Now Suzuki Roshi started his talk by saying that the problems you are now experiencing will continue for the rest of your life. I had expected him to say that there was some way to get, you know, over them, but anyway we all laughed like you just did. That's not very funny, is it? Anyway, I had my doubts. I thought that maybe they wouldn't, but they have. Anyway, this morning I want to talk something about posture, because it's so, well anyway

[01:05]

it's a kind of a key part of Zen practice, at least especially the Soto Zen school, but I want to talk about some other things first, or this is leading up to posture, and we'll get to posture. First I want to remind you of a passage in the Fukan Zazenki, the instructions for Zazen. Dogen says, the practice I speak of is not learning meditation, it is the dharmagate of repose and bliss, the practice of totally culminated enlightenment, traps and snares can never reach it. You are like a tiger when she enters the forest, or a dragon returning to the water.

[02:10]

You've probably noticed this in your meditation, right? The practice I speak of is not learning meditation, so in the Zen tradition we don't try to teach people how to meditate. We don't try to teach particular, you know, things to do in meditation, and then call those things meditation. As I told you the first night of our Sesshin, you sit down and then whatever happens we are going to call that meditation. So this is not about learning particular skills, or developing particular practices or techniques, or attaining particular states of mind and so on. Some of you, when you enter the water or return to the forest, you know, if you sit down you

[03:29]

may feel a little lost, or you may feel like you're in over your head. You may wish you had a life raft, or you know, you'd left a string so you could find your way back out of the forest. But I'm afraid, you know, actually our life is kind of like that, don't you think? So before I talk more about this, I want to tell you some lines from a Rumi poem. Rumi says in one of his poems, Rumi, you know, is a Sufi mystic, in one of his poems he says you miss the garden because you want a stray fig from a random tree. This is the way a lot of the time we approach our life or, you know, approach meditation.

[04:29]

We're looking for some particular experience, which in this poem Rumi calls a stray fig from a random tree. Wow, I'd like to get that one. So then, meantime, you're right in the middle of this garden and you say, oh, I didn't notice. You know, to heck with this, I want that fig. So you, so this is the way we do, you know, we tend to belittle or negate our experience. It's not, it's not much at all. We want a better one. Nice big fig. And at the end of that poem Rumi says, so don't go where you think you want to go. Ask the way to the spring. Don't go where you think you want to go. Ask the way to the spring. Of course, in Zen, you know, as in Dogen's statement, you know, we would say

[05:32]

since you're already sitting right in the middle of the spring, why not splash about? You don't even have to go very far to get to this spring. You're already sitting in it. You are the spring. So sport about a bit. You are like the tiger when she gains the forest, like the dragon entering the water. You know, around here, Frank took me out the other day. We walked out in the woods towards the quarry. I don't know where that is, but, you know. In the quarry end, you know, there's lots of trees down and uprooted from the hurricane end. So, you know, when you go out in those forests, they're just not very tidy.

[06:37]

They're not very neat. There's various fallen trees. And if you try to get anywhere, you know, it's sort of slow going. You have to climb over things if you actually cut through the woods. So I like to contrast, you know, like a tiger when she enters the forest, like a dragon returning to the water. You know, this is not like getting on the Buddhist freeway. And then waiting for the exit called enlightenment. And clear sailing, you know, at high speed down the freeway. Our life isn't like that, as you've noticed. And meditation isn't like that. You have to stop in a lot of little towns and places, you know, called despair and ugliness. No hope and fatigue, pain, misery.

[07:42]

And in some of those little towns and places, you know, you might end up staying a while longer than you had planned. And it doesn't seem like you're getting anywhere. But this is actually, you know, is the forest. This is the water. We're in the midst of our life. And instead of looking for a stray fig from a random tree, you know, we actually have come home. Or, you know, we actually find ourselves where we are. And we don't need to get anywhere. And this actually is a big relief. And so we call it a tiger entering the forest, a dragon returning to the water. It's your home. When the tiger wandered into, you know, if the tiger wanders into town, it gets shot at, you know, and various things. And, you know, dragons, you know, generally are not very well, you know, thought of either.

[08:51]

So when they return to their element, you know, they're at home. And they return and they make themselves at home in this, you know, in this place where there's all these fallen trees and holes and the leaves are falling. And, you know, there's a wind blowing. But this is where they're actually truly at home. And the water that the dragon is in is no, not a swimming pool. It's, there's a lot of little creatures there and they're swimming around and you run into some of them now and again. But you can sport about in the water or the forest. And you actually accustom yourself to your life being, you know, like the forest or like this water that the dragon returns to. It's not clean and tidy and neat. It's not a Buddhist freeway. And you make yourself at home on the spot.

