Who wants to say something? Yes. I was relatively happy to get this word mind because it is not clearly defined. and I didn't even know how to write it or limit it. And now to go into the question of how we experience our spirit, I was surprised by the question at first, and when there was this question how we experience the mind I first was a bit surprised about the question, because I wouldn't know what else I could experience, but the more I probe into myself the more I ask myself

[01:18]

What happens exactly when I, with which I practice a lot, feel the non-business? the more I ask myself what does actually happen when I experience, for example, the one who is not busy, as I practice a lot with that phrase. I ask myself whether I would want to call that mind. And I'm not at all sure about that. And similarly, I'm not sure what I should call when during zazen when the attention really takes on itself for some time. When during Zazen actually attention is un-attention?

[02:45]

For me there is a difference between on one hand what I more generally or more in everyday life, I subsume under mind, where all concepts, all emotions, all sense impressions belong to mind. I actually only asked questions and didn't give any answers. But it mirrors my feeling to the question. Well, you weren't speaking about a bus schedule.

[03:56]

So there was a point, a focus in what you were saying. In our group, the central question was, can we experience mind as just mind? So one position was, if I put attention on attention and on attention only, then that is mind only.

[05:00]

Let me stop a minute there. That's, at least in English, let's say, that's only mind. If you want to translate it mind only, you have the term for the Yogacara school, etc. I think he means it's only mind, simply mind or something. Okay, go ahead. But personally, I'm not sure whether that is the case. because I practiced and tried to put my attention to attention And what I found out when I tried to do that is that attention always has a relation to something or is in contrast maybe to something in contact or in relation to something. So for him it's experientially impossible to separate body and mind, I mean in the experience.

[06:39]

Even when during zazen and during breathing out I'm free of thinking and thoughts still there is some contact Sometimes the contact is very thin or fragile but it's still there. When I studied this koan I wrote at the margin some days recently Is mind an empty space too, or something like an empty space?

[08:02]

It's also to what Peter said. What we call mind, I can experience that only when I I am able to come into the body. So he supports Peter and for him also to experience something, to be aware of something, has always a bodily component.

[09:12]

In other words, mind can't experience itself except through the body? No, but the body always vibrates with it. No, but the body... Swings with it. Swings with it. Resonates. Okay. There's a resonance. Okay, yeah. It's interesting. I mean, I think all of us are rather interested in this question. Ich denke, dass alle doch ziemlich an dieser Frage interessiert sind. But I think if we took any group of people from the neighborhood, or some group of people on a bus going to Monsecum, could you get them all to talk about mine? So just the fact that we're interested is already a kind of answer to the question. The fact that we are all interested in it is a kind of inspiration.

[10:25]

I would also like to follow up on what was said there, and also a further step that was triggered by these choirs in the question of what the spirit is. I would like to add to... Should we tip one window or something? Because I think it gets warm in here. Maybe if we tip... Yeah, good. Okay. I would like to add to what Peter and Dirk said. And the question, what is my end, as it is asked in the Quran... Because so far we have all, as I have always heard and certainly experienced, We have also always listened to you and we have also experienced, and it surely is an experience, what is mind.

[11:27]

To take this mental posture, do not move, and connect it and relate it to the bodily posture, not to move during Zazen. and in this guant there is an active body, a person who is sweeping, and at the same time a mental posture of being not busy, being not active. And in Zazen it's kind of easier because someone who is not busy, I mean, I bodily, I embody that when I sit. And yes, the question is, how does this connect with the body in an active body?

[12:49]

Now the question is how can this mental posture of not moving connect to the body who is doing something? Or can I separate this state of mind of not busy, someone who is not busy? Is this separate from a bodily posture of sweeping the floor or something like that? Or where does it go together again? In the holding up? Yeah. Okay. Oh, do you have to translate that? Yes, or really the question is how does it come together again? A body that is busy and a spiritual attitude, there is someone who is not busy, that is the question that I ask myself, how does this influence being busy?

