who pulls through life events like a thread or like a trail in the water when a ship falls. Like the trace in water when a ship goes by or a red thread through your life. And the view appeared that being on the way can mean being on the search And there was the thought that being on the path can mean you are looking for the question, you are looking for the answer for a question which you do not know. I'm looking for the answer to a question you do not know. That's really difficult. I like that. At the end we found two

[01:03]

signs of of um being on a path and this would be nourishment feeling nourishing and nourished and complete yeah okay yes yeah i also wanted to report um We didn't come to a question, we only came to that at the end. We tried to find a way between abstraction, generalization and very personal, concrete experiences. We try to distinguish between three forms of path.

[02:35]

The first one is the path of life. the spiritual path and the Buddhist path. And what we have found out is that it is probably the most important thing to become aware of the fact that you are on this path or on a special path, and we found that what is decisive to be conscious that you are on a path, is an experience of suffering, an experience that you lack something, or that something isn't okay in the way it is.

[03:43]

Is that the main motivation of a path, the experience of suffering and the feeling that something isn't the way it should be? Or only one kind of path? Not only for a Buddhist path, but for any path. Okay. And what is the specific of the Buddhist path? And this is of course this experience of suffering or of lacking something. But above all, the special thing is that you take on the responsibility for suffering or for the lack, so to speak.

[04:58]

That you realize that you don't shape it yourself and that you can change something. Especially that you take your responsibility for this experience. You realize that you have your own part in this experience of suffering. And especially to the Zen path, That is so very concrete. The concreteness. Concreteness. And Frank mentions the picture of Kinhina as an image for the seeking for the path.

[06:02]

Okay. Thank you. Yes. In our group we also talked first about personal experiences of our life path. And then we talked about the inner commitment on the path and concerning the Buddhist path we talked about the precepts The ideal of the Bodhisattva.

[07:15]

But the Bodhisattva ideal? It is more the question of whether it is necessary to have a kind of union or commitment to the Sangha or commitment to strive for the ideal of the Bodhisattva. And the question is, to go the Buddhist path, is it necessary to enter some sort of commitment to the Sangha or to strive for the Bodhisattva ideal? You're asking this as a question. Especially for the Buddhist path, it's a characteristic for the Buddhist path. to say you are on the list. I think at least one common view of a path in our society is like we have some kind of fate we are unfolding, like this

[08:59]

Acorn theory. Acorn is the seed of an oak tree. That we have some kind of characteristic or inherent identity. that we're unfolding all our life. And I suppose, though so many of you are therapists and psychologists, you could correct me on this, but I suppose that in psychology and psychotherapy at least some of it operates from the position But understanding your story in which a great deal of it was laid down in the past or created in the past that a full life would be opening that path up and freeing yourself from it too, I suppose, as you're walking, opening this path up, as if it's almost behind you,

[10:44]

And unrolling as you walk. Yeah. That's not a Buddhist idea. Okay, yes. She says it's maybe psychoanalysis, but there are also other therapies which don't work with going back to the past and controlling the path. Oh, I understand that. I just said this is one of the views. Yeah. And a fairly common one, I think, but not the only one, particularly with many contemporary psychotherapies. Certainly not our Austrian group.

[11:47]

Thank you. How does the idea of karma fit into that? Well, I'm trying to sort this out right now so I can speak about it. I realized this morning that it's more complex than I... than I thought it would be to talk about it.

[12:56]

And when I try to work on something, I try to see the complexity, or see the elements, and I try to... Sorry, sometimes I sound a little funny. I try to... hold them and then melt them down in myself. And then if I can hold it in a kind of molten state, if I'm lucky, something occurs to me that opens it back up. But I mention this also because it's something to do with how the path functions in one whose practice is Buddhism.

[14:01]

Now I'm speaking about Mahayana and I'm speaking about late Mahayana, which is Zen. And I'm trying to speak about this or think about it in relationship to the Heart Dharani scripture we've been discussing. So you specifically asked about whether the path includes other people or the Sangha or something like that. Is that right? Yes. Yeah, I suppose commitment to the Sangha is important.