[09:58]

So this is the element of the first day or one of the days I talked to you about the elements of absorption. Application, where you, in a certain sense, you take your mind and you apply it to an object of awareness, such as your breath. If you want to follow your breath, you need, you know, to concentrate, you need application, joy, ease and mental one-pointedness. And it's mostly, we try to have concentration just by application and then you get tired. Because what makes concentration possible is the joy and the ease. Joy, which as I mentioned, is when your mind resonates with something, you allow your mind to resonate and to be touched by something like your breath. And to be moved by things. It's much easier to concentrate when you're moved by your breath, you allow your breath to touch you.

[11:12]

And this other factor is called ease. Ease is like making yourself at home, you know, on the spot. You find some ease where you are, instead of thinking that ease is down the road or when you get out of the woods or out of the water. There must be some ease that's possible right here, with whatever your circumstances are. So we're getting to posture, right? I have a cartoon in my notebook. It's called, I don't know, the cartoon is called something like, I don't know where I got it because I don't remember it being in my home paper, but it's called Nine Chickweed Street or something, I don't know. But there's a grandmother in this piece and a teenage girl.

[12:26]

And the grandmother in the first thing is saying, what's wrong, honey? And the teenage girl says, you know, the world is a big mess with all the pollution and, you know, cycles of wars and war and peace and disasters. And it's scary and frightening and I don't know what I'm going to do. And the grandmother says, well, as I always used to tell your mother, whatever is going on in your life, it's still not an excuse for bad posture. This is interesting to me. I mean, you know, it's a sort of a joke and, but at the same time, there is something to be said for that. And so I want to tell you a different story. I listen to, now and again, if I'm home, I often listen to NPR radio and I particularly enjoy Fresh Air, the program with Jerry Gross interviewing people.

[13:42]

And one of the people I've heard her interview a couple of times now is a woman named Mary Previty. And Mary Previty is the head of a juvenile detention center in New Jersey. She's been doing this now for over 20 years. She's a fairly short woman, you know, maybe five foot six or five foot four. And she's missing one arm or one hand. And she doesn't wear, she doesn't have a fake hand or a hook or anything. She just has a stump. For one hand. In place of one hand. And at the detention center, she says, there's only one set of rules. They're Mary's rules. There are not other rules. And she says, in 20 years here, no kid has ever said to me, you know, F you. She says, I think that's pretty good. Her first day on the job, you know, the guards and people, she'd been appointed by a, she'd been a high school English teacher for a while.

[14:53]

And one of her students went on to become a state alderman or whatever it is in New Jersey. And then he arranged to have her appointed to head this juvenile detention center. Because he thought very highly of her as an English teacher. And her, she went to do this job. And the reason why she was, you know, they were getting a new head of this detention center is because one of the kids there who actually hadn't done much of anything, you know, got really discouraged and depressed being locked up in the experience he was having. And he might even not have done anything or barely anything, you know, so he's basically a good kid. And in this bad circumstance and ended up hanging himself. So when something like that happens, you know, there's a big review. And what are we going to do? And so Mary Prevoty became the head of it. And her first day, the guards were very suspicious of her. And they're all these big beefy guys. And she's this five foot six woman.

[15:56]

And. Maybe even shorter, you know, anyway. And they're kind of like, what do you think you're going to do, honey? This is a tough place, you know. So then her first night she was at home and she was having a dinner party. She was dressed in a strapless gown. They were having wine and cocktails and having a good time. And she got a call from the prison that there was a riot. So she went to the prison and. You know, without changing clothes, she just went out the door and. Got in her car and left for the prison. So then there. They had. You know, the tendency is when, you know, somebody is misbehaving, you clamp down and you use force and. You know, they would have these lockups and.

[16:59]

And then sometimes if it really got bad, they'd squirt tear gas into the cells, you know, to quiet those kids down. This sort of thing. And. So she got there and there's this huge commotion and there was the kids had been locked up in their rooms and. They were clanging on things, making this terrible racket. And she said, if. If. You know, if you weren't crazy already, that racket would drive you crazy. Or if you weren't prone to violence, you know. In the first place, all that noise would make you tend towards violence. She didn't know what to do. And the guards all looked at her and. She said she didn't know what to do either. And she'd met one or two kids that day. So she. After kind of pausing there for a little bit, she went over to this one cell where Stevie was and she said, Stevie.

[18:04]

In a very low voice, she said, Stevie, what's this all about? And. The whole place got completely still because everybody wanted to hear the conversation. And she hadn't planned this at all, you know. But the whole place quieted down. So then. They talked and. Stevie said, you know, they needed this or that or they should, you know, the food or the exercise. And she said, Stevie, those are all things we can take care of. Don't worry about it. Well, we'll work on that. And anyway, that was her first night. But she does have certain rules. You know how you behave. And curiously enough, what's very interesting, you see, is that she grew up in China. And she had missionary parents. And during the Second World War, she and her siblings were living away from their parents at a boarding school.