[14:04]

Do I stop? The ground is not turned over? Yes, that is a question that has been answered by me through the Quran. I would like to add some aspects from our group. I asked whether I can translate the word Geist as mind or whether I should stick with Geist. Go ahead, just do mind in English and I do Geist in German. So the group was of the opinion that mind can be noticed only in activity.

[15:07]

Or as activity. And so the question arose, what is there when there is no activity in the mind? And then the question arose about observer or witness. And when do they disappear? And we mentioned two or three tips how to practice to notice mind. One is zazen as like an anchor where the body doesn't move and mindfulness during daily activities

[16:25]

I often say that so that psychology and Buddhism are not conflated. Buddhism is a mindology and not a psychology. So I just, without really referring to that so much, but just speaking to our own thinking, What's the difference if we, for instance, spent a day discussing what is self? And we asked an equally difficult question, what is the experience of self? What's the fruit of that discussion, or how it would have fruits?

[18:20]

How would it differ from, and why do we spend a day or a lifetime examining, pointing to, looking at the experience of mind? I suppose if I was a Buddhist therapist I would be talking to a client or something and I would wonder about whether we should focus on experiencing mind or focus on experiencing self What kind of experience should we focus on? But aside from that, please, somebody go on. I'd like to hear somebody else go on. Yeah. The term mind,

[19:39]

managed to help me differentiate between different states of mind. And I have a kind of collection of states of mind. Where do you keep it? They appear. And they help to notice. And when I... And when I do not think of the collection of states of mind but just of the term mind then actually the body is always with it somehow. and no matter whether it is during zazen or during any activity,

[21:21]

when I have the awareness on the activity or when I remember then is it possible Then it is possible to experience the mind or the body-mind in activity and not only during class. When I sit Zazen, actually, I'm also in activity. I'm not an iron rod. When one notices mind or is concerned about mind, one is not concerned about self.

[22:59]

One is not concerned with one's personal history. The focus is on the activity and noticing how it changes and when it stops. It happens more here to me rather than in my everyday life. Perhaps a mind which hasn't spoken could speak? One of the things we explored was the particulars of our practice here together. And it was done in a way that didn't reference ideas of that practice, but came from people's experience of practice.

[24:15]

We're talking about things like making orioki together, how it changes our experience from simply adhidya, I also found that this was present in the of this topic in our being together, making a different mind together.

[25:19]

And my feeling was it wasn't, this echoes the comments about self, it wasn't so much about the mind that we were making but noticing the mind that we're making. And how the image you've given us to work with of putting something in the stream of our activity including our being together how this profoundly changes things. The Oyoki, of course, is a very good example of the teaching of Buddhism expressed as

[26:30]

What do I call it? An object activity. Or the practice of appearance. The bowls are wrapped up. You unwrap them, they appear. And then each one appears separately in their components. And you eat from them and you're served usually because that's the we. Being with. And after you finish, you clean them and pull them back up and they disappear. And so the practice of interdependence The entry to the practice of interdependence is appearance.

[27:55]

And the feeling is that in order to practice interdependence has some experiential entry into interdependence. Because interdependence is an endless web that's always changing. So how do you enter that? endless web of interdependence. You establish, we human beings, with our capacity, establish a practice of appearance. So the Orioki bowls are like that. You establish a kind of arbitrary beginning and end.

[29:10]

It is arbitrary. But you establish an arbitrary beginning and end. And this begins to give order to the mind stream. And if you give order to the mind stream, you can begin to experience the mind stream. Okay, so that's right. Like when we do the cushions, if I'm getting up to do kinhen, I just leave my cushion. But when I'm going, not to come back to my cushion for a while, I'm going to lunch or something, I always fluff the cushion. You mean you've never fluffed your kitchen cushion in English before?