[15:09]

But I think it's secondary. I think that if you start to practice, you find yourself on a path with others. Okay, now why do I think you find yourself on a path with others? I think it's partly because you don't find yourself simply on your own path. In other words, you don't have the feeling that you're unraveling or opening up something from the past, as I tried to explain it. And I'm not here trying to speak really about psychology or the West or anything. I'm just trying to create some contrast so you can see specifically the conception of the Buddhist path.

[16:26]

Because I can say something, and unless you see the contrast, you say, oh yeah, that makes sense, but sometimes it's in contrast to something that also makes sense to us. And I think we're on a path together. So I would like to try to make this clear. In myself as well. I'm trying to stick to your question here. So I think... Anyway, let me just say for now, since I can't say it more concisely, that when you start to practice, when you start to practice, something happens that engages other people in the practice. And that's one factor.

[17:34]

Another is that you begin to intimate or feel people who also have a path opening up for them. And third, since it's a path that doesn't arise from your past experience but arises from a particular way to enter your experience then you need a teacher and Sangha friends, Dharma friends on the path. And that's one reason I would say, along with, as I've often mentioned, Ivan Illich, that practice is a search for ultimate friendship.

[18:39]

Or Zen is a search for true friendship. Okay, so that's at least this moment's response to what you said. Okay, someone else. Yes. My group spoke earlier, but it comes to my mind, you said, nowhere to go, nothing to do, no path, it seems like, or a moment is a non-caused event. This feels like a moment, hopping, not like a path, you know, and then that... Hopping, like that. You say, you need intention, and this must go better somehow, but I don't know how. Yeah, you put your finger on it. Now press. Okay, I'll come back to that.

[19:46]

What else? Who else? Oh, German, German, please. And then he also says that you need intention. That means that it has to go somewhere. And I know it has to go together, and I know how it goes together. So this simultaneous, I don't know. Well, you're allowed to say something, too, even though you're a kind of visitor. Yes? I want to take one aspect, one question, which we only talked about briefly. We found that intention belongs to the path or is necessary will and effort. But also if I practice, it also could be that I'm just pretending something.

[21:28]

It's like a big ego trip. So from the path to the ego trip. How can I find out whether I'm on the path or I'm just making something up? Maybe that's why I need a teacher, right? One of the qualities of being on the path is that there's a surety.

[22:34]

You know you're on a path when you... One of the ways you know you're on a path... is that you feel it's not arbitrary. Du fühlst, dass es nicht beliebig ist. You feel it's not a delusion. Du fühlst, dass es keine Täuschung ist. And the sense of being on a path is the sense that you are stepping into a surety away from or out of delusion. Und das Gespür dafür, dass du auf dem Weg bist, ist, dass du aus der Täuschung heraus stepping out of delusion intut. You're stepping away from delusion into surety. And that's why, as you mentioned, that this, what I've often mentioned, this sense of nourishment and completeness.

[23:35]

And one thing I've suggested at various times, people try, And it's easier if you're in a crisis probably to try this. Where nothing has any meaning. But you don't have to be in such a crisis to do this practice, this exercise. Which is to really try to reduce everything to what you have no choice about. Like I supervise someone who went on a three-month retreat. All by himself and people brought him food. I think it was three months.

[24:40]

It might have been longer. So I supplied him with a little Japanese house I had in the Sierra. Now it's Gary Snyder's, but I rebuilt a house from Japan in the beginning of the 70s, that we transported from Japan and built in the Sierras. It was a very nice little house. He wanted to do a retreat, so I let him be there. But in addition to the house, he wanted me to give him a schedule, like he gets up at this and he eats at this time, he does this. I said, no schedule. Sleep all day, I don't care. Eventually you'll wake up. If you can sleep all day, great, but if you wake up, then you have to figure out what to do. Decide whether you want to eat something or not.

