You see on the first group three, is it? No, group three. In under group three, subset A, those are the Mahabhumika, which means the universal ones, remember? So there they are. Those ten that are present with all states of consciousness. It's number 22. And also, maybe I'll mention at this point, too, that some people are thinking, well, with every state of consciousness, there must also be like, I think Drace said, something about life and warmth.

[01:03]

And... Ed said something, well, there must be energy. If you look at, there's a category called elements neither substantial forms nor mental function, which is the fourth group. Under that group, you see... 65. Life. And sometimes it's defined as warmth. It's kind of energy. And that factor probably is associated with all living consciousness. But it's not a mental factor. It's not...

[02:04]

a mental function. So these 10 that we were talking about before are 10 mental functions that accompany consciousness. But this quality of life, of course, is associated with consciousness, but it's not a mental factor. Also, let's see. Later, it will be relevant to you to know about the mental factors, the elements, or the dharmas under category four, which are number 66, 67, 68, and 69. These are called dharmas. But another way it is sometimes described are the four phases, the four phases of all phenomena.

[03:12]

In other words, all phenomena have to birth, develop some stability, start to deteriorate, and then cease. So those aren't mental factors. Those are principles which yogis have and scientists have been convinced of, which characterize all phenomena. So those are always present, too. So in that category, in that whole series there, a lot of those things are characteristic of things, of mental function, but they aren't mental functions. And actually on the page there, there are words which represent ideas, which represent supposedly actual actual objects, actual phenomena. And I may get back to this before the practice period is over in terms of looking at how to meditate on phenomena in light of these four phases of all phenomena.

[04:26]

I'd like to start by reviewing that there are two paths of meditation. And Sanskrit is worth learning among the languages. It's a very nice language to learn. And here's another Sanskrit word for you. It's bhava, which means bhava, b-h-a-v-a, bhava. It means being or existence.

[05:33]

And I didn't mean to get into this, but I just can't help but mention the Chinese word, which corresponds to this, which is pronounced in Chinese, you, and in Japanese it's pronounced oo. And it also means being or existence, but in addition it means to have. And I wonder, I'm not sure, if bhava in Sanskrit means to have also. But anyway, whether it does or not, the Chinese, the word the Chinese use for being or existence, also means to have or possess. Interesting association, huh? What? In Chinese, it... Yeah, it's been there, isn't it? It's bhava. Yes?

[06:46]

Linguistically, there's an Indo-European root of all Western languages, not Oriental languages, and similarities with tales such as have and blah. I don't know where have comes from, but it would be that it comes directly from the Indo-European root. Yeah, maybe if somebody wants to look up have in the dictionary, maybe it's got something to do with blah or something that would be interesting to know. But there's something about that, right? That in existence you have something. When there's being, you have something. And part of the problem of being, I mean, there's positives to sides of being, right? But one of the problems of this wonderful thing called being or existence is that you have stuff. And having stuff tends to get in the way of freedom, because you're carrying, you've got to hold on to all this stuff, otherwise you lose your existence, right? You know what I mean? You got being, and then you got the stuff you have, and you think, well, okay.

[07:49]

Now, I wonder what would happen if I let go of all the stuff I have. Would I still be? Yikes. Is that the character for the moon? Well, you know, there's a similarity. This is the character for moon. So, this part under here is like character for moon. It's like a house on the moon, or it's like the moon with this little branch above it. Anyway, this is the... I didn't mean to get into that, but I did. And so that's bhava. And then there's this other word. Bye-bye, bhava. And then hello, bhava. Again, bhava. And then put an N on the end. Bhavana. And bhavana means to become or to come into being.

[08:54]

And bhavana is the word also means meditation. Or, you know, practice, cultivation. So bhavana is the to bring into being, to bring something into being, to make it exist, to bring it into existence. And then the Sanskrit word for path is marga. So bhavana marga is the path of meditation. And there's two paths of meditation. One is called laukika, Bhavana Marga, in other words, the worldly, or path of meditation in the world, and then Lokottara Bhavana Marga, which transcends the world.

[09:57]

There's two Bhavana Margas. The first Bhavana Marga, in a sense, is Samadhi type number two. That's the worldly Bhavana Marga. That's the way you practice meditation while you still hold on to something. In particular, you still hold on to the view of independent existence of the self of a person. That make sense, Jill? You tutor for kinds of meditation. Write him in Sanskrit, you mean? In English? Sanskrit. Okay. Write the Sanskrit word in English letters? Do you mean write Romanized Sanskrit?

[11:01]

Yes. Lakika Davana Marga M-A-R-G-A Lakika Davana Marga and then Uttara It's locotara. Locotara. A loka, see, laukika, loka means world, and so you make something of the world, you say laukika instead of loka, so of the world, and loka uttara. Uttara means beyond.