[30:30]

You've always fluffed it in German? No, I only fluff it in English and not in German. I know. I had a small enlightenment experience, let's call it that. Why not? When I saw Suzuki Roshi, he was at the origin, wipe the part of the little tray which wasn't wet or dirty or anything. I mean, this practice in monasteries can drive you a little nuts sometimes. In a heiji, everyone sweeps together. And you sweep where it's possible to sweep together. So it means you're often sweeping the same thing that's not needing to be sweeped.

[31:31]

So I see a bunch of old leaves over somewhere and I just go over and start sweeping it and I come back to the group. When I saw some old leaves over there in the corner and wanted to go there to sweep them away, no, no, I was called back to the group to sweep the clean floor with the rider. Yes, and Otmar would be driven up. If all of these people did that... There is this funny sequence in those stories, movie Enlightened Guaranteed, these two German guys jumping around, running, and they couldn't move anymore. And one said to them, I don't know, I understand, but we do have to do this again and again and again. It reminds me of the episode from Dora's Story, film Erleuchtung Garantiert, where these two Germans are in a Japanese toaster and have to take everything with them.

[32:43]

And this eating board, of which there was already talk. They are on the ground. And this is is a kind of referred to somewhat derogatively by Western sociologists as Asian group mind based on communal wet rice culture or something. Wasn't it sociologists or psychologists? I said sociologists, I think. Whatever I said, you say sociologists. Well, I mean, it's not entirely untrue but it doesn't give you a feeling for what's really happening.

[33:47]

Okay, say that there are quite a few musicians who practice. Say you had a group of musicians and they're all playing together. And one of them says, oh, those notes way over there, they'd be nice to play too. So they start playing something entirely different. And if one of them would say, oh, there are also a few nice notes that I would like to play and that just plays. That would certainly annoy the other musicians. Come back to leave those notes alone and stick to these notes. Even in jazz, still you have to play notes somehow in the context that you've created. Paul said to me after this morning's talk that usually he can feel a point that I carry from topic to topic.

[35:16]

And sometimes this morning I made rather big jumps and the point was he had to backtrack to find the point. Well, the sense is like in a story or a movie how you carry an invisible point from scene to scene that carries the... the attention is something important. And I would say that the experience of the monks sweeping together has some sort of satisfaction like musicians playing together.

[36:43]

hat so eine Art Zufriedenstellung wie bei Musikern, die zusammenspielen. As we might feel doing the orioke sometimes. Oder wie wir vielleicht das manchmal fühlen, wenn wir gemeinsam orioke essen. And that experience is more satisfying than whether those leaves over there get swept. Und diese Erfahrung ist irgendwie zufriedenstellender als dass da diese Blätter in der Ecke auch noch gefegt werden. So I'm trying to to establish here the sense of the cohesiveness of the worldview and the satisfaction that works within it as the point that holds things together. And pointing out also that there are disadvantages to any cohesiveness because one cohesiveness leaves out something else. I mean, in my point this morning, and I think it's, I mean, most cultural historians would probably not agree with me, but I think having been rather intimately involved in the, though I never took LSD, rather intimately involved, but I did take peyote and mescaline back in the 50s.

[38:31]

So by the time LSD came around and I did the conference, I decided I want to put, if we say in English, all my eggs in one basket and have only Zen as the source of whatever happens to my life. After this conference? No, no, before they caught me. Mescaline. Mescaline. The LSD conference was when I was in the mid to late 50s when I tried peyote and mescaline. Yeah, I thought, I'll see what it's like.

[39:43]

And it was interesting enough, but not interesting for me to do it more than five to six times. And the LSD conference was like almost ten years later in the mid-sixties. got away with doing it, but the University of California was really angry at me. Anyway, I do think, and it was kind of, you know, an add-on this morning, I'm sorry to make the lecture so long, But as I started to say, I don't think... I'm not sure cultural historians or few would agree with me.

[40:51]

I'm quite convinced that the... the... worldview shift, which for various societal reasons was expressed as the use of psychedelics or meditation or trips to Asia. at that particular time in Western history, led to sort of by chance, a way of bringing science into daily life, which has changed the world.

