It says, a monk comes and says to his teacher, what do you do in the immobile position of Zazen when they're sitting there with that movie? And he says, I think not thinking. And then the monk says, how do you think not thinking? And the teacher says, non-thinking. Or Ucchialna Ruchi says, beyond thinking. That's your translation. I thought it was Belgian. He, well, fu shiryō and shiryō, both negation of shiryō. Shiryō is thinking. And I think fu, both fu and he, both negate thinking. But in the case of fu, I think negate verb. So in the case of fu shiryō, that is not thinking, don't think.

[01:05]

So it negates action. This is a verb. So in the case of fushiryō, shiryō is a verb. And hi, I think, negates noun. So in that case, in the case of hishiryō, this shiryō or thinking is noun. Do you understand? So, think and not thinking are kind of corresponding each other. Saying you think, you cannot, you know, you are thinking. So, thinking and not thinking cannot get together. If you're not thinking, you cannot think. And if you are thinking, you cannot do not thinking. So these two are corresponding each other, think and not thinking. And think or not thinking is that those two things get together. I think, but I don't think.

[02:09]

How can we get those two things together? In an ordinary way of thinking, it's not possible, because it's against our way of thinking. Our way of thinking is logic, and logic doesn't like contradiction. So, you know, in our ordinary way of thinking, that means logical thinking, way of thinking, thinking or think and not thinking can't get together. But somehow in our Zazen, they are both there. you know, we cannot stop thinking. And yet, if we think, it's not our Zazen. So, think and not think, or think of not thinking, is possible in our Zazen, only in our Zazen. by letting go of thought.

[03:13]

We don't think thought come up. Even though thought come up, we don't think. So thinking and not thinking are there, both there, only in our zazen. When we stand up from zazen and do something else, we have to grasp something some idea I have to think and make choice when we make choice we are you know following our thinking but only in our then you know we sit in this posture and breathe from our abdomen and what we do is just let go just let go, just let, you know, all the thinking or feeling, emotion or whatever, you know, come up. We don't control them. We don't try to get rid of them. But thinking are always coming up. But we, you know, open our hand.

[04:14]

We don't think. Even though we don't think, thoughts come up, you know. That is our Zazen. So I think only in our Zazen, you know, think of not thinking is possible. And what Dogen Zenji is saying is, you know, this, you know, think of not thinking, things happening inside of ourselves in our Zazen is basically not thinking, or hisshiryo, or so. For me, not thinking or non-thinking doesn't make sense or doesn't work in this case, so I translate this as beyond thinking. That means both thinking and not thinking are taking place on the ground of beyond thinking. That means this is not a matter of I think or I don't think. According to Uchida Maroshi's expression, that's the scenery of our life.

[05:20]

Somehow it's happening. So we don't negate anything, and we don't cling or grasp anything, but just keep, you know, open our hands. Our natural life force, which is connected with all beings, this whole universe, is working through this body and mind. So our zazen is not private, individual, personal action. But we, how can I say, we merge into the universal movement of life. So we don't sit in zazen based on our desire, our personal reasons. Of course, when we start to sit or start to practice or start to study Buddhist teaching, there are some parts, you know, individual

[06:26]

motivation or reasons. Often we have problems or difficulties, so we try to find some better way of life. That is how we start to practice. And we call that is, you know, Allowing the Body-Mind. But actually that body-mind, that kind of body-mind is in a sense an obstacle to really practice in accordance with Buddha's teaching or Buddha Dharma, because that is still our ego. The desire, even we call it aspiration, to make ourselves better or to find a better way to live, that is still personal, individual desire. Even though the object of desire is enlightenment or a better way of life or being free from egocentric, still this idea came out of ego.

[07:33]

So somehow we have to work with this aspiration itself. And when we really sit, we have to, you know, open our hands. Even, you know, we cannot grasp this, you know, aspiration or motivation to sit or practice. Otherwise, you know, our practice doesn't become personal, you know, way to improve this person. And if we practice in that way, that is not the Buddha way, that is us. So when we sit, we have to even open our hand. We shouldn't cling to our, you know, motivation to sit or to practice or to become enlightened or even to become Buddha. That is why Dogen Zenji said in Kwanzaa Zenki, when we sit, we should give up even the aspiration to become Buddha.