[19:07]

And the Japanese invaded China. And so then they were put in a prisoner of war camp for three or four years. And the missionary, the teachers of that school said the same thing. We'll get to foster. The teacher said the same thing. It doesn't matter whether you're out and about or whether you're in a Japanese prisoner of war camp anyway. Sit up straight. There's only the queen's rules. And, you know, and even if you're eating, they ate a lot of cattle feed. So even if you're eating cattle feed, anyway, sit up straight. And actually, she was young enough so that she had a pretty good time. You know, they would have sometimes like, you know, they would try to cope with the flies and they'd be killing flies.

[20:14]

And then they'd see who could get the most, you know, how many gallon jugs of flies you could fill up. Or, you know, who could catch the most mice and rats and things. But why I was telling you this is about posture. So there's different approaches to posture. And I don't mean when I talk about posture, the importance of posture, to be stiff about having posture. And I think, you know, an emphasis on posture can be overdone. But I'm talking about, you know, I want to talk about posture in the context of, you know, how is it that you can return to the, you know, be like a tiger returning to the forest or like a dragon who's at home in the water? How is it that you can be at home in your body and mind and settle there and, in a sense, sport about?

[21:21]

You know, what allows you to do that? And so, in the context of Zen, you know, it's posture actually that allows you to be at home. And the understanding is that various postures, you know, reflect or embody literally attitude or mind. So, in Zen, you can literally change or work on your attitude by working on your posture. It's very basic in Zen. And it's understood then that, you know, if some part of your body is a little concave, one of the areas, you know, is the area of the heart.

[22:28]

So, it's easy to have a little slump there. And if that part of your body is a little rounded, then whatever is rounded like that, the blood and chi doesn't flow so well. So, actually, you know, if you have heartache, it's kind of good. You just get down on it. And then you, because the chi and blood is not flowing so well, you won't have to feel that ache. But if you want to, you know, return to your forest or the water, the mountain pools, you know, then when you sit up a little bit and the energy starts to flow, you actually may have some sorrow or sadness. You may have some heartache. And because you sit up a little bit and you lift slightly, you know, pretty soon you have the feeling in that area. So, you know, in a certain way, to work on your posture is also then to, you know, open up, you know, various memories and feelings and thoughts that you haven't wanted to look at.

[23:43]

That have been buried away and tucked away in your body. You know, and it's, you know, sometimes that's called folded up. You get folded up. And then, so part of the process of sitting is the sense of unfolding. So this is one area where it's easy to, you know, slump a little bit. Your shoulders round forward. Your chest sinks a little bit. This place right here, you know, goes in. And the abdominal area, the whole abdominal area is an area where we hold a lot of feelings. We have a lot of feelings right along the lower part of the ribcage and in the stomach. Often there's a lot of anger right across the lower part of the ribcage.

[24:45]

And then in the stomach there's a lot of fear. You know, in the chest there's often some grief or sorrow. So as your body opens up in sitting and as you relax and settle into your posture, actually then things very naturally start to come up. Things are letting loose that have been on hold. And it is like then, you know, like being out in the woods here and the trees are uprooted and things have happened. And you'll notice all of that. And you'll notice the various creatures, you know, in you. And, you know, how to be with those things is, you know, it's very, we have this very simple kind of approach in Soto Zen. It's just, you know, take your best posture and meet what there is to meet in your life. And when you take your best posture, your energy flows.

[25:51]

And so, you know, Suzuki Roshi used to say, and this is just, you know, basic Zen. When you take this posture, you have the right state of mind. And it's not right compared to wrong. It's more, you know, that your energy moves and flows and your being starts to open up and things will surface and arise in your meditation. And as things arise in your meditation, you actually have a chance to release the things that are arising also then. You know, if you're busy trying to keep the lid on your experience, you will initially be disturbed by all these things that arise. Because you're trying to have a lid. But after a while, you get more comfortable. And realize this is, you know, this is actually home. Home is, you know, as I said the other day, this is the summit of the mystic peak where all these weeds are.

[26:55]

And our life is not about, you know, making everything weedless and, you know, whacking down all the trees out there in the woods and, you know, putting in parking lots. You know, to put in a parking lot is like keeping a lid on everything. Let's not have anything grow. Let's not have anything come up. Let's have everything be quiet. Let's have it all be still and calm and, you know, nothing's going to happen. That'll be great. Ah. So, I don't know, how's the time now? I don't know how long it is. Huh? Okay, well.

[27:57]

So, I want to tell you, remind you or go over some of the details of posture. And so you can, you know, we work on different parts of our posture when we're kind of ready to do it. And as I say, I don't want you to try to approach some posture as though it was the right posture. And to have, to work on posture, you know, in some stiff way, trying to keep the right posture and then you're so stiff, you know, that there isn't so much in the way of flowing and ease. So, one of the, you know, so you want to have, you know, you're working on having some balance between the effort to, in a certain posture and relaxing in that posture. You know, some balance between, you know, effort and ease.