[42:12]

Again, I don't think it's an accident that Steven Jobs says, the three most important things in my life, changed my life, were a trip to India, psychedelics, and Buddhism. I could see that all happening at that time. I simply made a decision that's more interesting to see if I only do Buddhism I don't care if it's good, bad or any difference, I decide to only do Buddhism and see what happens. So, as I started to say, if I fluff my cushion, we got off fluff, right?

[43:15]

Coming back to the point. I saw Sukhir, when he wiped the left side of his lacquer mat. that it wasn't important whether it was wet or not. What was more important was the establishment of a kind of mental order. A mental order which is important to establish because the world is assumed to be divergent. Which also means your life will be incomplete. I think that's an interesting idea to think about.

[44:46]

When you die, your life will be incomplete. Sorry. I mean, it doesn't mean you'll feel, I don't know, let's not worry about that. But... So, if I'm going to go to lunch, I fluff my cushion, and I put it back in the center of my saboteur. That doesn't have to be in the center. It could be anywhere. What's the difference? It's arbitrary. But it's really at the center of this sense in Zen that because the world is diverging, we practice interdependence by giving a beginning and an end to appearance.

[45:56]

And as much as possible, returning to zero. And this idea is at the center of this koan. Throwing the snake down or whatever. Okay. Any other minds that haven't spoken that are dying to speak? Yes, you've spoken, but go ahead. Just a short question. When you mentioned the cleaning of the black lacquer paper, isn't there the danger that it just becomes an empty repetition? Or a concept that one does it.

[47:13]

Of course. Absolutely. Ja, natürlich. Ich meine, einerseits wollen ja die sich alles adaptieren oder in seinen eigenen Raum bringen. Also auf der einen Seite, nee, on one hand, one should adapt everything and bring it into one's own space. Das würde für mich bedeuten, wenn das total sauber ist, muss ich nicht unbedingt... And for me that would mean if this lacquer paper is not dirty, I do not necessarily need to clean. Not true. No? Even if it's clean, you clean it. Anyway. I'm just teasing, partly teasing you. Irma brought that. Erma Brombeck, who wrote a book which says, if life is a bowl of cherries, how come I'm always in the pits?

[48:16]

And who wrote that book? I didn't get to know. Erma Brombeck. They're leaving. They're hearing the anecdotes coming and they're breaking the door. Irma Rundbeck freed American housewives from the tyranny of being a housewife in the 50s and 60s. She said, if you do housework right, it will kill you. She said, I broke my most basic rule. Never have more children than there are windows in a car. She was very funny. I'm more surprised that you know so much about Irma Bombeck. Don't be surprised what I know.

[49:18]

I am. Okay. if you have a mind view a world view a mind view that the world is external to you then such things are just rituals they're empty rituals but if you're if you're if you're if you experience always the simultaneity of mind, then a ritual like that is never empty. It's like you're massaging your own lovely mind. So, Shall I say a few things, because we only got a little bit, or shall we continue?

[50:38]

What shall I do? Yes, go ahead. For a long time, mind was for me something very personal, like my mind. And this changes and like there is an osmosis and it becomes more and more our mind. from his point of view, but at the same base. And I ask myself whether this is like a docking station where we all kind of dock on or dock at, at the same base. And now the question arises, where is the spirit when I don't dock?

[51:48]

My question is, where is mind Where is mind when I do not talk on? What if we had never met here? What a terrible idea! Or all the people who are not here, who are out there? Is their mind out there where the other people are? Wait a minute, I get lost. The point was... Where is the spirit when people don't deal with the spirit? When they're not in this research? Because the spirit is this common spirit, you mean? Whether it's individual or collective. But where is it when I don't ask myself the question? I would like to ask him how he meets that.

[52:50]

I asked myself a similar question and I want to find out whether it's actually the same question. We notice or we are aware of mind within a field. As a field or within a field? Mind. I cannot answer this differentiation. Okay. I had this field, but what happened when I'm not there? Is the field still there? Was that your question? Sorry. If we deal with the question here, then...

