December 29th, 1980, Serial No. 00325
Welcome! You can log in or create an account to save favorites, edit keywords, transcripts, and more.
Monastic History Seminar
The talk examines criticisms of early Christian monasticism regarding its perceived non-scriptural basis, dualism, Gnosticism, and its roots in universal religious phenomena rather than Christianity. It discusses the self-perception of early monks and identifies "The Life of Saint Anthony" by Athanasius as a pivotal text in establishing monastic ideals within Christianity, detailing concepts such as the ascetic and mystical life, martyrdom as a spiritual endeavor, and apatheia—the state of inner peace.
Referenced Works:
- "The Life of Saint Anthony" by Athanasius: A foundational text for early Christian monasticism, illustrating the ascetic ideals and themes vital to monastic spirituality, including the dual concepts of withdrawal and return to society.
- The Confessions by Augustine (Book 8, Chapter 6): Mentioned as a context wherein Augustine discusses his encounter with the book "The Life of Saint Anthony," illustrating its influential role.
- "Sayings of the Desert Fathers" / Apophthegmata Patrum: Collection of wisdom from Egyptian monasticism, providing insights into ascetic practices and spiritual discernment that significantly influenced Christian spirituality.
- New Translation of "The Life of Antony" (1980, Classics of Western Spirituality) by Robert C. Gregg: Recent edition, offering an accessible contemporary translation.
- The Alphabetical Collection of the Sayings of the Desert Fathers: This publication offers short, impactful teachings illustrative of desert monastic wisdom.
Key Figures:
- Athanasius: Author of "The Life of Saint Anthony," instrumental in enshrining monastic practices.
- Evagrius Ponticus: Notable for emphasizing apatheia as a path to contemplation in monastic life.
These references and discussions provide a historical perspective on how monastic ideals were incorporated and interpreted within early Christian communities, shaping subsequent spiritual practices.
AI Suggested Title: Monastic Ideals: From Criticism to Canon
AI Vision - Possible Values from Photos:
Speaker: Cyprian Davis
Location: Glastenbery Abbey
Possible Title: Origins of monastic ideal
Additional text: Vita Antonii
Speaker: Cyprian Davis
Location: Glastenbery Abbey
Possible Title: Eremitical tradition, Apothegmata
Additional text:
@AI-Vision_v002
In recent years, it has become rather fashionable to criticize monasticism as being, first of all, non-scriptural, second, dualistic, third, gnostic, and finally, actually being rather non-Christian. To a certain extent, I think monasticism can plead guilty on all these counts. What is true, however, is that in terms of the self-perception of the early monks, they would not have had the slightest idea or comprehension of what these charges meant. The early monks had already found a scriptural basis for their form of life.
[01:08]
As far as they were concerned in their own self-perception, they were profoundly Christian. And in terms of whether they were Gnostic or not, they were as Gnostic, as was the rest of the various Christian communities that were to be found in that period. In terms of dualism, they have the same dualistic tendencies as the rest of Christian society as it evolved. Finally, or ultimately, the reason why these charges can be leveled against monasticism is simply this. Monasticism is not something fundamentally, basically rooted in Christianity. It is rooted in humanity as such.
[02:15]
Monasticism, ultimately, is a manifestation of a basic religious orientation of humankind. Brother John Confrere of Monseigneur, Brother David Stendhal-Rust gave a conundrum one time when I heard him speak, which has always fascinated me, which I think is very true. It goes like this, among monks we are Christians, among Christians we are monks. that in terms of that small minority of Christians which style themselves as monks, we have one sort of existence, we are recognized to be one sort of thing, but in terms of the totality of monks in the world, we are Christian monks. In other words, monasticism is not a Christian phenomenon.
[03:19]
Monasticism is a phenomenon that antedates Christianity. And this phenomenon that antedates Christianity is rooted in the notion that it is possible for a human person to have some kind of union with God, some kind of experience of God. And more than this, that there is a kind of universal desire that becomes more or less refined, more or less profound, a universal desire for this experience of God to deepen, to become more and more intense. In other words, when we give this name to it, the early monks will not recognize the name because they really didn't come to it until about the 6th century or so, we give a name to it of the mystical element. This mystical element in religion is not precisely Christian at all either.