[25:57]

You can decide whether you want to wash your face. And if you do something like that, it's quite interesting. Eventually, yeah, you feel better if you wash your face. Almost everybody feels better. So already you have a schedule. It feels better if I wash my face, you wake up. Then somebody brings you food or something, so then, you know, it's easier to eat then and let the food get cold. And after a while he came to a schedule that he felt good in, and when he changed it, he didn't feel so good. So he came into a schedule, a certain percentage of the day meditation and so forth. You can do this little experiment yourself for a few days to see what you don't do, anything you don't really want to do.

[27:18]

And there's some things I used to practice with milkshakes. I really like milkshakes. It's one of the few things I really like. Somebody knew that, so when I came back from Japan, after four years in Japan, they met me at the airport with milkshakes. So sometimes, you know, I think, geez, you know, one milkshake a week is enough. So, but sometimes I find myself walking by the milkshake shop and I thought I walked by it. But somehow I have a milkshake in my hand. So then I say, okay, I accept having an okay.

[28:27]

So you can practice this serious Buddhist path in this kind of way. Well, it was quite interesting to see, you know, what happens. Okay, what else? That's all the groups? Yeah. We didn't have a question anyway. Did you have any answers? We tried first to find out what do we mean by Adam. We found out that for most people in the group, the path was a significance for something to follow that gives you some kind of freedom, authenticity, and something that you try to do regularly.

[29:47]

But it doesn't have the character of, for instance, a career, something. There is not, you know, a fast goal that you try to find. And it's too personal, and it's correct also that The idea of a path helps also to get out of your social path and get kicked by the society pressure. It takes out the pressure on society or conditions. In our group we didn't really find a question, but we first tried to define the term of the table, what does it mean for each individual, and we came to the conclusion that the path actually has a meaning in the sense of inner freedom, a certain development of authenticity. something that can also be done quite regularly, and that is also not connected to a career with a fixed goal, but in the sense that it also helps to get away from social pressures, i.e.

[30:58]

to be in this shell that one or two people have written down, to give a little more freedom. And so the whole feeling was something that opens up. There's something that opens something up in ourselves. And then we asked the question, are we in the goodest paths? And the interesting fact then was that Nearly half of the people had suddenly the feeling, oh no, I'm not on the Buddhist path because I can't stand up early in the morning. They're somehow playing up the saturation. I have to feel something. So there was some kind of contradiction. in the feeling of what is part of our own definition and what is part of what we might name, for instance.

[32:04]

And then we came to the second question and asked ourselves, what is it actually, do we make a decision or not? And very quickly we got an interesting reaction, that we suddenly had the feeling, yes, no, I certainly won't do that, because I can't get up and sit down so early on a regular basis. And most of them actually moved away from the feeling that it can be something that opens you up, that it can be a certain feeling that you have to fulfill when you start from a certain path, for example the Buddhist path. And for the last part of the discussion we tried to discuss about the Buddhist path itself, and we found out that we actually didn't discuss about the Buddhist path, we much more discussed about practice, about Southern practice, so that the feeling that the practice, the Southern practice in this context is of quite a heavy importance.

[33:08]

also for the meaning of acts, so that the other aspects of nihilism weren't so heavy in the discussion. Heavy, you mean strong? Strong, yes. Okay. So we could make Buddhism or Zen more popular if we had a sign which said, past begins at 9 a.m. or something like that? I'd be there. Okay. Okay. Anyone else before I... Yes, Paul.

[34:34]

For me, listening to what people were saying, the quality of the path doesn't have to do with thinking or identifying ourselves in a certain way. It has to do with our intention to do something. It's an action. And when David was talking about zazen, it's an action that we can begin to bring that intention to in an upright way which will open us. which will bring our intention in a way that will open us instead of creating another identification. Okay. Thank you.

