Suzuki Roshi Sun-Faced Buddha, Moon-Faced Buddha

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Serial: 
BZ-02621
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Sesshin Day 5

 

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morning
well this is the end of were getting towards the end of our practice period i mean i'll go fishing
and practice period
so this afternoon we will have the so-called shoe so hot in attendance a question and answer
dami combat
it's a ceremony where everyone in the practice period
at is a shame when i asked question
so
i'm
ah
for some people it's really hard to pick up a question take up a question what am i going to ask them in villa but anyway
do it
ah
the you had a
you know every question put to the shoe so on the spot
and
the she says
a task is
to reply to your question but not to answer it in a
the
a
not to explain
the answer
the sooners issue so experts to explain anything their last
so
the shooter as the whatever your question is issue so should answer it from their deepest place not answering but responding
the difference between answering and responded
and an answer may be okay
better response
from a a pure place it in there
deepest heart or mind is what should come for it and you may not understand that response and even as user may not understand the response but the truth in that response more truth than in any explanation
hmm and
though we're not testing the issue of knowledge
good
asking for their understanding
understanding is not knowledge
pragya is not knowledge it's intuitive understanding
so ah the she felt brings your question brings forth something from the shooter which is very deep maybe not pay me shallow whatever it is
oh no some answered some responses are really good several expansions and that's a good that's okay
but you do your best and then she served as per best
to connect you you it's like connecting each other
i'm like the
ah the grove of trees
that isn't is the the grove of trees at long laundry
hmm
so please be prepared

the it's not exactly combat with that determines combat in in japan like any ag
although i have not seen at the edgy i have seen regret a movie the movie and i know people who have done that added energy but there's a list of questions and a list of responses so this she says was to understand the responses to the question fitter
set so it's not for more more formalistic little more mechanical
but our questions or like chickens free range
free free ranging questions
after me
a non pasteurized

hmm
yes
yes

see
yeah the energy very strong and that's the most important thing is the strong energy
so i don't criticize that is a different way of doing things different of ah
and it's testing whether the issue so understand the questions that are scripted
and what their responses i don't want to go on about this because i really want to get my talk
a
so
that's my announcement this is my talk

yesterday i think it was
during the shoe talk
the question would burn up of the was brought up with them
suzuki roshi is
ah
commentary on san faced move race
after we came across this passage
whether i am a tougher her this is vigour yoshi talking or at san francisco have no problem even though i die it is all right with me and it is all right with you and if it is not a right with you you are not as instant it is quite all right that is buddha
so there was some kind of question or cover
how can choose if you you say it's all right with you
because you are you and he's him
it's alright with you in a very it's okay with me when i die it's it's it's okay with me and it's okay with you and if not you're not as instrument that makes perfect sense
except that it's presupposing that it's okay with you
you get that
well i translated this i mean i not translated
eh
edited this thought with ed brown and ah
he may have said actually he may have said that
and if with her
and it should be all right with you he may have said that
but whether he said that are not whether it's you should it should be alright with you or if it's not a right with you it doesn't make any difference because they all the same
through the all the same
if you if you if it even though i die it has alright right with me and it is our and it is alright with you
it should be all right with you
ah
ah
if not united so this is a kind of statement that comes up when
if you feel very strongly about something and you see that
he trying to make a point
so people would an extreme point that people will get does that i can't shake people up a little bit
it can fit
it
when you when to teach dies or anybody it should be okay with you
the purpose of living is to die
if you don't understand that that they don't understand the purpose of life
the purpose of life is to live and die and living and dying is happening at the same time
it's not like dying is a part of living living is dying and dying is living
at the same time
if we don't understand that we don't clean you are not real vincent that pretty thin
when we think about dying we think it's awful
you can think that is awful just one way of thinking
if you can think it shouldn't happen you can think that it shouldn't happen you're free to do that
but it should happen
it should happen that we should die
without dying we can't live
there was no living but you can't have one without the other
you can't eat without shitty
which is the most important eating for sharing
which is the most important living or dying
it's all equal
so we shouldn't enjoy enjoyed or die i can't say that i will enjoy my dying
but
ha
it's important to accept what is moonphase suntrust new sanctuary movie whatever it is okay
it's gonna be okay
how can it not be okay
it's just mattered whether we like it or don't like it a wallet or don't want it
so i've been with many dying people i guess with many it's a number
i
it's an awesome wonderful experience
if
hum
sometimes people say
well you know my uncle died or my father died her my brother died or somebody and know that but i didn't feel any remorse or in if any kind of emotional something
is but i feel guilty that i didn't feel that
but there's no reason to feel guilty if you don't feel guilty
sometime people feel it later in a kind of numbness which is usual actually
oh
ah
to actually be with a person and go along with their dying in a very intimate way
is
for me
every awesome experience
where we was suzuki roshi
when she's a girl she was dying
ah
he he fl his ordained disciples to come in to to welcome into his room
and it was really
cadbury he was very heavy but at the same time it was very light
i can't
there it was it was like am
hardly describe but it
everyone had tears
i wouldn't say we were appalling was it wasn't like that it was like we offer the same way similar way and we are all had tears
and it was wonderful
it was just wonderful
the event he was kind of smiling and boy