[04:27]
But, it is certainly to be found in the very beginnings of Christianity. And once we mention the mystical element of Christianity, then we've got to mention the means whereby we can achieve this mystical element, or whereby we can somehow or other predispose ourselves for this mystical experience, or this element, or this intense union with God, or this experience of God. Namely, there must be some kind of a discipline. And therefore, the other side of monasticism, the ascetical element, is already there, the discipline. The notion that there must be a discipline, of course, is not at all Christian. In all religious movements there is a disciplining, a desire to curtail certain aspects of our human desires, and a desire to deepen certain other practices so as to predispose ourselves for an intensity of a religious experience.
[05:35]
All of this, all of this is the basic framework in which the monastic phenomenon develops. And hence monasticism as such wears all kinds of trappings and comes in all kinds of guidance. Some of which will have the trappings of a great deal of gnosticism, a great deal of Greek notions and ideas. Others will come bearing the trappings of more Far Eastern elements and so forth. None of that should surprise us, and none of that should serve as a repulse to Manassas. The important thing, however, is that it also took root in Christianity. Here again, The historian, and those who are students of history, must beware of a certain chimera, a certain desire to look for origins, to look and say, ah, here's where it began, here's where it starts.
[06:56]
This sort of looking for origins, in the end, is a kind of It's kind of an illusion. Where can we say that something starts that has not been there before? Where can we really say that there is a gradual evolution, a gradual change, a gradual shift, a gradual development? And this again is probably the way monasticism as a Christian phenomenon arrives in our history. that very gradually something that was to be found in the early Christian communities takes on a cast and a coloring that we will term monastic. Not at all, as in any case in history. Divorced from surrounding environment, surrounding influences,
[07:59]
What is this element that has already been found in early Christianity, namely the element of the ascetics? We know that from very early in the Christian communities, wherever there were to be found disparate parts of the Roman Empire, there was the ascetical element, the existence of men and of women, who termed themselves, as far as the men are concerned, the continentes, the covenant, the women who bear the title of the virgines, the virgins. that very early, already by the beginning of the second century, we find them living in groups apart, recognized, already having a certain status, virgins, veil, living in communities, occupying a particular position within the Christian community, the continentals, the men, who are their distinguishing characteristic, they do not marry, they are continent.
[09:03]
They are also living in various places, sometimes on the margin of the Christian community. But already their existence is there. Already they are receiving or they are receiving letters. Saint Cyprian writes to the virgins. Saint Ambrose others addressing treatises to the virgins, to that member of the Christian community already, who are marked by a certain ascetical caste, a certain ascetical calendar. And already there is a kind of spirituality, a certain notion of their experience of God, a certain definite spiritual orientation that is taking place. Yet, if we want to give the Christian phenomenon of monasticism a birthplace and a birth certificate, we must start with one text, a text which can be considered as the first Christian monastic text, which it does not at all mean that it began
[10:28]
with this text and the person described in this text. In fact, most historians today would say that the monastic element in Christianity was something that arose practically in several places about the same time, which is usually the case with historical movements. It usually The various movements start at around the same period, and in various places, and crucially, independent one of another. So there are these connections. A connection, cause-effect connection, is sometimes great, and sometimes very, very difficult to establish. But what is this birth certificate? What is this birthplace? that we can say here is where Christian monasticism began.
[11:34]
It is with a book that was a bestseller, a runway bestseller, by this time. A book that Augustine talks about in his Confessions, in Book 8, Chapter 6 of the Confessions. And Augustine, in recounting now how he found God and how God led him to himself, recounts an experience that he had in meeting a certain Potizianus in Milan. And Potizianus, in coming in and noticing that Augustine was reading the Gospels, says, oh, you are reading this? And then he recounts a book that he had encountered when he was in the imperial service. being one of the members of the Imperial Secret Police when he was in Trier, present-day Germany. And when they were walking around the outer ramparts of the city, they came into a small cabin, me and a friend, and the place was empty.