[35:36]

Now, it's interesting that in the... a temple, a monastery in China was considered to be a space free from worldly paths. When you went into a temple, you went away from societal space and worldly careers. And I think it had a therapeutic... It was this kind of therapeutic presence in the society. Because I suppose maybe monasteries in Europe did the same.

[36:41]

You knew there was some place in the society which was free from worldly concerns. And it was considered to be definitely a space that had to be kept free from worldly concerns. And it's interesting, for the most part, over the many centuries, the temples in Japan have been able to resist the encroachment of the cities. Und es ist interessant zu sehen, dass die Tempel in Japan fähig waren, die Einschließung durch die Städte widerstehen kann. You sometimes have huge grounds which nobody puts housing developments inside. Man hat wirklich riesige Gelände, in denen nicht gebaut wird. Okay. Is there someone else who would say something?

[37:44]

Möchte noch jemand etwas sagen? I want to report from our group. We mostly talked actually about that everybody had the feeling that they were on a personal path. But that there was a difference that some people felt very sure in that and seemed to me very safe in it. By now, I have two struggles, and other people didn't. The difference was that some felt very confident about it and that others were rather confused. We didn't talk much about the Buddhist path that we came up to that seems to be connected to 6 a.m. and very much willpower.

[38:45]

It would be nice. What would be nice? 6 a.m. 6 a.m. I have to wake up. Would you change the schedule tomorrow? Quite popular demand. But we go to bed at 11. There's one thing that we also talked about that is for me at the moment very important. I feel that The path is very connected also when I listen to what is being said. For example, when they say a path starts with a lack, a lack of something, and also a path seems to be very connected with a kind of fixed identity, a stable self that travels through its personal path through the world.

[39:56]

And I've started to feel that that is a very subtle trap that comes up all the time. The feeling that I lack, so I do this, this path, and then I have. Then I don't lack anymore. And it's always me I'm taking care of, in a sense. And it feels very much like, to me, like an onion that you always think you overcome that, and now you're really on the path, and then if you don't, you really stay with it, you realize that you're back in that kind of thinking. And then we also talked about the... what at least concerns me at the moment is this... that whenever you talk about the path, you also talk about a defect, like before, how it came up, that you find a defect that you then stand up to or that you overcome, Okay. Anyone else? Yes.

[41:29]

Now, two people said already that they come to the conclusion that this kind of way-seeking mind came up from a lack, I actually don't feel like this. I have a different feeling to this because I know that there are a lot of desires or yearning because of plagues. Maybe you could do it as you go along. Julia just said it, and I think Polina said it too, that many have come to the conclusion that we are on our way because of suffering or because we are looking for something out of a lack. By the way, this was also said in our group. I had the feeling that this was not right for me, or not in its entirety or totality, but rather that it was more something that was developing, something that had always been there,

[42:46]

That there's something inside of me. Maybe we can call it this kind of really deep inner request. But I think it's in every person. And it's, yeah, it's a kind of longing. But it's also... I don't know, quite natural. That there is something like a really deep inner desire in every human being, but which feels different than this longing to silence the lack, and which is almost something like a natural side, as if it is felt very naturally belonging to one. I also have the feeling that it's not coming to the path.

[43:56]

My feeling is that I was endowed somehow. And everybody is endowed. And we all are offered opportunities to go a spiritual path. And I notice that I don't feel it very good if the value is put on it, lack is not so good or something like that. For me these are opportunities to Take challenges in life.

[45:12]

To meet challenges in life. To meet challenges. Okay. Yes? The certainty for me that I am on the way or that I am in my practice with the film Scandals, then I would like to tell that. The certainty that I am on the path came together with practicing the five skandhas and that's why I want to tell this. I didn't know that there are five skandhas and I didn't know much about Buddhism then. And first now I have to tell something about this week. I was very fascinated all days long here and produced a lot of heat. A lot of... Heat.