[29:00]

So, first of all, you know, there's your hips. And it's quite important that your hips are level. You know, and this is true whether you're sitting, you know, cross-legged or on a bench or in a chair. But sometimes people's hips are off left to right or front to back. And then when your hips are off, you know, the rest of your posture is off. So, you know, sometimes people's hips are off and then, if your hips are off, then you're pretty soon, you know, you lean back this way and then, you know, your head is straight. So, because your head is straight, you think, I'm straight. But if you're actually relaxed, you know, you'd fall over. Because your hips are off. And so, it actually takes a lot of work. When your hips aren't balanced, it takes a lot of work to keep sitting there. Because if you didn't work so hard, you'd fall over. And this is also true, then, you know, the posture of the hips from front to back.

[30:11]

If your hips are, you know, the spine is said to be, you know, normal curvature of the spine, the small of your back curves in and then the chest area curves out, the neck area is in and so on. So, to have the small of your back in, you know, you need to tilt your pelvis forward to have the small of the back slightly in. It's possible to overdo that. Sort of take off. But, you know, most of us have to concentrate a little bit at, you know, any way positioning the hips so the small of the back is slightly in. Now, that has something to do with the height of your cushion. Because the height of the cushion, when you're sitting down on the floor, it's very hard to have the small of your back in. It's very hard to tilt your pelvis forward. If you sit directly on the floor without the Zafu, you know, then it's very likely the small of your back is out.

[31:18]

And then that's your pelvis tilted back, right? So then the upper part of your body has to lean forward for your pelvis tilting back. So then the upper part of the body is leaning forward. Then the chest tends, the shoulders tend to round forward. This whole area gets concave. Your abdomen is kind of, you're sort of sitting on top of your abdomen and sort of smooshing your internal organs there. And then your head will tend to be like this. So the back of your neck will tend to be kind of, you know, pinched. This is what we did in the 60s at rock concerts. And then you get your mouth open a little bit. Oh, wow! So it's a very easy posture. I mean, you know, it's the kind of posture you can do when you're stoned. But otherwise, it gets sort of tiresome, you know, you sit here like this. And after a while, you know, you really feel droopy. You know, you feel more and more droopy. Okay, so you need a cushion that's, you know, high enough.

[32:24]

It's high enough so that you can tilt your pelvis forward a little bit. That has to do with the height of the cushion. It's possible to get up too high and also the higher the cushion, the further your knees come towards the ground. And, you know, obviously, if you didn't have a cushion at all, you've got to be on your knees at some point, you know. So the higher the cushion, the closer, the more your knees come down towards the ground. And then, so anyway, you can, the cushion, when it's too high, what will happen is, the weight of your body will be too much down into your knees and then your knees will hurt too much. Because the weight of your body is into your knees. So you don't want the cushion so high that your weight is thrown that much into your knees. At some point, you need a little lower cushion, maybe, so that your knees aren't, you're not getting that much weight into your knees. But it's still enough so that you can have the small of your back slightly in.

[33:29]

And then, you know, whether you cross, however you cross your legs anyway, it's good to stabilize your knees, whether, if they come down to the floor fine and otherwise you need, you know, little cushions or something underneath your knees. So that you don't have to try to hold them up in the air. Because if you're trying to hold your legs up in the air, how can you relax, you know. And if you relax your legs, it aches too much. So you need something to stabilize your knees. Or a sweater or something, you know, whether little cushion or something. I've been doing, I've been doing something, you know, California is big on all these things, you know. So lately I'm doing something called integrative awareness. So I went to a weekend workshop and in integrated awareness we do very simple little things. To try to develop body awareness. And so they don't do it by taking a particular posture, you know. They do it by very simple things.

[34:34]

So I don't remember, you know, what pose we were in. But I think it was where we were lying on our side. And then they consider the right side the male and the left side the female, I think. And then you were to lie on the side of your body with the upper part of the body, the side that you, the gender that you had more difficulty with or less or something. And then you had your arms out in front of you like this and then your knees a little bent. So it's sort of an adjusted fetal posture. And then we were doing things like, you know, you raise your arm up. Anyway, and then we were noticing. This is all to tell you that interestingly enough in that school of thinking. When the small of your back curves in a little bit like that, that's yes. And when your small of your back slumps back, that's no. No. Yes. Yes. And then your neck.

[35:42]

When your neck is lengthened the way we do in sitting, you lift up through the top of your head, you lengthen the back of your neck or you pull your chin in. And when you sit like that, the back of your neck is elongated, that's yes. And when your neck is like this, that's no. So in the posture of a sasan is yes. Just practice saying yes whether or not you want to say yes. Even if you're feeling no, you practice saying yes. This is, you know, there's only one rules, Mary's rules or the Queen's way. Even if you're in the, you know, prison camp in China. Yeah. And then, you know, if you sit with the small of your back in, you know, if the small of your back is in slightly, but your neck is like this, that's yes maybe. Or yes but.