[12:43]
But on the table was a book And they picked up the book and began to read it, and were enthralled by it. And the book they happened to pick up was the Life of Sanatana by Athanasius, who at that time was in exile, or was in exile several times, four or five times during his lifetime. Sanatanasius, the patriarch of Alexandria, That work is the earliest Christian text dealing with monasticism. St. Anthony's life lived in Egypt, Lower Egypt, whose dates, we're not exactly sure of the time of his birth, probably around the year 250 and we know he died somewhere around the year 355 and that Athanasius writes his life about the year 357 during a time of his third exile which he spent in the desert being driven out of the city of Alexandria, out of his seat
[14:14]
Athanasius, of course, we know, especially at this time of the year, is the great defender of the Nicene faith, the great defender of the incarnation of Christ, of Christ being truly the Son of God and divine, against Arianism. Athanasius, who takes on all comers, Athanasius the great, not only the great theologian, but the polemicist, and who goes into exile, a tremendous figure, a giant of his age. And the important thing, of course, in terms of monastic history is that not only is he the first person to publicize monastic history, the monastic phenomenon, but as an agent in his life or sanatomy, he is, I think, the basic themes, the basic themes, the basic orientation of monasticism and monastic spirituality, the monastic idea. His life of St.
[15:19]
Anthony is not a life in the modern sensory term of the way we would write a biography. It is a life, more or less, in the style that an Athenese was. He was an Egyptian, but he belonged to Greek culture, Greek background. It is a life written in the style of a Greek life of a hero. He's an encomium. And in it he arranges his material in a very orderly fashion, in a very definite literary type. Arranging his material in an orderly fashion, he presents them to you, this person, this hero, who emerges them from his death. A dog with all sorts of wonderful qualities, but he's a hero. He's a champion. At the same time, he was able then to arrange around him the basic themes and ideas.
[16:20]
Athanasius was acquainted with the monks precisely because he was driven out of his sea several times and found refuge among them. In other words, what Athanasius is describing is something that was already in existence when he comes upon the sea, when he finds it. And he picks out one individual who was more or less the leader type, and makes him then in a certain sense, gives him a kind of a myth, mythical quality. He says that he is the founder of this way of life, which probably was not how I was going to find it. But the man who emerges is the man who at the time was the leader. And he gives him then his tremendous quality. So Anthony emerges then. emerges in terms of our history as the father of monasticism. The father, really, the father of Christianity. We're dealing with a phenomenon that's already several thousand years old. Or at least, well, at least over a thousand.
[17:22]
A thousand, yeah. Two thousand years old, probably. It qualifies as Indian subconsciousness, the ideal of ascetics, wandering ascetics and settling down. Now, what Athanasius then does, drawing this picture of this hero, and then setting out a kind of a doctrine, what he does, he gives us a monastic doctrine, a doctrine of monastic spirituality. He sets the course, and we mark our way for a long day. And also, as nature's emergence and as the protector of the monks, which is precisely what the Patriarchate of Alexandria was throughout the period of the early Church, and even later on when our example goes into Anticism.
[18:23]
Remember that the Patriarchate of Alexandria is the second Patriarchate in the whole notion of the Pentarchy, the whole notion of the fivefold jurisdictional centers for the early church, Rome, and then Alexandria, and then Antioch. And so later, as part of the ongoing controversy, when Lela Constantino also planted so that the second, the leader of the second seed is the one who gives his blessing to monasticism, to this monastic order and give it a certain order and the patriarch of Alexandria will remain throughout the period when Alexandria gives that flourishing sign will remain as the leader of monks to be found all over Egypt wherever they were even in other dynasties since he was in certain times had personal jurisdiction over This work that he writes, about the year 357, is almost immediately translated into several different languages.
[19:39]
It takes the Christian world, which by this time is really the Mediterranean world in general, it takes it by storm. There are at least two Latin translations of the Life of St. Anthony, written originally in Greek. It's a man of Greek culture, a Greek philosophical background. It is written originally in Greek. It is translated into Latin, two separate translations, into Coptic, which would be the language of the Egyptian peasants, to Syriac, to Arabic, to Ethiopian and Georgian, and so forth. Tremendous, tremendous success. The basic theme that it contains while the basic spiritual monastic themes are the notion of asceticism as a wrestling, as a combat modification. Antony is that the champion strips down and enters into hand-to-hand combat with the devil.