[08:46]

When we really open our hand, that means surrender. Then Buddha nature or interpenetrating, total interpenetrating work, according to Dogen's expression, starts to work through this individual body and mind. that this is my understanding of think of not thinking. How do you think of not thinking beyond thinking? Does that make sense? How do you talk to people who have obsessive thinking? Pardon me? Obsessive? Obsessive thinking. What does obsessive mean? Repeat it again and again. addictive thinking? Well, I think all of us are addicted to thinking. Some people feel they cannot get a thought out of their mind.

[09:51]

Over and over and over. Me too. So, you know, it's really difficult to, you know, open our hands. And even when we open our hands, it comes up somehow. So as far as we are, we struggle to open our hand. We cannot open our hand. It's really difficult to explain. But somehow what we should do in our zazen is don't struggle with thinking. Don't care for thinking, but what we have to care is to keep our, you know, upright posture and breathing. So Uchama Roshi often said, we do Zazen, not only Uchama Roshi, but Dogen Zenji also said, we do Zazen with our body, not our mind. So our Zazen is not a method to calm down our mind.

[10:56]

We don't control our mind. And it's really difficult. some almost always, you know, our motivation to sit to calm down our mind. Because we think, you know, mind, you know, creates many troubles and stress. So if we, you know, calm down or pacify our mind, you know, then we feel we get something. We have some kind of, you know, award and sitting is worth to do. But this is a famous koan between Bodhidharma and second ancestor. Second ancestor asked Bodhidharma, my mind is busy, how can I pacify my mind? And Bodhidharma said, you know, bring your mind here. Then I would pacify. Then a second ancestor said, I tried to find out my mind, but I cannot find it.

[12:08]

Then Bodhidharma said, I have pacified your mind. That means we can't really grasp or control our mind. There's no such things called mind. Mind is just a flowing stream of our consciousness. There's no way to stop it or control it. But by sitting in upright posture and breathing through abdomen and let go everything. That means leave everything to this posture and breathing and actually our life force. So Dogen Zen said in the Monkey that as far as we try to grasp Buddha Dharma or understand Buddha Dharma with our mind, there's no time we can get it.

[13:14]

But our Zen should be done with our body, not mind. And Uchamaro also often said, our zazen is done with our flesh and bone, not mind. And when we really, you know, sitting with body and mind, body, and try not to control our mind, you know, when we try to control our mind, you know, this side, which try to control, and that side, which should be controlled, is the same thing. And, you know, that means, you know, the more we try to control, the more it starts to, you know, become a kind of a violet or a powerful thing. So, as far as there is a kind of separation between subject and object, the mind which tries to control the mind, and the mind which should be controlled,

[14:28]

is separate, there's no way we can, our mind become pacified, become peaceful. Because there's two, and we have always struggle, you know. I want to keep, you know, I want to pacify our mind. And I'm looking out, my mind looking, you know, watching my mind. And when something happened, we said, no, it's not peaceful. So mind is watching the mind itself and always saying, you know, you are not good boy. You are always, you know, doing something bad. then, you know, this conflict or struggle has really no end. Or when, you know, our mind, when we try to our mind, our mind become more, you know, how can I say, kind of a resistance like a, you know, baby or a kid.

[15:42]

When we try to, you know, Three or five years old kids try to make peaceful or quiet. My son is now five years old. When we tell him to be quiet, he becomes much, much noisier. He doesn't want to be controlled. And our mind is pretty much the same. We are so childish. When we hear, you know, we are being forced to be quiet, we try to say something. No, I don't. So, how can I say? The only way to be friendly with our own mind is to open our hands. And I think Suzuki Roshi said in the book, The Mind and Beginner's Mind, the best way to pacify your mind is to put your mind in the middle, not in a small hut.

[16:54]

So our sitting is putting our mind in the middle, the boundaries. then the mind can run around peacefully or joyfully. What are the boundaries of the metal? When we create a boundary, then we think, you know, this is good behave or bad behave. Our mind shouldn't be in this way or that way. So in our Zazen, I think only in our Zazen, we can take out those boundaries. In our daily lives, you know, it's dangerous if we take out the boundaries. We need boundaries in our daily lives. That means we have to think what is good to behave, what is not good to behave, what we should do and what we should not do.

[18:01]

So we have to think in our daily lives. But in our Dazen we don't need to think what we should be and what we should not be. Of course, zazen means to sit in upright posture and make no noise. So in that sense, there are some boundaries, because we practice together with other people. But within our mind, there are no boundaries in our zazen, I think. Okay? Should we create a boundary here? We'll take maybe a tea or coffee break. Tea break. In the room next door. And then we'll do a little bell to get you back.