[53:51]

So when we ask the question, what is mind, we presuppose that mind exists. So does mind exist only for people who ask this question and who try to explore this or does it exist anyway also for with other people who do not ask the question? So I think that the question, what is mind, is really for us, what is experienceable mind? What is the experience of mind?

[55:10]

And everybody, you know, has some, we could say, is a mind. And they have experiences. But they don't experience those experiences as mind. And sometimes we use the term simultaneous mind. Which simply means on every object you simultaneously experience the mind as well as the object. Now, and I read the other day about some, I think a woman tennis player who won at Wimbledon and surprised everybody. Also, ich habe neulich gerade was gelesen über eine Frau, die das Turnier in Wimbledon gewonnen hat und alle überrascht hat.

[56:35]

She beat all kinds of people way ahead of her in the rankings. Sie hat alle möglichen anderen besiegt, die in der Rangliste viel höher über ihr stehen. But anyway, it's kind of great that she won from this article I read, not that I know much about it. Und das ist irgendwie toll, dass sie gewonnen hat. But in the article it said, she brought her mind trainer along with her. Now, what does that mean? And she attributes her success to her mind trainer. and she says that her mind trainer was the one who helped her to this victory. I think that was a kind of coach. Okay, so she has a coach and she has a mind trainer. Now, I think what she has to mean is the mind trainer helps her have something like an imperturbable mind.

[58:04]

She doesn't get upset. She can maintain a state of mind even when she's losing points and things like that. Now, Buddhism means something like that when they speak about mind. You can define mind as the inclusiveness of everything that comes under consciousness, awareness, knowing, etc. And that's a wide inclusiveness. whatever, in person, kitchen sink. Being a housewife.

[59:06]

That's what monks are basically, housewives. I always wanted to be a housewife. Now, the inclusiveness is useful to know. If you learn to play the piano, you probably affect your experience of mind. If you learn computer programming, I would say that computer programmers are the second largest demographic probably in our sangha after psychotherapists. But musicians are competing. So I think if you do computer programming or rigorous mathematics or something, you affect your mind.

[60:14]

But it's kind of a secondary effect. Buddhism says, let's go directly to the experience of mind. How can we affect mind and effect mind and directly experience mind. What do you mean, effect? Effect, make mind happen. Affect is to affect it, effect is to produce it. Okay. So from that point of view, we're looking at a definition of mind which allows us to experience mind.

[61:28]

Okay, so I will say the simplest way I think you can practice this. is to take an object of perception and then notice the space of the object the space surrounding the object and the space of the object Okay. And then shift from the object to the space. And if you can hold a feeling of the space rather independent of the object.

[62:32]

We can say that's something very close to an experience of non-conceptual mind. Okay, so non-conceptual mind would be something like not the inclusiveness of mind, something like the essence of mind. Okay. Is that crystal clear? Is that glass clear? Or is it sort of clear? I have an insi-winsi small question. Not if it's insi-winsi, I don't accept. Okay, brilliant question.

[63:35]

Just a winsi one is good enough. Now I can ask a small question. The big mind. Isn't that only the big mind of whoever is in the room? I mean the collectiveness of the mind in the room. All the people you're connected with. Are you speaking about your experience or are you trying to interpret a Buddhist term? I'm trying to interpret my experience. I want to see if I'm on the right track. So instead of responding to your question, let me just say you're on the right track. Thank you. That is responding.

[64:36]

Well, maybe I would respond differently to the question somewhat. But I will, I'll continue. I don't want to continue too long though. Let's see what I can say. With appearance, you're giving a beginning and end to appearance. And to develop this as embodiment, you embody it. The root of the rituals in Zen practice are the embodiment of mental postures. The root of the Zen rituals is the embodiment of mental posture.