[20:42]
The very demonology, constant, constant appearance throughout the pages of the life of St. Anthony, disconcerting for us the 20th century, the aspect of demonology that is there, the description of the devil and so forth. Extremely interesting and which puts us off as we read this and say, how can this really be a spiritual book that's going to give us kind of a spiritual desire for union with God, and all this terrible preoccupation with the devil. Athanasius is a man of his time. He's writing for people of his time. He's writing out of a Neoplatonic thought frame. There is lurking always around the sides, in this period of Jewish history, the Manichean Romance, if you want to put it that way.
[21:44]
Manichean Romance. Monasticism as martyrdom. Extremely important. And it is right there. A pathet. The notion of spiritual life of progress. I want to come back to that. That is extremely important. Apotheos. The notion of spiritual paternity. Again, in my own mind, I hope that I won't become too subjective, but it seems to me that spiritual paternity is one of the most important themes in terms of monastic spirituality. The idea of withdrawal and return. Withdrawal from mankind, return to mankind. A going away and a coming back. These things, this is already there. But if there is a flight from the world, there is always a return to it. And that is definitely needed in the life of Samantabha. The notion of spiritual discernment.
[22:46]
We're always besieged these days by everybody telling me I'm going around discerning this way, I'm going to discern so forth from there. and what would be to give us a bias on my part, one always has the impression that discernment never started until the Ignatius arrived on the scene with his spiritual exercise, and therefore the Jesuits have given us this discernment. Well, discernment is a constant theme in all of Christian spirituality, and it didn't start with St. Ignatius, and it doesn't really need St. Ignatius with the exercise of the Bible. that the notion of spiritual discernment is already there in the life of Antony. Of course, in the life of Antony, the fundamental thing you want to discern, first of all, is whether it's demonic or whether it is agonizing. The basic question is whether this is from the devil or whether it is from God, which remains, ultimately, the same thing for the nations.
[24:01]
So when you have people, especially sisters who are not of the monastic tradition, who keep trying to go into discernment now, you can remind them that this is something very basic to monastic spirituality, and know whether it was from God, that we are And we don't necessarily... But the rules that Ignatius applies have their basis in the tradition of the Nascent Spiritual Order. I'd like to, if you'll permit me, say a word about apatheia and a word about the notion of spiritual paternity and violence. They're all right on the board. Because apatheia, again, in my own opinion, is rather important in this notion of monastic spirituality.
[25:02]
Apatheia is one of those words that is not only a cold word, and it is definitely a cold word, But it is also a fighting word. It is also a word upon which we spill blood, or had spilled blood. In case you think it wouldn't be blood, it's exactly the opposite. But it's definitely a word of which is extremely controversial and raises up then phantoms that will be also lurking in the history of monastic spirituality all along. There's a text in the life, remember, I suppose most of you are aware of the life of Anthony. If you want to be, I'd like, from time to time I'll try to mention some books I didn't want to come in with a big bibliographical list. Probably because I haven't had time to compile it all. But I think from time to time maybe mention some works that might be germane to what we're discussing in the morning or the afternoon.
[26:10]
might be very good. The new translation of the life of Antony is in the spiritual classics, Classics of Western Spirituality, put out by the Polish Press in 1980, Robert C. Gregg. It's an affirmation of the life of Antony along with the letter to Marcellinus. There is an earlier translation that would be found in the Ancient Christian Writers series, done by a guy named Meier, which is very well done. In brief, the life of Antony starts where Antony, as the man coming from a peasant Egyptian family of some, not extremely poor, not extremely poor, but he's orphaned at a young age and uh... he hears the words of the liturgy and he is told, go if you want to follow Christ for a soul you have to get to the core and come follow me and he determines that he should do that he puts his sister with the virgins he disposes of the property, settles some property on her and then joins the ascetics
[27:25]
Not at all. He is first in the notion of living an ascetic life. He lives in a Christian community, already in the direction towards the south of Egypt, and there he joins the ascetics in his Christian community. But what the life tells us is a gradual progression, which is an important theme in spiritual life, a gradual progression whereby he moves from the arsenics on the margin of the community into the desert and gradually farther and farther into the desert until he begins to live the aromatical life. There is a chapter, a description, where Athanasius describes the scene after this first stage of the curry. Antony has moved into living a life of solitude in an abandoned fort.