[36:44]

And if the small of your back is back, but you lengthen your neck like that, that's no but. Then you have some perhapses and maybes and different things. So it's very interesting to do this workshop. But I think that's, you know, so in the posture of sasan, you know, it turns out that we just say, we just sit down and say yes. Yes to, you know, whatever comes, whatever comes, you know, and yes to, yes to all the things that arise in this place, which is, you know, where our real life is. Which is, you know, it's not pristine, it's the scuzzy woods. If you go out in nature, it's just really scuzzy. You know, if you dive into the pools out there, you know, they're dirty, there's stuff in there. And this is our actual life. When I was a student at Tassara, I couldn't, after about two years of sitting sasan, I couldn't sit still anymore.

[38:02]

And it started actually, interestingly enough, with this same point. So I want to mention that to you, you know, but one day I was sitting like this. And I used to sit, and I thought I knew like the posture of sasan. I was being a very good student and sitting up very straight. And I was just sitting there minding my own business, and then the next thing I knew I was sitting like this. So then I thought, wait a minute, that's not the way to do sasan, this is. And then something said, I don't care. And I said, no, like this. And it said, no. And I said, yes. No. Yes. No. Pretty soon I was sitting there going like this. So finally I said, all right, have it your way. And I sat there like this for a while. And then after a while my back said, excuse me, but this isn't very comfortable.

[39:04]

Could we sit up just a little bit, please? So this posture is not, this posture that you're working on is not actually some posture you're trying to attain, but it's actually finding your own posture. Where is your back in the first place, and then where is a good place for it? And the only reason my back wanted to be back here was because of a reaction to the fact that I was making it be straighter, and the small of the back more forward than was appropriate. Then there's a reaction to that, which is called misbehavior or acting out or what's your problem? And then, but if you actually feel your back, then you can study. Well, where is it good? Too much, too far back. Where is the place that's in the middle there? Where your back actually feels pretty good.

[40:06]

And then that's just one little place, your back. And then there's, you know, different parts of your back and your chest. And where is it that, you know, you're, and actually if you follow your joy, you know, and your ease, you can go a long way towards the posture of zazen. You know, so if you allow your breath to breathe your body, if you allow your breath to breathe your body, instead of thinking like, I'm going to breathe now, I'm going to follow my breath. If you actually let go of your body and let your breath, you know, move your body, your breath likes to breathe. It loves, that's what it loves best. It is your breath after all. So it really likes to breathe and it really likes to open up and it really likes to release. So, you know, other times I've found, you know, like I'm sitting like this and if I just let my breath work,

[41:09]

you know, my breath will tend to straighten me up. And if you, and then, and then the posture of zazen seems, in my experience, is slightly past the place that you can get to with your breath. And so if you do it very gently, you can, you can sit a little straighter than your breath. If you sit too much straighter than your breath, you have this reaction. Can't stand it. So for a long time I tried to sit up way too straight and, you know, I had lots of problems. And that wasn't the only problems I had in sitting, but, you know, and then I started thrashing around. Anybody here know how to do that yet? Anyway, there's lots of ways to do it. In Tassajara there's usually one or two people who have this problem. You know, so they'll be sitting like this and then all of a sudden they go.

[42:09]

Or one thing or another, you know. I used to do. And I couldn't control it, you know. And I was trying desperately to control it. And, of course, the more desperately you try to control it and sit in a certain way, you know, there's some energy in your body that, your body and mind, it has a mind of its own. You know, that's the way it goes. I'm sorry. It's like, it's like your kids. They have a mind of their own. It's, you know, all things have a mind of their own. And if you try to cook, you know, those things have a mind of their own. They do what they please. So it's better just to let things do as they please and not, you know, get too involved in trying to control them. This is, you know, basics in teaching. When the 10,000 things come, what should I do? You know, like a wave. When the 10,000 things wash over me like a wave, what should I do? And the Zen master said, don't try to control them. Pat told that story last year, didn't you?

[43:19]

For your ordination? Because all those things that come aren't just those things. They're the Buddha Dharma. Anyway, it took me many years to find out how to sit still, I must say. So none of you so far are that bad off. In fact, you know, I noticed this morning I walked around a little bit and your posture seems to be, you know, actually pretty good on the whole. And, you know, now's a good day. I'm talking about this today because this is a good day, you know, after the fatigue and, you know, settling in of the first couple of days. This is a good day to kind of come back to a gentle effort to work with your posture and, you know, allow your chest to open when you breathe. Do you notice that even as I sit here talking, it's hard for me to keep my chest up. Talking sort of tends to...

[44:21]

Anyway, when you're sitting, when you're sitting, you're developing energy. For lack of a better word, spiritual energy. Basically, it's because you're not talking and you're not moving, you're not acting, you're not doing stuff. So the energy actually builds up in your body and then it needs a place to go. What's it going to do? So what happens is that, you know, that energy, there's energy channels in the body. So that energy, as it goes around your body, it will find the places that you'll tend to notice the energy in places that where it can't, where it doesn't move so freely. You know, whether it's the knees or the shoulders or the neck or the back, there'll be some place in your body where the energy doesn't flow so well. Sometimes it's called pain and sometimes it's feelings.