[12:03]

So you put uttara together with loka, and you get Lokottara. So, Laukika Bhavana Marga and Lokottara Bhavana Marga. Those are the two types. Lokottara Bhavana Marga starts where? Three, right? And again, in some sense, when you're training to enter three, when you start beyond just developing... beyond just developing samadhi, while still holding the belief in the substantial existence of a person, while you still hold that and have samadhi, and you start to train at analysis of this belief, examining your belief in your independent existence of the person,

[13:04]

as you start to train and examining, analyzing this belief, and maybe starting to question this belief and start to refute this belief and start to loosen this belief, prior to its dropping, you're still doing, you're still in Samadhi number two. You're training in three, but you're still in number two. But you're planning to leave and enter into... the samadhi number three. Samadhi number three, strictly speaking, you will be entered after you finish your training in it, and after you drop the view, the view of substantial existence of a self, sat kaya drishti. Drishti, the view, sat, the existence, and another word for existence, and kaya, the body, like belief in the body, the substantial body of the self.

[14:12]

So when you drop that, you actually enter in number three. Now, once you enter there, you are, strictly speaking, on the Buddhist path, and your meditation practice now is super mundane meditation practice. In between the two types of meditation practice is another path called the path of seeing, And I'll write that word too. That's darshana. D-A-R. That's with a little slash over the top making like a S-H. Darshana, which means vision or seeing. So between the worldly meditation path and the super mundane... meditation practice, between those two is another path, the path of vision. And the path of vision is super mundane. So again, super mundane.

[15:14]

The path of vision is you start to see the beginning of ultimate truth. You start to see the way you ultimately exist. Yeah, you get to see how people ultimately exist. So there's just one kind of path of seeing, and it's super mundane. It is before three? No, it is entering into three. It is the entry path. And then after you do that, then under three, you continue the path of meditation, which I mentioned yesterday, where you start to wash away the habits which were... developed under the auspices of the misconception of an inherently existing soul. Now, before I answer May's question, I just want to mention that this is a super mundane path of holiness.

[16:19]

People become arhat under this, number three, under this set up. Buddha, you know, became an arhat with these meditations. And so the Mahayana says the Bodhisattva gives up the mundane meditation path, this mundane meditation path, and also gives up the super-mundane meditation path. But it doesn't hold on to either one of them. It goes beyond even the path of realizing the emptiness of the person. and goes on to realize the emptiness of other things beyond and more subtle than persons. What case? In four. In four, yeah. So, Darshan and Marga is not a path of meditation?

[17:20]

Right, it's not a path of meditation. Well, it's a path of meditation, but it's not called a path of meditation. There's no... Is it a gate? It's a path of meditation, but it's purely inside meditation. You're not working on developing samadhi in that path. You're just working on vision, just clarifying vision. Now, you have enough samadhi to do that, which you developed sort of on the worldly plane of self, other, blah, blah. But... It's not called a path to meditation because in some sense you don't, you know, you're not bringing something into being, you're just clarifying the way things are. So the other two are called paths of, the other two are called bhavanamargas, and that's not called bhavanamarga, but it sets up the one kind of bhavanamarga, and it's based on the other kind of bhavanamarga, having reached its culmination.

[18:25]

Okay? It's bizarre. Yeah, our hearts are enlightened, definitely. We have four basic stages under the Samadhi program number three. The first one is the stream-enterer. Stream-enterer is you enter through Darshana Marga. Once you're in Darshana Marga, you're a stream-enterer. You've entered the stream of the Buddhist practice. And you have changed, you know, you have been permanently transformed into a, you know, you're a saint. Unless you're a bodhisattva too. Bodhisattvas are sinners for the welfare of all beings. And... And then the next stage is called once-returner.

[19:31]

It means you have to take rebirth one more time. And the next stage is called never-returner. It means you don't have to take rebirth again. But you're not an Arhat yet. But you will be an Arhat after you die. And the next stage is an Arhat. Actually, somebody's walking around with a body who is perfectly purified personally. You know, amazing. Perfectly purified person. Our hearts don't come back. Our hearts don't come back and they don't want to. They just go to nirvana and that's it. That's the theory of their life. Now there's some debate about whether they really get to do that. The Lotus Sutra says that when actually they come to the... you know, to the place of perfect nirvana, the Buddha is sitting there saying, I've got an assignment for you. I know you're going to be surprised, but it's really a good deal.

[20:35]

You are going to be a Buddha. I mean, you know, you're going to be a Buddha. Really? Yeah. You want to know your name and what it's going to look like there? Yeah. So he tells them their name and, you know, what kind of landscape there's going to be in this Buddha land. What his students are going to be like, and what her students' names are going to be, and what kind of teaching they're going to be doing. They're shocked, but happy. He promotes them. He promotes them, yeah. He promotes them, so there's more work to do. You've done a great deal, and now you get to take on the Buddha, the Buddha work, rather than just our heart work. When it's said that a being doesn't have to come back, I think that already implied that non-existence is proportional existence, assuming a being doesn't belong to it.

[21:42]

Well, you know, you can draw an implication and the person might not mean to infer that, right? I mean, you can infer that, but they might not mean to imply that. You can make that inference, and it certainly is understandable. And I think, again, part of what may have happened in India after the Buddha went away is that people may have thought that that was an implication of his teaching, that non-existence is better than existence. But non-duality is not saying non-existence is better than existence. It's not saying existence is better than non-existence either. Now, the thing is that, of course, when you're in existence, you tend to think existence is... A lot of people think existence is better. Some people don't and try to commit suicide because they think non-existence is better. They don't know about the fact that suicide doesn't accomplish it.