[65:49]

The word, just to give you sense of how central this is, the word Zen of course means Jhana and Jhana and Jhana is this practice of mental postures. So Zen means Chan or Jhana and Jhana means mental posture. Of bringing, of pointing to the mind, let's use that phrase. Auf dem Geist zeigen. How do you point to the mind? Wie zeigt man auf dem Geist? You point to the mind by, in this case, enacting the beginning and end of appearance. Because if you can enact the beginning and end of an appearance of a convergence which you're participating in the convergence, if you can enact a beginning and end, receiving and releasing, you have an experience of staying, of mind staying.

[67:03]

If there's no beginning and end, you have no experience of the mind staying for a moment. So if it stays for a moment, then you release it. But if it stays for a moment, you begin to have a direct experience of mind. Okay. Now, I've often spoken about you're establishing a... First of all, we need to establish continuity. Also zuallererst müssen wir Kontinuität etablieren. But we're establishing continuity when there's no continuity. Aber wir etablieren Kontinuität dort, wo es keine Kontinuität gibt.

[68:19]

Or there's a repetition which certainly is so... Within our sense field, the repetition is so exact that we take it as a continuity. But we know, we can know by wisdom, that it's not. and we know if we externalize our world like that so that it seems to be continuous and separate from us it's the main cause of mental suffering and it's the main reason you don't realize in life And all of Buddhism is in the end about lessening suffering and realizing enlightenment.

[69:37]

And everything in between. Okay. So, if you... All right. So, again, as I said, you establish a sense of a continuity of location in the body. Also, du etablierst ein Gefühl der Kontinuität im Körper. The continuity, sense of continuity located, as I say, in breath, body and phenomena. We can say that's a way to establish the body as the location of continuity. Or bodily continuity. Now, where does this come from?

[70:51]

It comes from a worldview which says there's no continuity. So you have to establish the continuity. It isn't just there unless you do it. Okay. I don't want to argue this point. I can think of all kinds of points against that, but I think I could argue away all the points. So you also want to establish not just bodily continuity, you want to establish mental continuity. Now, that is established and it's all hidden in the word sameness. Now objects are different.

[71:53]

This object is different from that object. This makes sound and that records sound. This is old-fashioned and that's modern. This started in California? No. Okay. The technology didn't start. Made... Anyway, so, but what is the same about these two things? Experientially, it's mine. Von der Erfahrung her ist es Geist. So I experience mind, I experience the object and mind simultaneously. Ich erfahre das Objekt und den Geist gleichzeitig.

[72:53]

Object and mind simultaneously. Objekt und Geist gleichzeitig. This establishes from differentiated object to differentiated object, it establishes a continuity of mind. Und das... And when you can do this, this is considered a form of samadhi. Okay, now what you've done is you've established a continuity of objects, an object continuity through the sameness of mind. Now, we're not talking again about physics or whether it should be this way or shouldn't be that way. This is a very helpful experience to establish if you want to be free of suffering and perhaps realize enlightenment.

[74:02]

Okay, now you're also this, let's call it mental continuum. It's not a chain where you grab all of this part and it shakes all the other parts. It's a unit and a space, a unit and a space, a unit and a space. They're not connected. And as Yuan Wu says, establish a mind where there's no before and after. Now, to get to this point, you've got to free your mind of the temporal dimension. So you're beginning to experience the spatiality of things and not the temporality of things.

[75:22]

Doesn't mean time doesn't exist. Certainly exists, you know. Exists as time. Progressive getting older, flowers fall, weeds grow, etc. But our experiential identity is not formed temporarily. Temporarily is what we mean. Our... Our identity is not established temporally, not temporarily, temporally. It's established spatially, where each unit is separate.

[76:23]

Again, one of the ways we give order to the mental continuum And you get so you can really feel the edge of appearance and the edge of its disappearance. And really this gets, it's like a muscle or anything else, it gets, playing a piano or something, it gets more, you get more and more skillful at it. It's a craft. So when you can begin to feel appearance beginning and ending, the clarity of mind becomes more intense.