[45:23]

But that energy will find a way through there. If you keep sitting, that energy will find out how to move through there and whatever has been blocking that energy will be pushed out of the way. You don't have to do anything. That energy does the work. You not only have to keep sitting and, you know, the energy, the energy that accumulates while you're sitting does the work of clearing you out, so to speak, you know, opening you up. And part of what, you know, usually there's some feelings in all those areas where the energy doesn't flow and it's feelings usually that we haven't wanted to experience. And that's why those, and they're sort of stored in the body and then the energy starts to move and it will keep coming up to that place. And finally, you know, whatever it is that's there will have to come into consciousness

[46:24]

and your body will have to let go of it. And, you know, and that's liberating or freeing. But, you know, and along with all that is actually then your vitality, you know, and you have bigger energy. When I tried to sit like that and I couldn't sit still and I was going like that, you know, the energy of my life is much bigger than, you know, any energy. Energy of your life doesn't, is not interested in those kind of directives and cannot be contained, you know, within those kind of strictures. You know, within those kind of strictures.

[47:25]

So that energy, you know, if you try too hard to sit absolutely still like I did, you know, then that energy is all over the place. But that energy is all, you know, it's also like anger and it's also like desire. And when you're, the energy of your life, when you're not, you know, and over time and sitting then, the energy of our life is something that, you know, we're more one with. And we understand something about, you know, the vastness of that energy and the possible creativity and the vitality. So, Kadagirishi used to say, let the flower of your life force bloom. This is your life force, you know, force bloom. What does it want to do? Ask the way to the spring. So I want to tell you now another story about manners. We had one story about manners yesterday.

[48:27]

Today it's about a mother and a daughter. So this is a little different. A different story. A woman said that when she was eight years old, her mother was Danish and she worked at a small college somewhere in this area or South Carolina, Virginia. And when she was eight years old and during that period of her life, her mother on Sundays would make very nice elaborate Sunday afternoon suppers. And she had two, a brother and a sister. And so the three of them, their part in this is that they had to learn manners. They were having this very, this quite elaborate, nice dinner and they'd get out the best tablecloths that they had in the cloth napkins and the crystal, beautiful silverware.

[49:29]

And then they had to learn not to talk with their mouth full, not to put their elbows on the table and, you know, various odds and ends of things and please pass this and may I have some of that and thank you and, you know, all the right manners. So it seemed like a pretty good deal to her, she said. And then one day her mother invited from the, since she worked at this small college, she was visiting dignitaries from another college to come to the Sunday dinner and she said to the kids, now remember, now it's your chance to be on your best manners. So they said okay. And this woman says, you know, I don't remember what the rest of the meal was but the sauce was exquisitely delicious. It was just to die for. And I couldn't get it up

[50:32]

off of my plate with my fork or my spoon. So I waited until I thought no one was looking and I licked my plate. Their room came to a halt. There was a silence and her mother said, and then her mother said, if you want to lick your plate like a dog then get under the table. So she and her brother and sister did. I think what she meant was don't be like a dog licking your plate at the table. But anyway, she said,

[51:32]

if you want to lick your plate then do it under the table. So the three of them did. At this point there was even more of a gasps in the room than visiting dignitaries. So while they were under the table they heard their mother say, oh don't worry, it's an old Danish custom. And the next thing she knew there was her mother under the table with them licking her plate and winking at them. So it is possible anyway in this story I think as an example that the other day we talked about a grandmother who felt strongly about manners

[52:34]

and oftentimes we have our ideas about what would be rites and practice and the perfect way to be as a person. We have it all figured out. But these things happen. And sometimes it's very encouraging if the part of you that's been setting the standards and establishing what's proper and mannerly if that part will get under the table with you and do a little plate licking. And it's very encouraging. It's like if I'm sitting here and then my back says no and then after a while they say, alright have it your way let's just see what this is about. And I don't just keep having this argument with myself let's figure out what's going on and join with that and be with that and find out what's going on in that place or that area and then how to be with that and then how to work with that. And it's some harmonizing

[53:35]

of your mind and body or harmonizing of the part of you that has some standards. And it's quite useful and as many people have said when I tell this story that actually good manners are about making everybody in the situation feel comfortable. You know and not just upholding arbitrarily upholding some standards. Really good manners are what's being very polite and friendly and concerned and seeing what's going on there. And not being insulting when some part of you doesn't behave according to your standard. So usually at some point in Seshin

[54:40]

it seems important the tendency as the Seshin goes on is to there's often a very subtle way in which we've backed away from you know our bodies tended to recoil and back away a little bit from various pains and things that are going on and pretty soon you know you've gotten actually pretty sort of small and contracted because you're trying to and then you're moving very carefully so that not to dislodge anything in your body and it might break. You know sometimes you can have the feeling that your body is like glass and if you make one movement it's going to shatter. So anyway at some point in Seshin it's useful to remind yourself just take your best posture you know you sit down and take your best posture and you know you find where your hips are level left to right and front to back and you know have your chest open