[22:45]

You have to be an arhat to actually get non-existence. So... It's a mistake, but they do have that preference. And that's, again, part of the problem of existence is that it makes it hard for us to see sometimes that non-existence is not worse than existence. And again, that life is not better than death. And because of having a preference for life, we're less effective at benefiting beings for our lives. It turns out that if you don't prefer life over death, if you don't prefer one over the other, you're better able to care for living beings because you don't have outflows. No fear. And also no fear. No fear of death and no fear of life if you don't prefer one over the other.

[23:50]

And then you can do all kinds of wonderful things, like an aspect of not preferring one over the other is that you won't be afraid of being killed. And if you won't be afraid of being killed, then nobody can make you kill. Nobody can frighten you into killing. You say, if you don't kill this person, I'm going to kill you. Okay, I'll kill him. But if you're not afraid of being killed, you won't kill. You might get killed if you're not afraid of being killed. But you won't kill. So, anyway, the non-duality of existence and non-existence, I think, we understand that's the Buddha's teaching. The Buddha did not have preference for the living over the dead. The Buddha was free of preference. And therefore the Buddha was free.

[24:50]

And being free, the Buddha was also able to fulfill his dream of benefiting all beings and helping all beings become free of death by not preferring birth. And become free of birth by not preferring death. It's like we almost can't help having a practice that we talk about, like sustaining life or, you know, when we say may all beings be happy, it seems like we're talking about living beings. It seems like we almost can't help it once you check life or sustain life. Living beings, I think living beings don't seem to be able to help wanting to be happy. It seems like built-in part of the deal is to want to be happy. And the more you understand that, the more you want everybody to be happy. And then it turns out that if you want to accomplish happiness, then not preferring happiness will be very helpful. Those who are unhappy but are not unhappy about being unhappy are happy.

[25:59]

And they can help others, and there's plenty of them who are unhappy, be happy while they're still unhappy. by giving up their preference for happiness. But of course it's very difficult. It's in our tissues, right? This thing about wanting to inhale and exhale is very powerful. Any questions before we go on? Elizabeth? Does Arhat know they're Arhat? A lot of times they do. You wouldn't know he was an Arhat. He said, I'm totally content. My heart is content. I'm at peace. I've accomplished my work. Speaking conventionally, but also you could say speaking as a... Yeah, speaking conventionally, he...

[27:11]

He knew he was free. I'm free. He said, you know, you may think, you may wonder if I'm free. Well, I am. So he knew. And if you look at the stories of other arhats, they knew. But some arhats might not, just might not know that. And Buddha might mention to them that they are. You're free. Oh, okay. It might not occur to them. They have other things to do. Like, enjoy it. Or skip along the road. Or whistle a happy tune. There's various things they might do. And one of them is think, oh, I'm an Arnhot. Or I'm free. So they don't necessarily know. And Buddhas also, I think, do not necessarily think, go around thinking that they're Buddhas. But they can think that. They just, you know, they're not necessarily thinking that. Yes. When Buddha told his assembly that everybody would become a Tathagatha, was he meeting a Samadhi number four?

[28:21]

Was he what? He mean that they would all get Samadhi number four? Yeah, and he was looking at them, and he was in Samadhi number four, and he was looking at them in that Samadhi, and in that Samadhi, in that Samadhi you can see these amazing things, like in that Samadhi you can see... If you're a Buddha, you can actually see Vivi's future. You can see Vivi becoming a Buddha. And you can actually see other people becoming Buddha. He actually can see it. So he was telling what he saw in that omniscience. Buddha could see that beings are heading in the particular way that they're heading for enlightenment. Yes? Yesterday, during your discussions, you spoke about suppression during meditation. And you implied... Attempts of suppression. Right.

[29:22]

Yes. And the implication was that it's kind of a dangerous thing to suppress, because it's sort of... That's an implication? That was your implication. That's your inference. That was my inference. Yeah, but it wasn't my implication. But you're right, it is dangerous. Okay, let's just say that again. I would suggest that it's dangerous to try to suppress anything. Dangerous to suppress things. Dangerous. Also, it's dangerous not to suppress things. Can I say something more? About the suppression thing? Can I ask my question? Sure. I'm not going to suppress you. That would be dangerous. I'll rest my case.

[30:29]

You see? See how I read? And then, after this freedom... She remembers her question. Little Buddha said that when you're having unwholesome thoughts, one of the ways is to suppress those unwholesome thoughts. He probably did. Pardon? Isn't most of our meditation unwholesome? I have recently done a survey. And so far, the returns are that most people's meditation is mostly unwholesome. So then Jackie's saying, didn't Buddha say that we should suppress unwholesome things? Didn't he say we should suppress them? And again, ladies and gentlemen, we do not know. We do not know what Buddha said.

[31:33]

We do not know what Buddha said. To say it Do you know what Buddha said is either BS or it is a religious, you know, a statement of faith? We don't know what Buddha said, but we have heard that people say, I have heard. And if you look in meditation, Buddhist meditation text, you will see that one of the ways of dealing with unwholesome thought forms is suppression. It's one of the ways. So unwholesome thought forms do make it more difficult to practice worldly meditation, and spiritual meditation thrives on the difficulties of obstacles and unwholesome thoughts. But still, they're difficult.