[28:33]
He stays there for 20 years, which is a nice round number, sacred number. 20 years is a holy number in the world. At the end of this period, Anthony is changed. So it's a very capital incident. In the life of Anthony, in the turning point of his cynical development, it's very, very important what happens after this 20 years of solitude with him. Now he was given food and so forth, but a few later he was given bread. I would get a very long dissertation on the importance of bread, but anyway, I don't wish he survived and so forth during those times. He is in solitude in this court. But what is important is how Confucius describes his emergence from this experience. It's in chapter 14. Nearly twenty years he spent in this manner, pursuing the ascetic life by himself, not venturing out, and only occasionally being seen by anyone.
[29:38]
After this, when many possessed the desire and will to emulate his asceticism, and some of his friends came and tore down and forcefully removed the fortress door, Anthony came forth, as though from some shrine, having been led into divine mysteries and inspired by God. This was the first time he appeared from the fortress for those who came out to him. And when they beheld him, they were amazed to see that his body had maintained its former condition, neither fat from lack of exercise nor initiated from fasting and combat with demons. for it was just as they had known him prior to his withdrawal. The state of his soul was one of purity, for it was not constricted by grief, nor relaxed by pleasure, nor affected by either laughter or dejection.
[30:43]
Moreover, when he saw the crowd, he was not annoyed any more than he was elated at being embraced by so many people He maintained utter equilibrium, like one guided by reason, and stood fast in that which accords with nature. Through Him the Lord healed many of those present who suffered from bodily ailments. Others He purged of demons, and to Anthony who gave grace in speech. Thus He consoled many who mourned, and others hostile to each other He reconciled in friendship. urging everyone to prefer nothing in the world about the love of Christ. And when he spoke and urged them to keep in mind the future goods and the affliction which we are held by God, who did not spare his own son but gave him up for us all, he persuaded many to take up the solitary life. And so from then on, There were monasteries in the mountains, and the desert was made a city by monks, who left their own people and registered themselves for the citizenship in the heavens."
[31:55]
In chapter 15 he describes, well I want to read chapter 15, Bear with me. Once he had to cross the canal of Arsinoe, his visitation of the brothers was a cause, and the canal was full of crocodiles. And after simply praying, he and those in his company entered it and passed through unharmed. Returning to his cell, he carried on the same holy and active labors. Through regular conversation, he strengthened the resolve of those who were already monks and stirred most of the others to a desire for the discipline. And before long, by the attraction of his speech, a good many monasteries came into being, and like a father, he guided them all." At the very end of the work, in chapter 67, Athanasius again returns to this same theme. Furthermore, Anthony was tolerant in this position and humble of soul. the sort of man he was, he honored the rule of the church with extreme care. Remember that Athanasius is a bishop. So as he writes this, he's describing the man the way he sees perfection should be.
[33:02]
And he wanted every cleric to be held in high regard himself. Remember that Antony was not a cleric, the early monks were not, he was a layman. He wanted every cleric to be held in high regard in himself. He felt no shame in bowing the head to the bishops and priests. Even a deacon came to him for assistance to discuss the things that are beneficial. Now that's a good thing that Athanasius is surviving on his own terms for this great leader of holiness. What is important is he goes on His face had a great and marvelous grace, and the spiritual favor he had from the Savior. For if he was present with a great number of monks, and someone who had not formally met him wished to see him immediately on arriving, this person would pass by the others and run to him as though drawn by his eyes. It was not his physical dimensions that distinguished him from the rest, but the stability of character and the purity of the soul. His soul being free of confusion, he held his outer senses also undisturbed, so that from the soul's joy Its face was cheerful as well. From the movements in the body it was possible to sense and perceive the stable condition of the soul, as it is written, when the heart rejoices, the confidence is cheerful, and so on.