ah
it was there was an
beer it was some of the feeling with more than
are
ah
sad it wasn't there was sadness the there was any bid will something beyond sadness he was
an inexplicable
anyway
ah
sometimes when she didn't want when shaggy mooney was dying the our hearts were all throughout a given they were crying bali and you see that in them in the picture he's lying down and then he says the don't understand if you aren't really understood what was going on
you wouldn't be cry
but you should cry
you know you should correct cry your heart out if you're going to cry you just cry harder
does not more than it is not just acceptable is what you should do
as the same time we have to understand what's really happening
so
why don't we crying for
it doesn't help the person who died it's about us have remorse is about us
but how we feel and ah and and also to stay connected with the person
the connection is important
because
read if we had really understand where more helpful to the person who died than if we don't understand
but you have to go beyond our understanding to our emotional feeling that's important
that's what helps us
i master dogen
this story whether it's apocryphal or not we don't know
but he was ready to die
and
so he i know maybe set up a dozen and said i'm going now to month
and he closed his eyes
and everybody was crying
and he said he'd open guys aged
if you just don't understand what's going on he said but when i'd like to do and i like you to do it to take one week and prepare this wonderful
a stupidity purifying
finale to my disease
and so they made a wonderful trees to a l hello kind of going away party
a and the dry in the died so to speak so whatever die is
you don't know if the dark right test this idea
because we live in the light we think that dying in the dark
it's just a contrast
dark and light a contrast
so because we don't know it seemed dark but his and then we think will have the dark is bad
for dying is bad but dying is just it's like a flower you know
we are flowers
if we are flowers and when we come up it's a joyful and then it flowered takes on its various the stations and and belongs and february then the little dive
and it goes back to tell it's body goes back to the earth and
ah fertilizes the ground that it can back up again in in a new phone
and this this is a this is our life and death happening asked the same time
so maybe deficit adventure
anyway
i've never had to answer questions yet
so
it then to thinking real she says
if i suffer while i'm dying that is suffering buddha and there's no confusion at it
maybe someone will struggle because of physical agony or spiritual egg everyone is maybe everyone will struggle because the physical agony or spiritual agony but that is not not a problem we feel it's a problem but it's actually not a problem
we should be very grateful to have a limited body like yours and mine if you'd had a limitless life you would be great problem for you but actually
the limitless life could be pursued death
so we think of life
as i said the other day
life we think of life and death as opposites
but that stopping short
the birth
life and death
so if you if we think that life and death or opposite
that's a mistake
birth and death are opposites because they both dynamics
of life
life includes birth and death
birth and death are the activities of life
but life doesn't come and go
so if we think that life is the opposite of death than we think that can we we don't
it looks like the life as the end in death is nothing
but that can't be logically it doesn't make sense
logically it makes sense that
there's nothing but continuation
continuation of birth and death which is
constantly that's it that's what creation his creation his birth and death without death is no life
now without life is no death
so if we think that lightly
death is the end of life
give me think of life is the opposite of death
birth and death
our
opposites
but in life and birthdates death and a definite proof as soon as were born
we're experiencing death
we're creating a life is a creative life going toward optimism
and then it starts going down toward pessimism
but it doesn't have to
because
death is the life and life is within death
i know we don't nobody knows what what will happen
in the continuation of his birth death
continuum
we don't know
so we have
we have all kinds of theories and so forth i don't have any theory that maybe theoretical what i'm talking about but i don't think so
this is buddhism
what is him
there's really no i mean really no no life and death
because
there's only continuation
and we call it life and death or birth or death i don't use the to version the opposite of that and life and death because life content of person death so for me life is good is
the fundamental
so we talk about afterlife
well
if we think of afterlife if we think that
this present life is the end
it's after something so for many zen masters
it was a security and ticknor and amazon
ah it's interesting to me that they both have it's very similar understanding
the you don't go anywhere because
there's no self to go on
that's the buddhist understanding mizner self to go anywhere when the conditions are are there
something arises and weather conditions are no longer there
ah it's upside so one of the problems that we have is we identify ourselves as separate
as as an entity you and we are you know i am itself but thought that which is myself that i found myself is not itself
so there's no place to go
we arise as this entity called myself
and when the conditions are not no longer
operating together to keep it together
he goes back or i didn't know about back at a lower it goes but it doesn't go anywhere because it didn't come from anywhere