[32:36]

In any case, they're difficult. They're big challenges. So examples of unwholesome or unfortunate forms of thought are like ill will, like actually hoping ill for somebody, possessiveness, greediness, laziness, restlessness, worry, doubt in the teaching. These are examples. Yes? So with those thoughts, there's no samadhi, right? Wrong. Wrong. No. There are obstructions to samadhi. They're listed as some obstructions to meditation. But even though there are obstructions, it doesn't mean there isn't any meditation. It just means if you handle these obstructions in a skillful way, there's samadhi. If you...

[33:37]

if you cling and grasp and fight these things, fight these demons, then the samadhi is still there, but you don't see it because you're too busy fighting obstructions. So I'm just saying that there are these obstructions or hindrances to meditation, and there's various instructions given about what to do about them. Would you like me to mention some of those? Well, I would say in some sense, some people's understanding of Buddha's teaching is the technique of last resort of dealing with hindrances. The technique of last resort is suppression. So sometimes Buddha didn't say, suppression! or I don't know what, maybe Buddha didn't say that.

[34:40]

Maybe Buddha did say, suppress it, kid. There's an example of that. Buddha was walking around on the Indian subcontinent 2,500 years ago. This woman came to him who was totally insane for good reasons. You know, her whole family had been murdered and slaughtered. She was totally crazy. She came up to the Buddha. wandered up to the Buddha, nude, more or less, covered with filth, totally insane. And Buddha said, snap out of it, sister. You know, he didn't say suppress it. He just said, you know, drop off, you know, snap out of it. Regain your state of mind, your presence of mind, sister. And she did. So you could interpret that as suppress it. But he also, he always interpreted, he said, drop it, drop it. Just drop your insanity and wake up. She did, pretty much.

[35:41]

And she became one of our acharyas. She's on the list. She became an arhat. Huh? Which one? Which one, folks? Yeah. Patichara. But before that, there's lots of other techniques. Lots of other ways of dealing with hindrances. that aren't suppression, okay? But when you do suppression, it is dangerous. And if you don't do suppression to these things, they're dangerous. The question is, which way leads to liberation? There's danger either way, suppression or non-suppression. And I think, generally speaking, suppression is just a short-term damage control to get through the next few minutes. In the long run, you're not going to become free by suppressing things because it's nonsensical to suppress things.

[36:42]

You can't suppress things. But there's lots of other techniques. Instead of suppressing anger, ill will, practice loving kindness. Loving kindness doesn't have to be seen at all as suppressing anything. It's rather generating warmth and love and goodwill and good feelings for beings. That's like an antidote. rather than a suppression, and for being distracted. The meditations on serious topics snap you out of that. But you're not really suppressing the distraction. You're just turning your attention to something that, when you look at the other thing, the lack of attention and distractedness just drop away. But one of the ways the Buddha... which is the way that I'm stressing because this is the one I think is the closest to doing nothing and I like to recommend a meditation that's almost doing nothing because any meditation where you're doing something then you have to stop doing that thing to enter into non-duality so I like to have as little as possible that you have to do in order to enter the samadhi so one of the other ways of dealing with

[38:06]

that are coming to you is the way, that simple way that I mentioned the other day. In the scene, there'll be just a scene. In the herd, there'll be just a herd. That's also what Buddha taught. Okay? If you deal with phenomena that come that way, the unwholesome thoughts won't even arise in the first place. So, there's... There's things called the four right efforts, and four right efforts are part of samadhi practice in early Buddhism. Four right efforts. First right effort is to prevent unwholesome thoughts from arising. Not to suppress them. They haven't even happened yet. Prevent them from arising. How do you prevent unwholesome thoughts from arising? In the scene. Pardon? In the scene. In the scene, there's just a scene. When that's the way it is for you, unwholesome thoughts do not arise.

[39:10]

They just don't arise. And training the attention to let the scene just be the scene is the same as not grasping the scene or rejecting the scene or seeking any other scene when the scene is like this. So it's non-grasping and non-seeking. It's the practice of suchness. And this is a virtually, well, very extensively subtle practice. But if you practice that way, the unwholesome thoughts won't even arise in the first place. Now, once they arise, if you practice that way, they're very likely to just drop away. Now, if they don't drop away, the question is whether you're going to continue practice that way. or to resort to some other method, like, for example, an antidote. So if there's ill will, and you just let the thought, you know, the cognition of ill will, just let the ill will be the ill will, you can really just do that, in other words, confess it very cleanly, then the next right effort is to drop or eliminate the unwholesome thoughts which have arisen.

[40:29]

And then that's where those antidotes, the last one of which, in my opinion, is suppression. But along the list, and I put it first, is just face it. Just clearly observe the unwholesome thought that has arisen. And if you clearly observe the unwholesome thought that has arisen, you know how to do that. The unwholesome thought does cease. It does cease. It ceases anyway, but you get to see it cease. And see, oh yeah, wow, it ceased. Now it may come again, but probably won't, not right away, because you're doing a meditation which prevents it from arising. The unwholesome thought probably arises because you're not, not probably. The unwholesome thoughts arise because we're not clearly observed. When we're not clearly observing, unwholesome thoughts naturally crop up, easily crop up. Not always, but often do. Because we're not vigilant, we're not... Now, diligent, we aren't loving the practice of clearly observing, of letting the seen be the seen and the heard be the heard.