[19:07]

Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Good morning, everyone. I'm really happy to be here again and to have a chance to study Dogen Zenji's Genjo Koan with all of you. Since Catherine asked me to talk something about Genjo Koan, I have been thinking how I can present it.

[20:10]

There are so many, several different ways. You know, Dogen Zenji wrote this chapter of Shobo Genzo when he was 33 years old. And one year before his death, it seems he made decision to put this Genjo Koan, you know, the very first chapter of whole Shobo Genzo. There are different discussions about that, but it seems so. So this is one of the most important chapter or writings of Dogen Zenji. And this is one of the most well-known writings of Dogen Zenji, both in Japan and also in this country.

[21:14]

So there are many commentaries. and translations in English. So one of the interesting way to study Genjo Koan is to compare those commentaries and translations. But I don't think we have enough time to do so. If we try to do so, only discuss or study about the title of Genjo Koan, it takes one day, I think. So, now I am thinking to talk about my own understanding of Genjo Koan. You know, first I read Genjō Kōan and commentary, I think by Deirin Yamada Roshi, when I was a high school student.

[22:19]

I think I was 16 or 17 years old, and I couldn't understand almost at all. I think the one sentence that to study or to practice Buddha way is to study yourself. This, you know, one single sentence was very impressive for me. But I couldn't really understand at all the rest of the, you know, of Genjūkō-an. And I studied Buddhism and Dogen's teaching at Komazawa University. Komazawa is a soto university. And also I was ordained as a Uchiha Mono, she's a disciple when I was 22 years old. Since then, you know, I have been studying in Genjo Koan and also practicing Zazen according to Dogen Zen's teaching in Genjo Koan.

[23:29]

And so I studied at Genjō Kōan at the university after I first read Genjō Kōan when I was a high school student. And I have been trying to deepen my understanding of Genjō Kōan. I wanted to translate Uchiha Maroshi's teisho or commentary on Genjō-kōan. In order to translate, I need to really have a clear understanding. You know, I cannot translate what I don't understand. So I tried to really and deeply understand Genjō-kōan. So I tried to read as many commentaries as possible. The first commentary on Genjo Koan was written by Dogen Zenji's direct disciple, whose name was Senne, and his disciple, Kyogo,

[24:48]

together wrote a commentary, and that commentary was called Gosho. And this is still, even today, I think this commentary has the most authority. And I studied Gosho, and there are many other commentaries made by sort of the masters in the 17th century. After Gosho, almost three or four hundred years, no one made commentary on Shobo Genzo. But after the 17th century, that means after the Tokugawa period, many sotos and masters made commentary on Shobo Genzo. And Genjō-kōan was the first chapter, so there are so many commentaries on Genjō-kōan by many different teachers.

[25:59]

And in modern times, in this century, since Genjo Kōan was one of the most well-known writings of Dōgen, so there are so many commentaries and books on Genjo Kōan. not only Zen teachers, but also, you know, philosophers, Japanese philosophers, and even novelists or poets made a commentary on Kenjo Koan. So there are so many books. And to me, for me, Gosho, the first oldest commentary by Dogen's direct disciple, Sen'en and Kyogo, and my teachers, Uchiyama Kosho Roshi's commentary on Genjo Koan is, how can I say, guideline. because my practice is based on their teachings.

[27:06]

So my understanding of Dogen Zenji's teachings is also based on those teachings. And I think two years ago, I, we had, we studied Genjo Koan, Buddhist study at MZMC, Minnesota Zen Meditation Center, each year in January and February. For about eight weeks, we have a Buddhist study. And two years ago, we studied Genjo Koan. And I gave a lecture that has two hours. And I gave lectures for one hour. And some other teachers, like Katagiroshi's disciples, speak, talk another half of it.

[28:14]

to have discussion and talk their own understanding. And I tried to explain the original meaning in Japanese. And at that time, we had another study group beside the Buddhist study with those people who teach and taught at the Buddhist study. The member of the group was mainly Katagiroshi's disciples. and I made the first draft of my own translation of Genjo Koan and I explained the original meaning. We had the original Japanese text and my first draft of my English translation, and we tried to collect as many translations, English translations as possible, and we compared.

[29:25]

and we tried to make our own translation. And this translation we have now is a result of that work. And after that, I have been working on translation of Uchiyama Roshi's commentary. This is Uchiyama Roshi's commentary on Genjo Kōan, published in Japan. And I made a first draft of translation of this book. So, you know, I have been studying Genjo Koan and practicing Dazen, Western Dogen teaching in Genjo Koan. So I have, how can I say,

[30:28]

certain understanding, my own understanding. And today I'd like to talk about my understanding of Genjō-kōan, because I don't have, I think we don't have enough time to talk on, you know, Sennetsu or Uchimurashi's commentary. But my understanding is, of course, based on Uchiyama Roshi's and Sen's commentary. So I don't think it's different. But I try to use my own language. First, the title, Genjo Koan. I translate this as actualization of reality. Actualization is translation for genjo, and reality is for koan.