the we should be very grateful to have a limited body like yours or mine you had a limitless life it will be a great problem a limitless life as a body we do have a limitless
universal life
because we identify with the body with ourself as an entity
i'm with
it's hard to picture our life as the universal life
which is endless
but not in this form
so i didn't rub about reverse i have no belief in reincarnation
but reports as is illogical because energy continues
but the energy doesn't continue
i don't know but my by theory
is that
energy
if it continues or learn and teach various forms
if logical
whether
energy is true to form is another question that will be rebirth
while we come back
but where there to come back to and who issued the gulf
so we're already the universe are whole a true bodies universe that author buddhist understanding
the true body is the whole universe
because we identify yourself as separate is hard to deal with that well even though i hope that the whole universe was a lose my consciousness
but wouldn't it be wonderful if you lost it
we think that when we have is the best this just hold on
we think that will we have is is the best because we have it
but it i promise to imagine that i can be something better will it heaven that's why heaven help
that's people that's where people think he went so who knows but
i don't speculate speculating on that
and just open to whatever it is whatever it's gonna be it will be and adamant they'll be happy or unhappy but i will accept it
so this is how we live our life this particular she's talking the talking about whatever it is okay
i'll deal with that
an okay i'll deal with that is what makes us joyful
i expected this but i got that
too bad
if you don't accept it you be unhappy
and if you accepted you have the possibility of being happy
no
i just want to be a little bit more
a human being as a human being
and we can enjoy our life only with our limited body this limitation is vital without limitation nothing exists so we should enjoy it week body strong body man or woman the only way to enjoy your life is to enjoy the limitation that has given to us
though
sunt facebook moonphase buddha does not mean to be indifferent
i don't care whether it's a century food or the military buddha difficult it means that whatever it is we just enjoy it
so when we fit in size in we can just enjoy whatever it is
the purpose of dozen people to i've heard been you know i didn't practice you're not sure now i don't even know why not you know what you know how to yeah
when is the purpose of that then
purpose and version is to let yourself go as the edge n enjoy your universal life as a vehicle for light
that's all
you let go of your ego so that the like can pour through
that's what it is for me that's my understanding i didn't come to doesn't because i was
ah
unhappy or
ah ah
safari not that i wasn't that those were not there but that's not why i came to practice and continued the reason i came to practice continues because i'd like to practice
that's the only reason
i didn't have all these real to get in and then i never had cut went to break kids read me taking out you get enlightened or that i was unhappy or and heathens things
and shouldn't i sat down i was happy
and that's what i've been doing ever since
there's no other reason for me
i just enjoy the practice and i enjoyed fame
not all the time
you know that has happened the joy in the a pain and in spain enjoy
that's the way it is there's birth and death and his death and birth it's all happening at the same time
not that someday i'll be enlightened
enlightenment is i practice of unhappiness
whatever
enlightenment is accepting when every there
okay okay
okay okay
okay
so i'll say
such as arrogant it means that whatever it is we just enjoy it
this is also beyond not an attachment because when our attachment reaches the point of non-attachment that is real attachment
if you are attached to something be attached to something completely
sunfish buddha both ways to her i am here i am here i am right here this kind of confidence is important
when you have this kind of confidence in yourself in your being you can practice true size and beyond perfect or imperfect beyond good and bad
so
do you have a question besides john
it's not that i am discriminating
it's just that and
i want you to sit back a little bit
and let somebody else be first
happy first
gary
yes
god
die
yes
yes
why
why