[41:36]

We're slipping. So when we slip, naturally, unwholesome thoughts arise. Then if we recover and do the practice, then unwholesome thoughts end. It's not because the clearly observing makes them end. They naturally end. They arise and they cease. So they cease. Now if you continue the meditation, they won't arise again. So that's the second one. The third one is... Make wholesome thoughts arise. Well, make wholesome thoughts arise means you don't have to make anything arise. Just let the scene be the scene and the herd be the herd and wholesome thoughts will arise more and more. And then once wholesome thoughts arise, protect them and maintain them. How do you maintain a wholesome thought? Clearly observe it. So wholesome thoughts thrive and are maintained in clear observation. and become more fluorescent and abundant in clear meditation, clear observation, clearly observing.

[42:37]

Unwholesome thoughts naturally end and don't reappear or don't even arise at all. So those are ways of dealing with all this stuff in early teachings. Okay? Do you have any techniques for the rush lifting? Any techniques? I have plenty of techniques for grasping. But you have just as many as I do, probably, so you can remove it from me. I do. You need some more? For non-grasping. For non-grasping. Any techniques? Yeah. My main technique for non-grasping, ladies and gentlemen, tell her, what is it? Huh? Non-grasping. Well, I didn't know I had that many. I thought my main technique for non-grasping was not to have a technique. or non-grasping. I've got nothing. That's my main technique. And I'm trying to give that one up. But apparently I've got some other ones too, like clearly observing, relaxing with whatever comes.

[43:42]

Another one is like, say welcome to everything comes. Another one is like, whatever comes, consider it the Buddha Dharma. And don't try to be possessive of the Buddha Dharma. Just say thank you very much and don't, I'm not going to ask for any more. I didn't mean that to work so well. Yes? Well, I always thought about unwholesome thoughts. Is it an unwholesome thought about an unwholesome thought? Let me take this down. When something defined as an unwholesome thought arises, who knows where, if you're meditating on the arising of this phenomenon, and clearly observing it, Wouldn't it lose its category as wholesome or unwholesome by a non-dual observer just holding it as a... Come on. It doesn't... No. It doesn't belong to you. No. It will still be an unwholesome thought, but it would have no power. To wish somebody... To think, to have a thought.

[44:43]

I hope harm for some being. That's an unwholesome thought. But who's the creator of a thought? You don't have to get into that. Do you? That's kind of in person, too. That's kind of in person. Unless you've been assigned that question. But some thought like that, okay, if you clearly observe that thought, if you clearly see that thought, it loses its power. If you don't grasp that thought... it can't grasp you. If you fight it and you try to get rid of, like, which a lot of Zen students do, they have thoughts of killing people nearby. And then they go, and then they go, oh no, oh no, get out of here, get out of here, or I'm a terrible person, get out of here. You know, they're trying to get rid of the bad thought and get rid of themselves and, you know, it's just to really, like, get rid of his practices, get rid of, get rid of his ill will, you know.

[45:47]

So, A lot of the students are like, have ill will, and then they don't want to have ill will, so then they have more ill will, and then they notice that, and they have more ill will towards all the ill will that's going to... Well, you know, as it's growing, how can I, like, accept it? Why don't you accept it before it gets big? Because after it really gets big, you're going to have to accept it. But most people have to let it get really big before they say, okay, I'm angry. Okay, I admit it. At some point, you have to stop fighting it. Because the more you fight anger, the more it grows. Anger grows on anger. Anger does not grow. It just goes there and works on it. And then another unwholesome thought. The samadhi goes there and works on it. Another unwholesome thought. So the samadhi can grow just as well on unwholesome thoughts as wholesome thoughts. In some ways even better because, you know... More of them. There's more of them. And also, they require more subtlety, you know. They're more difficult. They require more subtle... learning how not to grasp.

[46:48]

Wholesome thoughts, the nice thing about wholesome thoughts is they're easier not to grasp. The results of wholesome thoughts, however, are hard not to grasp because the results of wholesome thoughts are, you know, nice stuff. So that's hard not to grasp. So wholesome practices promote not grasping the wholesome practices. Unwholesome behavior promotes grasping wholesome and promotes grasping all over the place. But non-grasping applied to unwholesome, the unwholesome loses its power. But the unwholesome one is basically what he called, I think it's Dostoevsky's term, that evil is the indestructible principality. We're not going to eliminate evil. Evil continues to be an opportunity for practice of the bodhisattva way, for non-attachment. Evil's opportunity to clearly observe and take the you know, power system away from the evil.

[47:49]

But if you fight evil, or if I fight evil, evil just gets more energy. Of course, if you like evil, it also gets more energy. So, like it, dislike it, it grows. Fight the devil, join the devil, it grows. But just, you know, really get the joke about the devil. The devil kind of goes, what? Yes. Yeah, I had a question about accepting evil, or if I take the example of anger, if I accept my anger, versus something that I read recently, which is look after your anger or love your anger. Kind of similar. Is there a difference there? It's a difference, but it's kind of the same ballpark. Accept, befriend to the anger. But like if you have an angry child, you know? Don't kill the child for being angry. Just a little guy. Doesn't know any better.