[46:14]

Heat, oh. Sounded like you said feet. Sorry. I thought you'd become a centipede. And listening to the teaching of the five skandhas, I always felt like being brushed against the grain, until yesterday the point showed downwards, pointing towards form. Yes. And now coming back to the other story. There was a time where I was very sick. I was in a wheelchair. And I saw that I had to take more responsibility for myself.

[47:17]

More responsibility and also have to come to know myself better. And really I got ground and strength from that. Yeah. Now I'm feeling very fine. Yeah. That's good. Anyone else? Noch jemand? So maybe I can add some, what I could call, notes on the way to a path.

[48:30]

I don't know if I can, sometimes I feel how clear I can be, but I'll sort of blunder along here. Well, one of the questions that is common near the end of a seminar, a practice week or sesshin, how do I continue the practice in my lay life? Well, I mean, usually there's implied in it, how do I just add the practice to my life?

[49:32]

And not surprisingly, in a very short time, it's gone down the drain somewhere. The practice, that is. So you really actually have to change your life to allow practice to occur in your lay life. You don't have to go live in a monastery. You maybe don't even have to make very big changes, but you've got to change it. I like the definition of a forest as the bird's path. The forest is the path of the bird. So you have to look at your own life, your own habits, the forest, the trees of your own life, And begin to see a path in it.

[50:44]

And you have to kind of clear the path a bit. And maybe you have to adjust things a little bit so the path becomes something you can walk on. Mm-hmm. Now, strangely enough, mountain climbing was not possible in Japan until after Mahayana Buddhism and especially now with modern day views. And that's because mountains were considered to be sacred places. And you violated the sacred space if you climbed the mountain. And, you know, there's some nice feeling about that, that mountains are sacred places.

[51:57]

Sukhriya, she said once, a rock at the top of a mountain is different than a rock in a field. Yeah, and I think we feel something like that. But in any case, in general, Mahayana Buddhism homogenized space. Now, before Mahayana Buddhism came into China, Space was considered to be fragmented. And thick in some places and dilute in other places.

[53:03]

And you were who you are partly from what kind of space you were in. So space was considered quite magical and sacred. And in early Buddhism, space extended in front of you in endless lives. And your path was on the tracks of your karma. Path wasn't, karma wasn't exactly some kind of inherent nature.

[54:11]

But it was restrictions you had to free yourself from. And so path proceeded through time. Now, one of the shifts to the Mahayana is a shift to timelessness. And so, as Tara pointed out, the heart, Taru, Taru, Taru, One day, maybe, I'll give it to you. Okay. That I get the first syllable right.

[55:11]

So I'm half right, you know. As usual. Which is half wrong, you know. The Heart Sutra says... No old age and death. That's an elimination of time. No karma. Everything is empty. This is a big change. You know in the no plays you know what they are the Japanese no plays N-O-H or N-O Die japanischen Noh-Spiele? You don't know what a Noh-Play is? Wisst ihr nicht, was das ist? Yes or no? No. Well, Noh-Plays are... You know what Kabuki is? Wisst ihr, was Kabuki ist?

[56:13]

Okay. You don't have to study Japanese culture to study Buddhism, but it's... Ihr müsst nicht die japanische Kultur studieren, um Buddhismus zu studieren? Kabuki... I don't want to explain. Noh is the more... refined of these two main theaters, Kabuki and Noh. And in a Noh theater, everyone knows that there's a line a visible line on the stage and when you're in front of that line you're speaking to everybody and you're in their time and when you step behind the line you're in timelessness and you're in a time which includes your grandparents still alive and things like that So it's very interesting.

[57:18]

You'll have somebody speaking, da-da-da, and then they stop. They just step back, and if you don't know the rules, you wonder why they're talking to their dead grandmother. And in Amunahashidate, which is a little peninsula, a little place out on the west coast, Midwestern coast of Japan. And on this small peninsula, what is it called? Amanohashidate. You've been there. And so has Martin and so has Beate. We all took a trip to Japan once. And it has this sort of peninsula that stretches out in the sea, away from the mainland.