[34:11]
What Adonaisius is describing there, though he does not use the word, is apatheia. Apatheia, which according to Gilderwein is the word apathy, but which is not at all the idea, It is to be without passions. Without passions, the primitive cave, to be without passions, to be without any sort of, to be, in other words, imperturbable. It is a stoic notion. It is a notion veered with stoic philosophers. It is the stoic ideal. to be without any sort of passions, to be imperturbable, to be unmoved and unmovable, immovable. Now, it is not Athanasius who invents this idea. It is already Clement of Alexandria in the 2nd century who, in talking about the true Gnostic, the true Christian in his perfection,
[35:22]
The real Christian is one who has apotheosis. I don't want to call him Alexander the Greek. He's really the man who brings to bear upon nascent Christian intellectual development, who really brings to bear upon it the Greek philosophy, the Greek brain world. Clement of Alexandria, in other words, our predecessor of origin, really, in a certain sense, introduces Christianity into the Greek intellectual world, and introduces the Greek intellectual world into Christianity. But he is also one of the fathers of our spiritual tradition. There's no way of saying that. And there's no way of throwing your hands up and saying, what I read in scripture, what I read in scripture, well, of course, the Greek philosophical world already did the scripture, which people always forget to do. And the scripture was free of Greek influence, or Greek philosophical influence.
[36:24]
But, this is a concept which is already here in the beginning of Christian monasticism. is a concept which will become dearer and dearer to a certain school, to a certain development of the Greek Dynastic Socialist Age. I don't think, because I'm sort of partisan in the notion of it, like, and also like those who are the carriers of this tradition. And in my way of thinking, and this would be highly controversial, I mean, people like Anne Boaz Watson would scream and holler if I were to say it. In my way of thinking, this is precisely a part out of which the tradition would follow. But the The thing I think must be borne in mind is that in the Christian tradition, as this notion of apotheosis develops, it is, to a large extent, it sheds much of the stoic element that would be objectionable and can be interpreted from a little Christian ground.
[37:38]
In other words, the ideal is not to remain rock-like before suffering, to have no compassion, to have no humanity. But it is rather the ideal, as he basically presented here, of an inner calm, an inner peace, an inner balance, an equilibrium of the soul because one has arrived at a certain maturity. Or to put it, to use an expression that we use on the streets about five years or so ago, maybe they have it all together. To have it all together means then to have it all together within oneself, and then to be in harmony within oneself. This, I think, is really the Christian notion of Apotheo. Now, those who attack Apotheo will be precisely because, not so much because of Athenian issues, but I think the Germany idea is definitely an Athenian.
[38:49]
But those who come after and follow in its tradition, whether they are medical, monastic life, religious, a name for Apotheo which I would like to mention when we come back from the break. But Apotheo, becomes part and parcel then of a controversy. Rome hates the word, hates the people who use it. because it is precisely because of the people who use it. But it enters into the monastic spirituality nonetheless. And we found here, the ideal of Anthony is, as Athanasius pictures him, is one who has this inner calm, inner peace, inner harmony. And that it is at this precise moment that he is then ready to proceed as spiritual father. is at this precise moment when he has arrived in a harmony, in a wholeness, that he is then to become father for others.
[39:54]
I think it is extremely important to do a spiritual paternity in a woman's still life. It has nothing to do with priesthood, nothing to do with sacramental orders. And that's the title of Abba, which comes very, very early to a mature monk. is precisely that title given to the monk who has arrived at a certain spiritual level, which, in terms of this tradition, would mean acquiring quite a certain apothecary, quite altogether. Anthony is a hero, he does. He's our champion. But when you acquire a certain apothecary, then you can teach others. and direct all of them. Exactly what happened in the emergence. His whole life is then as being the father to others, as guiding others. Monasticism becomes a movement in the desert precisely because he is a spiritual father. There are several other themes that are here.
[40:57]
How much more time do I have? Right. There are several other themes and one of the most important ones, again, is martyrdom. Remember that The monk, in a certain sense, continues the whole mystique of martyrdom in the early church. And this is, again, one of the themes that Athanasius brings up. Going into the desert, the Egyptian desert, was dropping out of society. It was to leave the society. In the Roman world of the 4th century, the period of the later Roman Empire. There were many reasons why an individual living in the Roman Empire would want to leave the world. Not the least of which was the sort of... not just the chaotic condition of the empire, where there was chaos and there wasn't so much chaotic at this time or century, but precisely because life had become very regimented.