[48:50]

He's learning how to do this now. Help him. Help him not hurt himself or anybody else. In a loving way. Show him love. And also, it's very important to show him that love is cooler than hate. For me, I've told that story many times. I was intentionally trying to be as bad as possible. Because unwholesome is... was much more popular when I was a kid than wholesome. You know, Elvis Presley's older than me, but, you know, I hit puberty when he was hitting his stardom, you know, so basically he was not like a good guy. You know, he was a kind of partly a symbol of evil, wasn't he? Sex. He was a bad boy, you know. So, and I was 12, and I knew that in Minnesota at that time, a 12-year-old could do anything would not be tried as an adult.

[49:57]

You could do anything. So I was going to do as bad as my conscience would let me, and I knew I'd be very popular for it in my neighborhood. And this guy sat me down, this big guy sat me down, and he said, you know, it's easy to be bad. And I knew that. It takes a little guts, but, you know, it's not that hard. He said, what's hard is to be good. And I thought, okay, I'll try it. So you've got to show, you've got to demonstrate to the evil activity, the ill will, the ill will, not just not a wholesome anger, but a ill will, actually wanting to hurt somebody, you've got to demonstrate to that this thing which is cooler, which is more flexible, which has more energy, which doesn't have upflows, which is more creative, actually. We're born of love, not of hate. So bring love, acceptance, all that to the hate.

[51:02]

And non-attachment is the ultimate love. because non-attachment isn't like, well, I don't care about you. Non-attachment is like being right there, exactly with what's happening, knowing more about it, knowing as much about it as anybody could know, because you're totally devoted to this event. You're totally devoted to the welfare of this event, to this event being beneficial to all beings. You're totally there, getting yourself completely and not attached, and not trying to get anything. This is non-attachment. This is not grasping. It's not grasping from a distance. It's not grasping up close and specific with it. So if it's anger, you bring that kind of clear observing where you're right there, real close, know all about it, really studying it, watching it come up, last, good way. You're right there, and no attachment. That's the way to deal with anger, and anger won't be harmful then. It'll just be... Just like a really good martial artist...

[52:04]

The dangerous person comes in, they can take care of that person, and nobody will get hurt, including the dangerous person. They won't hurt the person if they're really skillful. The person won't feel okay. The person won't take revenge later. They won't feel mistreated. They'll feel well cared for, and everyone will be protected. But we have to really be skillful to be that attentive and relaxed with a lot of energy that's moving very fast and strongly. And anger can be like that. That's part of the reason why people like anger is because they feel alive. So when that energy comes up and they feel alive, okay, how are we going to work with that? Whoa, it's hard. You've got to be relaxed. Okay? I think we're going to see Susan and Maya and Liz and who else? John, Susan, Maya, Liz. It's also in the lounge.

[53:15]

Susan, we'd like to clear them out of the bookstore. They're kind of like gathering moss. So these little videos want some attention. They need some salvation. In that video, I kind of just did the straight line from the early teachings kind of presentation of the way to deal with these hindrances. But I don't emphasize in that tape, which is what I'm emphasizing now. Of course, my prized one among them is just clearly observe the hindrance. Don't try to get rid of it. Don't try to suppress it. And that kind of loving attention, unwholesomeness loses its poison. It's not annihilated. Nothing's annihilated.

[54:21]

Nothing is annihilated in the Buddhadharma. We do not annihilate evil. We do not annihilate good. But evil is impermanent and good is impermanent. evil phenomena, wholesome, unwholesome phenomena are implemented, and so are wholesome. We deal with wholesome and unwholesome phenomena in this middle way, and then this brings peace. We believe, according to the teaching of the middle way, we believe that teaching. Mia? I want to go back to what you mean in the scene of the I think when you talked about it yesterday, you said this is on conceptual level? Yes. On perceptual level? Yes. So, does that mean, say, seeing the cup, just the cup, rather than blue shape?

[55:25]

Initially it means, initially it means, you're hearing words now? These are concepts. Buddha came into the world and started using words. Again, in the Samdhi Nirmocana Sutra it says, those who realize the ultimate, which is non-dual and inexpressible, designate conventional terms. So, like it says, like it used to say in the Jewel Mirror Samadhi, although it's not fabricated, it's not without speech. So Buddha's not fabricated, but Buddha talks, because Buddha is compassion. It's unfabricated compassion, and it talks. So although what it's talking about cannot be reached by concepts, those who realize that realm, they present concepts, verbal designations, to beings so beings can hear that. And when they hear them, they hear those things, and they convert them into concepts, and then they know the concepts. And then, so the concept initially is,

[56:26]

You hear my words, first of all, you hear my words, so when you hear my words, let my words just be my words. Listen to me that way. When you hear, in what you hear now, let the herd just be the herd. In other words, don't, and that's a concept, don't conceptually elaborate on that concept. Just let it be. In other words, don't grasp it, don't judge it, don't discurse a thought around it, don't tense up around it, physically or mentally. Just let it be, clearly observe it. and it's a concept and you're not conceptually elaborating on the concept because it's in the conceptual realm that we do our discursive thinking it's in the conceptual realm that we think self and other are separate we don't have a direct perception nobody has a direct perception of duality we only can have a direct perception of the idea And it's possible to have no conceptual mediation between the phenomena of the idea and conceptual collaboration of it.