[31:38]

But I'm not sure this translation is carry convey the true meaning, deep meaning of genjo koan. Actually, it's really a short, you know, short term, but it has I tried to explain what Genjo Koan means in my understanding. Gen means to appear, to appear, and also to be present. Or as a noun, present moment, this present moment, gen. Or it could also mean actual or real or true. Not true, but actual or real. And jo means to become.

[32:42]

And ko means to be public. And An is a kind of difficult word because there are two Chinese characters for Ko-An. Ko-An is a very famous word in Zen, but there are two Chinese characters for Ko-An, I mean for An. Maybe I should show those two. We have a... OK. Those two. This part is the same.

[33:59]

This means to be peaceful. And also, it also means to place something on some place, somewhere. So this part is the same thing, same letter. And this side, this part means hand, hand. And this part means wood, [...] or tree. These are two different Chinese characters, but both pronounce an. So ko-an, we can use either of Chinese characters for ko-an. And usually, we use this an, an with three.

[35:02]

But the Chinese character 刀剣禅師 is the first one, it's one with hand. And those two, since the pronunciation is the same, those two can be used alternatively. Either is okay. Neither of them are mistaken. And yet the meaning of these two kanjis are different. An with hand means to press. So, you know, to press, like, you know, massage. Massage in Japanese is anma. That means to, you know, press hands and push it to make our body peaceful. So that means to treat.

[36:09]

And the second kanji, the original meaning of the second kanji with tree means a desk on which we put something on. And also a document. You know, we put document on the desk and we put paper on the desk and write something. So this an means a desk or a document. And koan was originally used as not a Buddhist term or a Zen term. This is originally used in a government office as a government or public, how can I say, document. on which, you know, the laws or regulations are written.

[37:13]

And in China, you know, laws or regulations were issued by emperor. And once, you know, laws or regulations or rules were issued with the name of emperor, it cannot be changed. It has absolute authority. No one can complain about it. So that means something which we cannot change. That is, in Zen, Zen practitioners use this word as something we cannot change. That means absolute truth. And the master's sayings or the question and answer or some kind of story which shows the absolute or ultimate truth or reality is called koa. something, you know, shows us the ultimate truth or reality.

[38:17]

And especially in the Rinzai tradition, this word koan is used as a kind of a question given to the student from teachers. So students have to study, learn, study and penetrate into the meaning of the absolute reality or truth shown, expressed through koan by ancient Zen masters. That is the usage or meaning of koan in Rinzai tradition. Not only Rinzai but, you know, in Chinese also use this koan in that way, in that meaning.

[39:24]

So it's a kind of, you know, examples we have to study and to penetrate. But Dogen Zenji uses this word koan in a kind of different way. It's not a question we have to study with or struggle or wrestle with. But in the case of koan, in the case of Dogen Zenji's word usage, Ko-an should be always together with gen-jo. And as I said, gen means to appear or to be present, present moment. and joined to become. So, appearing or actualizing or manifesting or becoming at this present moment.

[40:32]

That means things happening present moment. in front of our eyes, not only in front of our eyes but also inside of ourselves. Things going on, happening, going on within ourselves and outside of ourselves. Our life is moving. It's like a stream of water. Our life, both our body and mind and things outside of ourselves are not fixed beings, existence, but everything is changing because it's alive. So everything is in the process, and there's no beginning and no end. And we are part of that process of moving and changing.

[41:39]

And this genjo is koan, according to Dogen Zenji. So this reality going on at this moment, moment by moment, inside and outside of ourselves, is koan. So koan is not some kind of statement recorded in certain Zen literature, but koan is this reality in which we are living, self. And so this koan or genjo, things happening right now, right here, is absolute or ultimate reality. There is no such reality or truth beyond or behind this reality we are actually living. That is one meaning of genjō kōan. So genjō kōan means genjō is kōan. Genjō is real ultimate reality.