oh you can do that
huh

it's not up to me
that's after you up to me
yeah
well it it forty nine days as a kind of number that that that that comes from the shingon school which is into bells a single japanese it's
the i have dinner there
and they have this bardo thing the part of the i don't know there's no soul i don't know what it is because in buddhism there's no so but the whatever it is
continues a forty nine days in a purgatory
sort of thing
that fourteen ideas until they get to to she to have an item i'm not sure but somebody of probably know better than i do
that's it will it's in areas so
it's not something i believe in
but i didn't i neither believe nor disbelieve you know i didn't tell that's not true because it's you know
a folk stuff which it is
but a lot of folk
stuff gets into buddhism
but if that if that's helpful for people it's not help i don't think it's helpful for the dead person i think it's helped them for the line people
so if people wanna do that it makes them feel good do it i have no problem with that but i don't believe in it particularly but do you know makes you don't know all these rituals make to living feel good that's my feeling
therefore the living than and the pilots a connection with the dead so because we want to have this ongoing connection with the dead we have the ceremonies to me that's what it's about it's about our connection with the them
whether it helps that the certain hurt maybe
maybe that's okay i forgot my home to theories like that although it's like prayer in defense privileged okay
we pray for people
ha
and we don't have much prayer in our practice
we said what we pray is that right but that's
i'm
instead of prayer we should sudden
so heavy south-central forty nine days
that's more our style
it's time consuming
but but that's all we have right as time by little do something with it
i can you the
i want to go to the back
and then i'll come back to you
i seek to hands down to fight it out
you have to speak up to

yes

yes

yes just be with the person
just be open and be with the person
ah just you know do you read something you know i'm here
and i myself because i myself am feeling settled that helps them to feel settled i don't try to tell him anything
most because mostly who the people that i said with and people are are vengeance
so they have some understanding of their own
but just to be with the person listen to the person
be sympathetic and helpful and
allow yourself to die with them
yeah the i'm going to run along with you and holding your hand all the way to the when you're no longer breathing
i will take out goes you that far and as you're on your own after that
but that that to me that's what i'm what i'm doing i just go along with them wherever they need whenever they need to talk about that they have a companion
holding their hand
and walking with him to the edge
and hopefully it up falling over self
but that's what i do that's that's my you can do whatever you are potential
i think works for people if i start crying and saying oh you shouldn't be done that just makes them feel worse
because
well it i you're doing as a companion is helping them to feel that it's okay
to do with you're doing
so i feel that it's okay for them to be doing with an industrial okay but hopefully that works

yes

yes
yes that's why well i don't cry
if like you know i may have some feeling like a bell
ha
i have to feel that it's okay
to die
if i don't really it's okay then i can't take them there
so
hum
i have no idea what it's gonna be like when it's me
but that's my preparation
judge the other person who had their hand of in the bag i can't see your head around
well let's hear your voice
oh alice
the

yeah
well usually we call it burst a dearth of time okay or whatever i call it life it just words i used i'm i'm appropriating the word life
to use it as as buddha nature
but because
we we think it booted as you can abstract term but life the something that we deal with all time and so i appropriate life in that in that sense
penelope

yes

no

i don't think you should hide anything

well let me say this yeah let me share that not to show that it was going to hurt if there's going to hinder them
yeah
i can't tell you whether you should or shouldn't do anything right but i would say
for me
ah
if someone was doing that when i will die i guess i don't do that you know
i understand you're grieving but i don't want to make you unhappy
just because i'm dying i don't want you to be unhappy but then you do but i am unhappy and so please let me cry you know what your intimacy is with the person is your intimacy and i can tell you what to do and
and you know i'm saying what i would do it i mean that that's necessarily what i do because something i like him up
yeah
chelsea