[57:42]

And in that separation, we understand the emptiness of the idea. But starting out, anyway, we have ideas, we just let the ideas leave them alone. As that starts to happen... that we move into not identifying, not locating, no here and there with the ideas. And no here and there means, again, starting the conceptual separation starts to drop away. And we realize the emptiness of the self and other separation. It's still at that conceptual level. Then once we understand that, we might want to then enter into a... meditation of even meditating on that understanding. So we understand that that understanding is also empty. So we understand that our understanding is not our concept of the understanding. You know, like Cindy said, does Arhat know they're an Arhat?

[58:47]

When they think, oh, I'm an Arhat, that's not being an Arhat. That's thinking that they're an Arhat. There's no such thing, really, as being an arhat. And some arhats have not realized that. But that's what the Mahayana is about, is to realize that spiritual attainment are empty. That's why we have wisdom going beyond. So another way to talk about it is that in samadhi number four, three, you realize wisdom is And in Samaya number four, you realize wisdom which has gone beyond wisdom. Wisdom which has given up wisdom, which doesn't grasp wisdom as a thing, which realizes the emptiness of wisdom. Okay? So even in that initial destruction, where our attention usually is directed towards the conceptual, and learning a new way to deal with conceptual...

[59:52]

cognitions, which is mostly what we're aware of. The direct perceptions are also happening, but we barely notice them most of the time. But some people have told me in this group have told me of experiences, I think, where they have dropped through the flow of conception into direct perception. Maybe the impulse on my question was a kind of mental elaboration. But a question I was wondering about the last day. What is the power of conception non-grasping? How is it that those words are so powerful for us in entering this practice? I was wondering, is it because they come close to describing how things actually already are? When you say so powerful, do you mean feel so powerful or are actually so useful? It seems like it's useful.

[60:55]

Yeah. I think the reason, if you meant, if it was the former one, I was going to say because of good karma. In other words, if you hear the word non-grasping and it really strikes you very powerfully, I would say the reason that strikes you powerfully is because of your good karma. To have a word like that stop you, that's really very fortunate. A lot of people say non-attachment too. They can barely hear you. So, but if you want to know how come it works so well, I think it works so well because it addresses the fact, the fact, the phenomenon, that when we enter into spiritual practice, we drag our egocentric motivations into the spiritual practice of becoming free of egocentric motivations. So we defile the practice of becoming free from self-clinging by our self-clinging. We find a way that, like, you know, we just... people get more and more, actually more and more skillful at fooling themselves as they practice more.

[61:58]

That's usually what happens. So that's why we're trying to develop a way that will catch all these, where nobody's going to be able to get by with it anymore. So, like, if anybody's holding on to anything, we take this out and go... Attachment. Yeah, attachment, five yards. Seeking, push down. And so that's why I think it's so useful because, you know, some people are... really skillful at making this stuff up about attaining stuff and getting better and stuff like that.

[63:01]

And it just turns into another thing. So it's very subtle. But I think non-attachment and non-seeking really get to the core. At the same time, this practice must be in the context of a deep commitment to the welfare of all beings. So it doesn't turn into indifference. So you have to... always keep working on compassion and understand that that this is for me anyway this is a key this is a key aspect of compassion is this practicing non-attachment that you understand that this way of entering samadhi is a key element in the overall program of the six paramitas and particularly specifically the first five that they should all be practiced with non-attachment. And you look in the Paramita Sutras and he goes through the discussion of all these practices and these six Paramitas. He talks about this practice and that practice. And then after he describes each one of the practices, it says, and all this, all this generosity and all this ethical diligence and all this ethical discipline and all this patience and all this enthusiasm and effort and courage and all this samadhi, all this done through non-apprehension.

[64:18]

And samadhi is perfected by giving it up, by giving up the fruits. So it's just a key factor. And also I think I heard one Theravadan teacher say, well, if you look over Buddhism, what's the thing you find in all the different branches in terms of the practice? What do you find in all of them? All of them have non-attachment as part of the deal. They're all teaching selflessness and the practice for bringing selflessness into the world. is non-attachment. But, again, people can dream of non-attachment, and that's just a dream. So we need to probably, you know, live in a Sangha where people can help us determine whether it's really non-attachment or if it's just kind of pretend. Did you have further... Could I... One second. Emelo was asking this thing about patience. And you were saying, you were responding to some teaching about how to be with pain.

[65:26]

Another thing that occurred to me is one way we can really help each other in song is revealing our pain. And I really appreciate that lately, the last couple of months, how I've seen that demonstrated, that people are encouraging each other to reveal themselves. And it seems like it's that teaching of showing ourselves our pain that we can help learn how to be. In the center and now. Yeah, I think that, right. Revealing and expressing what your pain will help you practice patience with it. It helps, if you can say I'm in pain, that helps you practice patience with it. Sometimes you don't notice it until you say it. So it is good. In order to become free of things, it's good to express them, get them out in front. where we can look at them and clearly observe them, and speaking it or writing it on a little sign, you know, I'm in pain.