[42:46]

there's no reality beyond or behind what we are really experiencing at this moment. We often or usually think what we see, what we experience is very limited. Our mind is conditioned and limited, our body is also limited. And this phenomenal world, within this phenomenal world, everything is always changing. That means we cannot rely on anything. So we want to find something we can rely on, something which doesn't change. And, you know, we feel, you know, there's some sort of hidden truth or reality or something we can rely on behind or beyond our reach. That's how I think often how we start to seek the way, truth, or reality, or enlightenment.

[43:53]

But what I think Dogen, not only Dogen, but the Mahayana Buddhism show us is there's no such reality or truth we can rely on which doesn't change and which exists beyond this phenomenal world of impermanence and egoless. So this reality in which we are living actually right now, right here, is our ultimate reality. We cannot find anything beyond or behind this phenomenal world in which we have so many problems. And we cannot rely on anything. And we cannot grasp anything as reality or truth. So we have to open our hand. And to see really, you know, this movement changing or vigorous, you know, function of life itself is reality.

[45:04]

That is koan. That is absolute reality, ultimate reality. We shouldn't try to find anything beyond this phenomenal world. And another meaning of koan is, as I said, a question. That means, you know, this genjo is questioned because it's always changing. If we rely on this, you know, genjo or reality which is always changing, grasp on this is reality, then that's a mistake. Already we make the, you know, reality as a kind of concept. So this is, you know, things are always changing. Reality is always changing. So we have to always, you know, how can I say, inquire, what is this? So this koan is also a question.

[46:07]

Genjo is a question. You know, this reality is questioning us and we have to find the answer and the answer There's no final answer, because things are always changing inside and outside of ourselves. And yet, moment by moment, we have to answer to the question from the reality. Reality always questions, who are you? What are you doing? And we have to answer through our actions. There's no way to escape from this question from Genjo. You know, if we try to escape or try to, you know, ignore it, that is one way of answering it. You already answered. That's the way we, you know, we live. We ignore the question. We try not to see the reality and cling to some kind of idea.

[47:11]

That is one answer. to live within this reality. So there's no way to escape from this question, from the reality. I think genjō kōan means genjō, the reality which is always becoming and always present. It's absolute reality. And this reality is not something fixed, but this is a question to us. So we have to find an answer. Yes, but our answer, our understanding, you know, by our practice or action or our understanding, that means through using our own language, and also you can, you know,

[48:16]

use many, any, anything we can do. But that is, all activity is a kind of our answer toward the question from the, you know, reality. And our practice or our life is a process to deepen our experience and broaden our view and and settle down into this real reality. I think that is the meaning of the title, Genjo Koan, to me. And the first three sentences in this Genjo Koan is the most famous one. And there are many discussions what these three sentences mean.

[49:21]

My understanding is a kind of a result of my inquiring into Buddhist teachings, various teachings in Buddhism. and also my teacher's teachings, Dogen Zenji's teachings, and also my own process of studying Buddha Dharma and practice of Zazen. Let me read these three sentences. First one is, When all dharmas are the Buddha Dharma, there is delusion and realization, practice, life and death, Buddhas and living beings. Second, when all dharmas are not fixed self, there is no delusion and no realization, no Buddhas and no living beings, no birth and no perishing.

[50:30]

Since the Buddha way by nature goes beyond the dichotomy of abundance and deficiency, there is arising and perishing, delusion and realization, living beings and Buddhas. In the first sentence, he says, you know, there is delusion and realization, practice, life and death, and Buddha and living beings. And in the second sentence, he said, there is no delusion and no realization, and no Buddha and no living beings, and no birth and no perishing. You know, those three pairs are the same thing. And in the first sentence, he negate, he not negate, he affirmed it. There are those things. And in the second sentence, he said, there aren't such things.

[51:33]

And this makes us, you know, confused. And in the third sentence, he again said there are those three pairs of things, delusion, enlightenment, Buddha and living beings, and life and death, or arising and perishing. You know, this is a kind of koan. I thought the meaning of those three sentences Uh, uh, huh? Because Dogen Zenji uses different words. Yeah. In the first sentence, he said, sho-ji, life and death. And in the second sentence, he said, sho-naku-metsu-na, sho and met.

[52:36]

Sho is to arise, and met is to perish or extinction. Same word in the Hatsutra, you know. And in the third sentence, he also used show and met. And so in the case of human beings, we say life and death. But in the case of, how can I say, things which have no life, we say show and met, or arising and perishing. or appearing and disappearing same thing somehow things come up and stay for a while and go away this is and it shows or expressed the reality of impermanence things are always coming up and stay for a while changing and disappear this is the reality of impermanence and we

[53:44]

often, not often, but almost always think, you know, birth is something we like, something positive, and death or perishing is something negative. We don't like. We like birth. We don't like death. You know, something we like, something we don't like, or something desirable and something not desirable. And delusion and realization are the same. We don't like delusion, and we like realization or satori. And Buddhas are something desirable. We want to be a Buddha. And human beings are deluded. So we don't like to be human beings or sentient beings. So those are the kind of three representative of the dichotomies, good, bad, right, wrong, right, dislike, positive, negative, those things.