[55:42]

you know you said your ears are in line with your your shoulders are in line with your ears instead of you know being rounded forward and your nose is said to be in line with your navel instead of out there somewhere. So you take your best posture and you have your chest open and you lift up to the top of your head and relax, see what happens see what you're in for sport about on the spot. Anyway. That's about it for today. End of talk. Do we want to entertain questions or are we ready to go sit some more now? Huh? Oh questions. We could have questions Pat says. Are there any questions or comments? You placed the importance of having the hips balanced. What's the best way of having the hips balanced and when not higher? Well if nothing else you

[56:45]

try checking check with your hands because often times you can't you can't tell that your hips are unbalanced because you're so used to them being unbalanced. So if you can if you can feel you know the whatever that is the iliac crest or something of your hip bone you can see which is sticking out more than the other. So and then you know because the we often are trying to adjust our hips by you know how our buttocks feels on the cushion and we get that level but just because that feels level doesn't mean the hips are level. So sometimes having the hips level and then you know you may need to shift your cushion in some way a little bit you know so that then you can you're actually in that position and you're stable on the cushion. So anyway I do that if in doubt. I know in Zen they often times sit in a full lotus

[57:48]

and that would make the hips level but if I sit with one leg in front of the other that throws it off. It tends to throw it off a little bit you know how to have your hips level in that case. Sometimes you know it's necessary to have you know something under one knee you know to reestablish that level. If I sit full lotus actually that's when my hips go off and I have to put a cushion under one of my knees so that you know because anyway I get thrown over this way but if I have something under my knee then brings me back to balance. So sometimes there's other adjustments that you can try out. Yeah. Sometimes I feel a little confused you know when I first started sitting in San Francisco

[58:49]

Suzuki Roshi at the end of the session shouted don't move don't move and now it's gotten a little more wishy-washy. You know if it's really bad enough you can move which makes it physically harder but mentally there's you know is it okay to move is it not okay to move it makes the mind more active Well I wouldn't you know I wouldn't spend a lot of time debating. It reminded me of something I meant to mention you know earlier on but Duncan says you know if discrimination and strategy and planning

[59:50]

and you know thinking if it was going to get you somewhere it would have gotten you there by now. So give it a rest. And I just you know I would encourage you in that sense to try out you know try you try for a period or two or a day you try the not moving side and then for another day try the the moving approach without thinking about it too much. Then I also get this thing don't move because you're an older student and you've been sitting a long time Yeah. And your ego is going to take a big hit if you move. Well maybe about time your ego took a big hit in that case. You're going to discourage other people by moving but maybe you'd be encouraging other people by moving. Hmm.

[60:52]

There was one period where it was very important to me to move and I've I've talked to you about that because you know I found that you know if I started to get tight or tense in my face you know that's when I decided to move and and I moved a lot and then it actually got easier to sit. That's an example of you know go with what's happening and you know get under the table and and when I did that it was very encouraging. You know and there wasn't this big separation between the part that's saying you should be able to sit still and then the part that's like this is really hard and I don't care. So at some point it's good to have some you know harmony or you know work with the situation. It's good

[62:08]

it's good to tell them you know just don't move and then let them let them figure out that you know that they'll have to move. The I think it's you know we try to tell people different things at different times and don't move is pretty important and because there is a and I've tried to mention that too. I've you know because I said what I said earlier on was when you're when you're sitting you know sit as absolutely still as you can and then when you move move. So don't sit there and go like you know sort of pulling your leg away from this and then you know some other part of your body is twisting and then pretty soon you know you kind of because you're kind of moving and squirming and trying to wiggle

[63:08]

away from different little things and pretty soon you know your posture will get all twisted and and then you're you get more and more stiff because you're actually kind of wiggling you know so I think it's best to you know rather than doing that you really try to let go of your body let your body be where it is and you know what moves is everything inside and so actually not moving means you know there's a lot of stuff going on in you and and what we're learning to do in that sense is tolerate more stuff going on you know that our mind has the capacity to be with greater amounts of stuff and it's not disturbed by all that stuff but you know one of the problems one of the things that happens of course is that as soon as when there's pain and when there's all this stuff going on then you can't be you anymore have you noticed that? you can't go on thinking like

[64:08]

oh I'm doing pretty well it's a shame this isn't so bad after all and let's say when I'm done here let's say what was I going to do oh yeah and you have this nice little sort of inner dialogue with yourself you know it's kind of going along and oh things aren't going so well now well that's alright so and you and pain will stop that you can't go on you know being the person that you thought you were the pain stops it it cuts it and so when you don't move then you stop you know it cuts your inner dialogue and your mind actually has the capacity to be with the pain but it can't be with the pain and keep up the inner dialogue so you have to choose do you want the inner dialogue and to go on with your story the story of your life you know and how what's the story