[58:20]

and if you it's called the bridge of the gods means bridge of the gods and if you want to see the gods you want to look into the land of the gods you look like this oh and then you see it because it it just happens that when you look like that upside down, it looks like this is floating in space. But it's an interesting conception of space because it suggests that divine and sacred space is folded in ordinary space. It's not up in heaven somewhere. And it only takes a different way of looking to see the divinity of space. This is a quite interesting way of looking at things, a little different than our way of looking at things.

[59:43]

It's sort of like heaven is folded in here, but it's not open to you unless you have a third eye. Or third ear. Or third nose. Anyway. Or a thousand arms. Okay. Now again, Mayan Buddhism brought into China a teaching that conflicted with the local spiritual traditions of sacred space. And there was, we can say, a homogenization of space. Now, that's partly, you know, when I put my little bowing cloth down. In the zendo.

[60:43]

If you've noticed, it makes a little mandala. And this actually is part of this Mahayana shift to a new kind of space. Because the idea is that's the Bodhi Mandala. And you can make it two or three different ways. But it means that wherever you are is the spot of enlightenment. So it means whether this space is dilute or concentrated or sacred or not sacred, this space can be the spot of enlightenment.

[61:47]

So that's interesting. It means this homogenization of space where space is everywhere equal. It means that any spot can be the spot of enlightenment. And of course this space which is everywhere equal is also everywhere empty. So what does this mean? Why am I talking about this in relation to path? Because the Mahayana conception of path is that path is always arriving at the present. That to be on the path is to keep arriving in the present.

[62:58]

To be on the path is to keep arriving where you start. So there can't be any conception of lack. Because as I often give you the little mantra, just now is enough. Now you may not feel it's enough, but there's some kind of faith that just now also has to be enough. And there's a kind of counterintuitive science to it. I'd say counter-intuitive counter-intuitive goes against our usual logic that life is in front of us unfolding in front of us but it's scientific in that if we study there only is this present moment So as I said, I started this morning talking about the provisions you need.

[64:16]

And there's some traditional teaching of the path of equipment, the path of preparation, the path of seeing. And path of studying the world. And as I said again, some of the provisions or equipment are the ability to concentrate, the ability to have confidence or a healthy conscious attitude. As I say, quoting the Pali Abhidharma, belonging to a world of sensuous relatedness permeated by serenity joined to knowledge

[65:35]

Now all, as I started this morning, all events are, maybe I'll get a little too far out here, but as I told you, it's just notes on the way to a path. So if you don't mind, I have to feel my way into how to talk about this a little bit. I spoke yesterday about sparsha, of this sense of that mental perception. So the Vijnanas are not so much about the palpable senses of nose, ears, eyes and mouth, Because in that sense we have five senses. But if we think of it as terms of perception, we have six perceptual modes.

[67:02]

And all perception in the end is a mental event. So whatever you see or do is a mental event. And you brought up somebody about heat or warmth. So there's a kind of... Each moment is... and I know this sounds a little peculiar or poetic, a warm address. Yeah, that's right. You address each moment. And you address it with what is called in Buddhism traditionally heat or warmth. Because you're alive. And warmth means you bring concentration to it. Or you bring focus to it.

[68:11]

It's almost like a little furnace. You generate the moment. You create the present. so when you create yeah when you create each present when you arrive at each address of the present the present is your address and you address the present you you Each moment then is the end of the path and the next step of the path. Is the end of the path and the next step of the path.

[69:13]

Although the Mahayana kind of changed the sense of fragmented space, And although the Mahayana has changed the understanding of the divided space, it has built into it the sense of two spaces folded together, an absolute space and a relative space, or the teaching of the two truths. And what became important is a sense of timelessness in the midst of time. And you're on the path, the more each moment of time becomes a moment of timelessness. And then one of the conceptions of space was the Tathagatagarbha which is to view the world not as the space of geometry or the bent space of Einstein or the perhaps homogeneous space of Newton

[70:35]

But as if you are in the midst of fertility. A spreading out which is a womb. And a particularity which is a seed. And so Tathagatagarbha means womb seed or womb embryo thusness. And it's a name for the Buddha. But it's also a name for everything all at once. Now, when you have a concept that where we live is womb, seed, thusness, you basically, that's an attitude, that's a mental posture.