[54:53]

And in the first sentence he said there is, there are, you know, those dichotomies, good things and bad things, or positive things and negative things. That means there is a distinction. And we have to make a choice. And we have to make effort to become better. to avoid something not desirable and try to gain something desirable. That is our way of life. In our common way of life, distinction based upon our desire. To be poor is terrible, so we want to be rich. And in order to be rich, we have to work hard. So there is a reality and the way I want to be, and there is a path from reality to the kind of a dream.

[56:05]

So there's a starting point and goal. And in order to reach the goal, we have to do something, work hard. And that is our usual way of life. And even in the Buddha Dharma, there is deluded human beings and enlightened Buddha, or delusion and enlightenment, samsara, nirvana. And right from there, something we like and something we don't like. So we have to make effort to practice, you know, become free from selfish desire. and to become Buddha and be compassionate with other beings and to have wisdom to see the reality. So, you know, there is a reality which is not so good. We feel something lacking and we have a kind of a goal that is desirable to reach.

[57:15]

And there is a practice in order to reach to that goal. You know, that is, in a sense, that is Buddha's teaching. We cannot say this is, you know, mistaken. You know, this is what Buddha taught. You know, for example, Four Noble Truths, you know, our life is full of suffering, and cause of suffering is our desire based on our ignorance. And he said he thought there is a way of life which is free from our desire and ignorance. So that means the way we can be free from suffering. or Seath of Suffering that is called Nirvana. And the fourth truth is there is a path from suffering or samsara to nirvana.

[58:26]

So, you know, we have first of all we have to study, you know, those four noble truths as a Buddha student. we are suffering because of delusion and desires, and it's possible to live in nirvana without suffering. So from this shore to the other shore, there's a path. That is Eightfold Noble Path. That is Buddha's teaching. So when all dharmas are the Buddha dharma, means when we are really Buddha's students, There are delusions, that is our reality. And there are realizations, that means seeing the reality with wisdom or prajna. And there is a practice which leads us from suffering to nirvana or samsara to nirvana.

[59:31]

And there are life and death. of course, and Buddhas and living beings. So, you know, there are those things when we study and accept Buddha's teachings. And the second sentence, when all dharmas are not fixed self, there is no delusion and no realization, no Buddhas and no living beings, no birth and no perishing." I think these sentences are also familiar with us through the Heart Sutra. I mean, Buddha taught Four Noble Truths. But in the Heart Sutra it says there is no suffering, no delusion, no cause of suffering, no cease of suffering, and no path which leads from suffering to cease of suffering.

[60:46]

You know, no suffering, that's the word in our translation. No suffering, no desire or delusion, no origination, no cessation and no path. So, on the surface, you know, it's negative Buddha's teaching. And we should really understand why the Heart Sutra, not only the Heart Sutra, but Mahayana Buddhism put, you know, no or mu before those, you know, Four Noble Truths. That is Buddha's teaching. You know, why we have to say no to Buddha's teachings. It's a really important point. You know, we almost every day we chant Heart Sutra. But, you know, if we think, you know, seriously, this is really a problem.

[61:51]

Why the Heart Sutra said there's no vulnerable truth? You know, if we negate Four Noble Truths, then we have to say we are not Buddhist. in our ordinary or common logic. If we say we don't believe in Buddha's teaching, we don't accept what Buddha taught, that means we are not a Buddha student, that means we are not Buddhist. But Mahayan Buddhists said, you know, there's no suffering, no origination, no cessation, and no path, no form of truth. And they said that is true Buddha's teaching. You know, it's really kind of a contradiction, and we don't really understand why. It's really difficult to understand on the basis of common logical or discriminating mind.

[62:55]

But we have to really clearly understand why Mahayana Buddhists put no in each of vulnerable And I gave lectures on the Heart Sutra at MGMC, and it's on the newsletter of MGMC. I don't think today I have time to explain why, you know, the Heart Sutra or Mahayana Buddhism put no in front of Four Noble Truths. I think the second sentence means what the Heart Sutra says or what Mahayana Buddhists said about the form of truth. Briefly speaking, that is,

[63:53]

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