[65:09]

of your life right now and if you want to you know update your story then you'll have to move then you can update your story and start over again you know then if you but anyway so I I do you know and I found it was very helpful for me anyway then to I just tell you what I found helpful to sit as still as you can and then when you move you actually deliberately decide now I'm going to move and you change your posture and you relax for a little while and then you come back to you know taking your best posture and then you have after you've moved you have the capacity to do that with some freshness and energy and enthusiasm and instead of like getting all sort of twisted up like I'm not going to move pretty soon you know your posture isn't that great

[66:10]

and it's not doing anybody any good to you know in that sense it's better to move and you start over because you'll get to the point you know the interesting place is the point where you start to freak out right and can you can and then if you and once you've freaked out you know it's very hard than like than to relax when you really get into freak out you'll just keep freaking out so if you're at that point you may as well just move and you start over again and you'll get there soon enough and that's an interesting place and what happens where your mind sort of shifts like because you're having this experience and at some point your mind says this deserves you know some anger or you know this is really stupid and and then there's a little click there you know there's a little switch and your mind switches into this is stupid this is inane I can't stand this

[67:11]

and then you know if you catch it soon enough then you go I can't stand this oh maybe I can no I can't stand it well you've been sitting here this long no I can't stand it and you can switch back and forth and then if you can stabilize back into just being with things then fine but if you if you stay over in that other area then you may as well move because you're not going to after after it passes a certain point you can't switch back because you've just gone into a reaction you know into a reaction to things and you're just going to keep reacting and you're not going to so you may as well move and then start over again you won't miss anything to be back yes I think it's important to remember even though we may move physically to not lose our presence when we change our posture yeah still stay present right so that's exactly

[68:14]

so that in that in a sense is a kind of not moving you know that you're present you sit still and then when you move it's it's consciously moving so yes you're present at that point as opposed to these unconscious little wigglings which are going on as an an effort to to keep the lid on I'll go on being me if I could just anyway is there anything particular in the teachings about fear I mean I know you've addressed it in many different ways without actually talking about that but is there anything specific about it I've heard fear it's pretty scary but I don't I don't know I would tend to I tend to

[69:21]

you know if nothing else treat something like fear as anything else any other kind of difficulty or something comes up it seems useful to have you know to in this tradition then you come come back to your body see if you can be in your body see if you can actually experience your your physical body and in that sense see if you can notice the physical sensation of what the fear is and not just the emotional sensation and also then see if you can find your breath and in that sense also then see if you can touch the fear with your breath is there something specific about how to keep it from coming up no no I mean I can deal with it once I got it but I'm trying to figure out how to keep it from getting up oh uh huh well usually

[70:21]

my advice or encouragement is you know let yourself have it and rather than keep from getting it and that actually there is an end to it and it can be released or let go of because a lot of the something like fear or anger these are very you know on the whole very old feelings old emotions and like memories in your body so they're going to be there especially once you relax you'll have your old memories or old feelings and something in the present will trigger them and then they're there but meditation is intended that if you can experience your fear with some equanimity or balance that actually releases it equanimity and balance as opposed to when fear comes up you get afraid or when fear comes up you're angry but when you can just touch and be with it it actually has a chance

[71:25]

to release and let go and then it's not something that you have to try to hold back or stop from happening anymore because you've actually met it and allowed it its expression and it releases this is the basic function of mindfulness in Buddhist practice that to experience your experiences or your feelings your fear your anger grief, sorrow helplessness vulnerability to experience these things without a big reaction it's actually what releases them the reaction is like I don't want this and getting angry or upset and then that creates the new seeds for it to come up again and certain things

[72:27]

like whether it's fear or some people it's anger and other people it's you know a deep grief or sorrow certainly initially they seem like they're going to go on forever and they're bottomless and there's no end to them and sometimes it does take but even if it's six months or a year or three years there actually is an end to it and and then your life moves forward without having to try to hold down or in the feelings that were so painful and you have a lot more vitality and well-being and creativity and enthusiasm and joy and humor your life is and it doesn't mean that you can't have sorrow again or fear again but it's not the intense overwhelming flooding kind of thing that it was from your from the old material is then you

[73:28]

you don't worry about when you have fear because it's just fear and it comes and goes and it's not this old, old fear that seems so overwhelming and one of the things that happens with sitting of course is that you develop the capacity to be with stronger and stronger feelings your stability develops and your your balance and that also again is in the posture you have you you actually develop it's the the stability and the well-being to be with things that are difficult and painful and so then you're not worried about meeting something difficult and painful because you have this ability to be with it and sometimes people sit you know for many years you know eight, ten, twelve twenty years before they you know

[74:28]

start to encounter old, old you know hurts and wounds and things and then you know you go from there anyway we we do the best we can oh I have one I'll finish may as well stop now but I have a short little part of a poem by Kabir which I like a lot which that you know I think relates well to the city and posture

[75:38]

the daily sense of failure comes to an end the damage I have done to myself fades away a million suns come forward with light when I sit firmly carefully in that place thank you

[75:55]

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