[71:53]

And in fact, I see in Buddhism there's no naturalness. There's no natural. Let's just be natural, folks. And cool. Because from the point of view of Buddhism, to be natural is a posture. And we know to be cool is a posture. So you need postures if only that are antidotes to the postures that your society gives you. So the construction of attitudes, which is also part of intention, the construction of attitude and intention is also an attitude. is the entering the path.

[73:10]

And one aspect of the path is not who you were in the past or not the vision or imagination of who you can be in the future but the vision of what you would like human beings to be like. And there can't be the sense that you were like that in the past. Because then there'd be some idea of inherent nature and stuff. And it can't be in the future. So the sense that the fullest possibilities are the kind of person you'd like to exist on the planet. The potentialities of realizing that have to be right here. In the sense that there's a kind of Buddha space folded into ordinary person space. So you need some confidence and absorption. The ability to open yourself to the immediacy.

[74:37]

And so these simple ideas of relaxation and openness are also ways of saying, don't bring the past into the present. If you're not relaxed, you're bringing the past into the present. Or worries about the future into the present. So in an ordinary and profound sense, practice is to discover deep relaxation and openness. And openness is a kind of human synonym for emptiness. Just somebody was sitting right here the first time we talked. I remember the sacred space they occupied. I don't remember which person, which of you it was.

[75:51]

Sort of I do. Said that isn't a freedom from differentiation a movement toward emptiness something like that and that sense of it is right openness is an openness to differentiation But to be open to differentiation you have to be free from differentiation, not caught by differentiation. You have to be free from differentiation to be open to differentiation. So openness is a synonym for emptiness, a gate of emptiness.

[76:56]

So this practice of openness and relaxation are also provisions of the past. Okay, so let me go back. I used the word sparsha. I should stop in a minute. Sparsha, then, if every perception is actually a mental address, This is especially so of non-sensuous objects. So that mentation as a sense, mind as a sense, is not just from inner objects originate, An inner object of procession, like memory, originates, but outer objects also originate, like the feeling of the totality of this moment.

[78:14]

Now, to bring the totality of this moment together again takes heat or concentration. an openness of the heart, a feeling of connectedness, that then you bring together in a particular dharma or moment, and to keep doing that each moment is the path. And it more and more widens and includes your teacher, your friends, etc. And if even they don't know it, you feel they're included. So even people on a different path, you feel they're on the same path. Because your path becomes so wide It includes whatever is present.

[79:28]

So that's also a sign that you're on the path. When you feel each moment is your own path. And includes whatever you see, feel, hear. Yeah, well, that's the best I could do. From my notes on the way to a path. Mm-hmm. This profound stability when you feel yourself in timelessness. As Taru said, when there's really no place to go. And nothing to do. Although I know we soon have to have dinner and I have to... But these two spaces are folded together. And we move in and out of them.

[80:37]

And the pulse of moving in and out of them is also the path. Okay, thank you very much. We're having such beautiful days, particularly to have discussion outside on the lawn. It feels like today you could barely come in. I thought Gerald had forgotten me, so I came wandering down. I would never forget you. Me too.

[82:04]

Okay, so what should we talk about? Yeah. Please. Yes. to this passage in the last chapter. He recognized that all five skandhas are free from their own self and was free from all suffering. So let's go back to this, from all suffering, to this special suffering, what can he say, what exactly does it look like? Are you going to translate? It's still better to do it in little sections, I think. I had the idea that it would be nice if you could say something about this passage in the Heart Sutra, perceived that all five skandhas... Emptying their own being.