[66:27]

Yes. So it seems like there's this, you know, universal recommendation for non-attachment and recognition of things that's not a dual, but then it seems like there's this parenthetical thing that's like, don't let that become indifferent, stay compassionate for the benefit of beings. It seems like there's something kind of fixed or attached to that. Fixed. I think the bodhisattva is kind of fixed on, you know, compassion. They are kind of like fixed on it. But fixed on it is fixed like, you know, fixed without attachment somehow. So again, if you love somebody a lot, you just really love somebody, in a sense you're fixed on them. You care about them all the time. And then can you care about them really, really, really intensely and at the same time not grasp them? So the bodhisattva can be totally settled in compassion.

[67:32]

And if they're not, then we are careful to tell them about this practice of non-attachment because we want the understanding of non-attachment to be joined with compassion. We don't want it to be, except it could somewhat, it can get somewhat dissociated. The non-attachment that's not joined with compassion, however, is not as deep and thorough as the non-attachment that's with the compassion. So it is kind of a, I don't know what, you could say it's either a paradox or a miracle that beings that understand that there aren't any beings are totally devoted to beings. And now they're devoted to them, but among the people who are devoted to beings, these are the beings that can save beings because they have no idea of beings. That's the miracle of Mahayana.

[68:35]

That's one of Edward Kahn's great contributions, is to call it the miracle of the Mahayana, is that you can care totally about other beings and not see any other beings. and that that is really helpful in caring for other beings that you don't see any. And you are totally devoted to that care but with no attachment to the beings or the care. And you work a long time to actually practice bhavan amarga in various ways to bring the care the teaching of care about beings, to bring that teaching into being. And once it's into being, it's like, well, like they say, it can get to be like a forest fire. And everything makes it grow, you know, rather than blow it out. It's stronger. So at a certain point, it just takes care of itself, you know, and you don't have to work at it anymore.

[69:41]

It just takes over the person. They just love beings. They just really cherish beings. They just really cherish beings. They just think beings are great. And they understand that in order to serve these beings more skillfully, they're going to learn about this non-attachment thing. And in order to fully realize non-attachment, so that's also effortless. It's good to understand that beings are empty. But you don't have to remind yourself anymore to non-grasp. You just are devoted to beings, and you don't find any place to get a hold. And you're there devoted to them, and they feel your devotion. And at the same time, you're transmitting this non-attachment. So then they're picking it up, they're learning it, and you're benefiting. Not you're benefiting, but the samadhi is benefiting. They're benefiting in the samadhi of non-attachment. And all these wonderful things are possible there. I assume it's probably true for myself where someone might think of some relationship they have with someone or some being as care but it's actually attachment can you help me to see where I can distinguish those two probably it is some care at least for yourself whenever you attach to anything you're probably at least caring for yourself so there's some care

[71:09]

but it may be mostly for yourself. And so that's why, again, why we need sangha. And so you'd have to show me the example, I guess, for me to see if I feel there's any kind of like attachment on your part. So not anything that necessarily could help just as I'm going through a day-to-day experience of trying to figure out whether or not my motivation to behave in a certain way is based on care. Oh, you mean without telling me about it, you mean? Well, yeah. Right, right. Well, that's where outflows are helpful. Because when there is that kind of thing, you know, when there's attachment, there will be outflows. And outflows are kind of like the psychophysical or energetic consequence of attaching. And outflows can be observed. You can feel the energy kind of like leaking out or flushing up, you know, like... It's like there's too much energy up in your face or in your elbows or in your heart or in your stomach or your knees.

[72:15]

You know, someplace you feel that the energy is blocking and it's stuck in the midst of this activity. And so that's time to stop and look, you know, where am I holding here? When energy is really flowing freely, then you probably should come and talk to the teacher because then you think, hey, there's no hot flows. But if you can find outflows, then you know that somewhere around here there's some holding. There's some holding to my ideas, or there's some holding to some feelings, or there's some holding to language, you know. There's some kind of like clinging. And you may not be able to spot what it is yet, but the energy disturbance, the energy not flowing freely, and the big gaze and losses in energy around some activity is a sign that And then, of course, you have to learn the intelligence between that and low blood sugar. So you need to take care of yourself and feed yourself so that you have enough blood sugar level, keep your blood sugar level.

[73:22]

And then, when that's taken care of, you notice your energy will flow and go up and around as you have a tendency of gain and loss and that kind of thing in your mind. So basically, when you don't grasp existence and non-existence, or self and other, or gain and loss, you know, part of the distinction between enlightenment and illusion, if you don't do those, then you won't do them in other situations. But it's hard to spot those sometimes, so maybe other situations will surface it. And then you just stop and look and see if you can tell. And sometimes you can say, oh yeah, I see how I'm thinking. And that goes with this outflow. And so you confess the outflow, and the more you confess the outflow, the more you understand, and the more you understand, of course, you get to the end of outflows.

[74:13]

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