[42:08]
It was an empire, the Roman Empire itself, it was a tremendous miracle, a tremendous thing. But in this period now of the reorganization of the Diocletian, during the 6th, 8th century, 4th century and so forth, it had to keep the creaking edifice together. These elephants which were so... soaring with the English. And they were so tremendous, so... so... they created a tremendous civilization, the way it saved the world. Yet to keep this thing together, this massive empire, you know, some very draconian measures had to be taken in terms of social... the social reality. Namely, you have to pay taxes. Not everyone, obviously, is going to be tattooed in the afterlife. You have a large portion of the memories of the Empire, they're not citizens. The memories of the Empire were slaves, therefore they're not paid tattoos, or freedmen, therefore they're not paid tattoos.
[43:12]
But you have, you know, and then the aristocracy, you cannot necessarily pay tattoos, but I'm looking for religious. Then you have a large group of so-called Victorian, those are the, would be to be a little unacquainted with the middle class, who must pay the taxes in their local municipalities, who had the burden of the public services. But the economy was in terrible chaos. It was the economic situation from the late Roman Empire was terrible, dreadful. There was inflation, but of course you didn't have to pay the money yet. But the biggest one of the many and so forth. But, the whole weight, then, of the public service weighed upon a certain class. And many of them found no way, no other possible way, except to get out, to leave, to drop out of that society. So they fled to the desert. The Egyptian desert, as far as the place like Alexandria was concerned, was then the place where you went when you wanted to get away from it all. who was also the place, not only there would be decent upstanding folk who decided to drop out and went to the military, but there would also be those who were living alive before the outlaws, the bandits.
[44:24]
And it was a reform of the reform in a world which had soldiers and had the various kinds of difficulties of social approval. So going to the desert, and this was the case in other wilderness areas in the world, going to the desert was not its place to escape to. So that the notion then for the ascetic to practice this withdrawal, the anachronesis, to become an anchorite, to leave the life of the anchorite, was then a normal thing. for those who are withdrawing them from society, a society that had its problems with the dogma. But the story of this withdrawal, already in the first Christian text on the gospel, is that it's never consumed, never told.
[45:27]
There is always a return, several different times. At least on three occasions, Anthony goes back to Oregon. Two of them, he goes back in Olympic armor. He fails. He puts himself right in front of you, hoping that he won't be taken down. This is the last persecution. Persecution at maximum value. The year just occurred, just shortly before the Peace of Constantinople, 311. 311 is 212. But it's one of the last persecutions. He wants to become a martyr and he fails. And at the meeting he describes him going back to the desert and leading then, really, what was a daily martyrdom in a monastic life. So the daily martyrdom in a monastic life is already a thing that you have in that notion. Because, remember, martyrdom is not just something that was a kind of or a nice experience for the early church.
[46:32]
There's a whole mystique among them. It is a kind of a mystical, a mystical experience. Anthony roughly presents the Aramidical tradition of monasticism. In other words, he's not even a prototype, which we call him the father amongst the elite of prototypes, especially of the nuns. That is important in looking at the development of Nazi-Leninism in the 4th century, because we were taught through Dr. Munch about the Sino-British development, which was really contemporary, where there were not really that great a change. The man who is the leader of that movement is a contemporary of Antrim's. But it is important to keep in mind that there are two developments of the monastic tradition in Egypt. At the same time, if we rely on Egypt, it's only going to be a period, a very bizarre and strange period.
[47:39]
But in the Aramaic tradition, Washington was found geographically in an area not too far from Arizona, but it was still upper Egypt in the day. It was in this area that Antony lived. and it is in this area of a large settlement. I think there are four things that I want to mention to you in terms of the aramidical tradition in Egyptian monasticism. So that's to clear the air on our terms of understanding. Hermits, in fact, hermits all throughout the history of the church were almost never cut off from social contact. And then you have the stories about Helmuth, one of the other Helmuths, living away and never seeing another individual. Those may be apocryphal, or if they are reality, they are almost a minute case.