[83:37]

Emptying their own being and was freed from all suffering, the special suffering. What's the difference between this suffering I mean, the main suffering still stays when we are ill, or someone dies, friends or parents or so. What are the characteristics of this special suffering, discrete from what the deceased of us can experience? It means freed from the suffering that arises from the delusion of self. Doesn't mean you're freed from physical suffering. Okay? And it doesn't free you from, as I say, neurotic suffering.

[85:03]

But if you practice really thoroughly, it probably also frees you from neurotic and emotional suffering. It certainly makes it easier to work with your neurotic habits. And changes your relationship to physical pain. So this own being, first we didn't have it in there in the 60s sometime, and then to make it more clear, I think it was actually Lou Richman who suggested we put own being in there. So it's... We're free of the own being of skandhas.

[86:21]

The sense that the skandhas have some inherent or permanent reality. And to really know that, not just intellectually know that, changes everything. But, you know, I would actually like to do another English version of this, which then might get translated into German. And it's a little too formulaic here. Not formal, like a formula, like a mathematical formula. But that way it's more mantra-like or dharanic.

[87:30]

But it's harder to understand. It needs more commentary that way. Something else? Yes. Yes, to stay with the skandhas. I brought in in our group that what I thought about the other night through, after you talked about the skandhas, when you said people who meditate or sportsmen or had a near-death experience, are able to experience what is meant by the form skandha through circumstances, not necessarily easily, but through circumstances. Yeah, and I myself didn't realize that this was form.

[88:36]

I know I can slow down a time through this. Deutsch, bitte. Ich selber habe nicht so sehr erfahren, dass ich die Form verstehe, oder sie wirklich einzeln abtrennen kann von allem, sondern ich weiß, dass ich dadurch die Zeit verlangsamen kann. And then, I thought of another experience I also had, an in-between place between having died and reborn again. And this was a much deeper place. And then suddenly the five bardels came in my mind. The five bardels. Oh, yeah. OK. When you are in this place, you are in another state, in another level of consciousness than in just putting all these things in piles. In thinking of the Babel-Dos, I thought, how deep can I go?

[89:44]

Will I ever experience or be able to experience all the other four kinds of skandhas that already form this place? How deep can I still go? German, please. I hope you can hear me. Yes, it occurred to me, I don't know where I stopped in German. I thought of the Baros and compared them with these five standards. I also had another experience, such a space between being dead and being reborn. It was in a Holotropic Rest Experience. Then I came up with the five bardas. With each barda I come deeper into the essence. And then I thought, how deep can I go at all?

[90:49]

In the experience of form and in the separation of form, and I am not in this everyday being, to be able to throw every single one on top, but I am on this other place. How deep can I then still be as a living human being, as a living being, still go? No, I don't think it's useful to ask yourself that question. And I don't think it's even useful usually to even try to name our experiences. As bardos or whatever. I do think it's important as... one of the five fears to overcome, the fear of unusual states of mind.

[91:55]

I think we need to be able to be open to states of mind and body that we haven't experienced before. And the teachings of Buddhism about these things aren't about real places. Okay, it's just that I call them when I have to name it, I just pick it out. So there are maybe millions of such places. Like each moment is different and there can be so many different kind of experiences we have.

[93:00]

They do fall into some kind of pattern. And one of the reasons for teaching the five skandhas is is to give you a feeling for what Buddhism has decided is the most basic pattern conditioned arising falls into. The most basic pattern that conditioned arising falls into. And I think to teach it also gives us some permission to notice our experience. But beyond that it's better just to see what happens when you practice it. So the point is not to put things into five heaps.

[94:21]

But what happens when you put things into five heaps? In other words, the process of naming and saying, oh, that's this, that's this, that process is a concentrating process. What arises from that process is more subtle than the five skandhas. But if you start thinking, oh, this is this kind, then a kind of self is operating. Then you become an inner astronaut. I landed on Bardo 3. And I brought my golf clubs.

[95:24]

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