[77:37]

The preciseness of mind becomes heightened. And you have a feeling of mind. Everything starts being bright and light. And because each one is a separate unit, it's not at the minuteness of psychotic scanning. But it's resonant with and at the level of detail, it's at the refinement of our senses. And you more and more feel the staying of mind. And I'm sure that neurobiologically you're changing again, as I've mentioned before, the right-brain-left-brain relationship.

[79:03]

And I'm sure that... I'm sure that when you speak neurologically, you're changing between the right-brain-left-brain relationship. So you're not only beginning to notice mind, you're changing the brain that produces mind. Okay. Now, this experience of the staying of mind, moment after moment, And the vividness and stillness of appearance most fully arises through this non-conceptual mind which is still. So the practice of receiving appearance and releasing appearance is also a practice of stopping or pausing.

[80:11]

And this is also what is meant in this koan by the one who is not busy. Because you establish a continuous state of samadhi of the sameness of mind. Which is independent of the activity. Der unabhängig ist von der Aktivität. Oder der die Basis der Aktivität ist. Now it's helpful to establish what we could call body points.

[81:31]

For instance, if I'm speaking to you, I can speak to you through the content of the topic. But if I have a feeling I want to speak to you through mind, predominantly, and the content is only an excuse for speaking through mind, like perhaps somewhat like the tennis mind trainer I would try to speak to you through a stillness of mind that accompanied the content.

[82:40]

Now we are again talking about a singular suchness of mind and body. So to establish the stillness of non-conceptual mind while you're conceptualizing to establish the stillness of non-conceptual mind while you're conceptualizing. It's helpful in this practice of mental and physical postures to establish the continuity of body points And the ones I usually establish are my feet, breath, my facial bones, and the crown of my head.

[83:44]

In other words, if I want to establish a stillness of mind, I establish a stillness of body simultaneously. This is what I was trying to speak of this morning. of the biological and perceptual pace of mind. So doing things with two hands. So part of the skill of Buddhist practice Is it any moment with any group of people or any situation or trees in a windstorm?

[85:17]

You establish a biological and perceptual pace. You're not establishing a subject-object distinction. You're not establishing the sense that the self exists through itself. And you're not establishing the sense that the self appears through appropriation or objects. So first, the first jhana is this analysis of mind. The first jhana is this analysis of mind.

[86:24]

I see why in the United Nations they change translators every half hour. Sorry to exhaust you. I'm not exhausted yet. I'm ready to go. Where are we going? Anyway, I'm sorry. Okay. Okay. So if I establish a feeling of feet, breath, I don't know why, but for me it's facial bones, particularly the cheekbones. and this chakra, there's a stillness of mind ensues. So, again, there's no subject-object distinction. If there's a subject-object distinction, an experience of self as as independent of the world, you can't have this experience.

[87:42]

So again, the analysis of mind is to notice when you are assuming self continues independent of the world. Or when you think the world exists independent of you. So to free yourself from those two world views is at the center of this experience of the one who's not busy. And Daowu's stopping is the confirmation of Daowu of union, not business. So as it says in here, we see things as unborn and undying.

[89:02]

We Buddhists in the Koran see things as undying, unborn and undying. They're unborn because they're arbitrarily appearing. They're not beginning and ending. As if they were independent of you. So you can say, you could practice with, instead of just now originating, you could practice with unborn. Undying. Because it's not in the category of birth or death. It's in the category of momentarily appearing and momentarily disappearing which as you develop that or realize that it gives you an experience of the staying of mind and the stillness of mind.

[90:21]

and non-conceptual mind. Where you can completely rest, but not relax. You feel completely at ease, but it's an aliveness that you couldn't confuse with relaxation. Now we got sort of, maybe more than sort of, into the center of the koan even before our Wednesday afternoon off. Okay. My suspended in space novel. Okay. Thank you.

[91:46]

Guys. He's right.

[91:48]

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