why

well not in front of me know but every a surprise but emmy but you should be prepared for anything that's my response you should be prepared that this instance
life should be prepared for anything at any time because you mind totally open
you should keep your mind open not pre have preconceptions about things as much as you can and when something happens you ready to respond intuitively
john a back john
okay
no even talking about the trees yeah and i'm very very
so i think
then sell slowly falling way
whatever
wish my usa
penetrate the
of others such the name was
like imagining so you go down
there she reserved
fish and i so i figured just a little further down the next day
and yet here we are doing what's best
composting well composting is important
that
the our world exists because of composting
so my question is go so far
idea what my
well i'm sure that goes on
yes i'm not exactly sure
your exact point
guess my question is when i see
and as guy
worldwide
well yes actually what you say
ah
tom
well you know where waves and the ocean everything is a wave and
the great ocean of existence and but the waves and the ocean same thing
the are just the activity of the ocean so yes we are just the activity the router the activity of the tree
and
the earth is endless for the
oh no
basically
it's important to understand
the tv viewers people's attentive in our thinking we have
the essence of the function
the essences
buddha-nature or kiah and the function is oliver activities
and and we tend to think of them as two things when we return you notice to the to the ocean or something up at the waves don't return to the ocean because they are the ocean so at the same time that were individual where one with everything
so it's not with we talk about two things because of their essence of function but through the one thing the waves are the ocean the at at the ocean is the waves so every way
as the contain the whole ocean
each one of us is the whole universe were just micro cousins of the universe little micro cousins or around me ready to each other you know punching each other than john feeding each other
getting in each other's face
helping each other that it's it's wild after
the world is a wild place including there's say
wow
insisted hell and hell is where we doyle
i often think that this that's what this places you know we'd say when when we die we go to heaven or hell but actually we're right here they oh right here the this no other place where we gonna go with it and seven and hell this is it
and it's also purgatory

we had this wonderful ceremony at the gravesite other die and then three days later learned that actually he was
three hours away and someone else
where we had this little heartfelt ceremony
the way it was found out was that the woman who is a theory three hours away just before they lowered adi one of her children said could we take one last
how would the casket

feeling
awkwardness like to have this really
the ceremony but you know it's just like so obvious to me like it was hearted and then of course we switched them but
well problem when i'm trying to say if you take away from
does it
the wrong person probably enjoy her
and thank you over
yes yes people it's further people million
for the people
the
so we want to remember you know we knew some people we don't want to remember
but is because we want to remember everyone do something for them and give them are feeling and and that's good should be that way
otherwise we become callosum know thought listen
so what
so there is better be careful because
ah
to see the process and the process is one thing but our emotions and feelings are another and i am
as possible to not feel anything
but it's really good to feel simply because it us
more
human
but
ah
ah
we also have to see it in both ways we have feel this is the process of life
person death is the process of life and there's nothing we can do about that except accepted
and the other's ideas that were we have feelings and thoughts and and emotions and they also have to be satisfied even though they're delusional
we have to satisfy are delusional feelings thoughts and support so enlightenment
has to include delusion if we try to separate enlightenment from delusion that than we have do another duality
so
it's important our delusion is really important maybe delusion not the right word are illusory understanding
you know i'm feeling for assets for a
that has to be included but we have to understand that that's what it is
otherwise we get lost in our emotions and lost in our feelings and we don't know how to operate now and we had we think that it's wrong
because their feelings are so strong that we don't want the person to die we don't that it's going counter to the way things are and cause countered well i don't want this person die of course not but this person is going to die and for every single person who has ever lived is gone
but we and we too will be
but
that doesn't stop us from are having our feelings that our feelings eu member
withering heights
ah
yes
yeah he's cliff
the misery height is this man lit the big mansion and on he was so in love with this woman and she i remember what their relationship was but
he was obsessed with that and when she died if he couldn't stand it
how could that possibly be that she would die
and so and it just driving him crazy and the middle of the night he would he came out with a spade dug up her grave and embrace your bones you know that's like
ah
ignoring reality and simply
being obsessed with emotion and feelings helen
yes yes
here
lisa
yeah
well that's
yeah but they don't deny that the person died
they also say
he also recognized
yeah
that that was in the national geographic couple years ago pretty interesting okay james it's your turn
but this is the end she's going to help hit me with that
and please speak up

do you welcome thank you
okay