal was ist die Bedeutung von lebendem Buddhismus? So what I'm trying to point out is here in this koan is pointing out is that Buddhism is a definite set of clothes. And it's different than putting on other clothes. And you have to decide whether you want to put these Buddhist clothes on or not. Now, they're not armor.

[91:49]

And they're not permanent. You can take them back off again. And part of the teaching is how to put them on and how to take them off. But we're all born, as His Holiness said yesterday, we're all born in wanting our mother's love and our father's love. And there's no religion at this point. So the question is, what clothes do you put on the baby after that? And The way you shape that baby's lived body will come completely from the way your own lived body is shaped.

[92:56]

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