[48:44]
Helmuths were never cut off from social contact, and that is true of the early character laws of the medieval era. Hermits represented the hero for the early Christian community. There's several studies that talk about the holy man as hero. The holy man as hero in the later Roman Empire. Almost as a type of individual who had a tremendous influence on the ordinary people, on the local habitation. The Hermit The Egyptian hermit, especially, is somewhat of a rift on this topic. He has become very much a hero for the ordinary people, or the run-of-mill population. And for that reason, their influence was considerable. The other thing that should be borne in mind is that the hermit always remains there. All throughout Christian history, the hermits are with the people.
[49:51]
They are part and parcel, they are part of the popular movement. And I'm extremely proud of that, in fact. Hermits are, and I mean, it's very much close, very, very close. You know, we have, we have, you know, look at people who don't talk about hermits as if they are antisocial. Whether they were antisocial or not, they were very much socially involved. Always socially involved. And a tremendous social movements are, they start a tremendous social movement. And in fact, that is the very thing that I want to keep in mind. Helmets represent the art of Christian history, the radical elements of Christianity. They are a dangerous scope. Monks should be aware too. But helmets are very dangerous people. And in a certain sense, you can create all of these elements in an early church, early monasticism, medieval monasticism. But it's done for a different purpose. If you'll forgive me, there are at least... I would like to mention one other source of the monastic history and monastic spirituality that I think should not be overlooked.
[51:16]
And that is a body of literature that comes precisely from the Aramidical Egyptian monastic tradition. a body of literature that has a tremendous influence on subsequent Christian spirituality. In the East, in the West, not only, you know, Mount Calvary, but also now, with your mind, you know, all this, it becomes part, in a way, of the almost apocryphal of our Christian peoples. And that is the sayings of the Desert Fathers, or the sayings of Everest and the Autumn, or the Apostles, my friend. Now, the outlaw pegmata come out of the Aramidical Egyptian tradition, generally. The most recent translation of them is by the Anglican, the Meliton man, well, I looked up an Anglican man,
[52:26]
a very fine historian, Sister Benedicta Ward, England, which is published in 2005, I should tell you. The Sayings of the Desert Fathers, which is a publication of the Alphabetical Collection, and The Wisdom of the Desert, which is a publication of the DiggerDot.com, the anonymous collection. The Alphabet of DiggerDot is a series of small things, like a novel type of literature. Very similar in respect to the spiritual and spiritual outlook in the Jewish tradition, or to the Koran in the young brother's tradition. Extremely important because these sayings, I'll give you some examples in a moment, what a had a purpose within the desert tradition.
[53:31]
Namely, they were a form of catechesis. It is what the disciple, the young monk, the young hunter, was to learn. And learning it, you also learn a role, a teaching, an attitude. It would be a subject of meditation, because they are enormous things. In other words, there's more to them than just what is on the surface. They are something that must be masticated, and if you get into it, masticated, and then finally, after thorough chewing, you can arrive at the inner core. That's really what it's all about. and they are called the subject of meditation. But they are also a model for spiritual direction, for our own kind of notion of spiritual direction. Remember, spiritual direction has very little to do with whether you are a priest or not.
[54:33]
In terms of penance, there is public penance, of course, and there is one for the jurisdiction of the bishop, Our own spiritual direction is for the spiritual father, or spiritual mother, or the woman's mother, and the individual mother, or the individual mom, who has common relationship. For us, they are important because they inculcate ideals, spiritual ideals, that are opportune even again to our own death. Jean-Claude Guy, who is a French historian who has studied the Asperger's phlegmata, developed a theory that you can divide these things into three major groups, one being more the clinical aspects, and the other being a more highly-developed, third being what I'm going to talk about, literary, almost a literary form.
[55:42]
One just being the one-liner, the other being a kind of extended one-liner, and the third being the anecdotal. Other is to dispute this and say you cannot say that we're just trying to develop in a literary form, that you're not dealing with something that can so easily be defined and so forth. Be that as it may, one can speak about the one-liner, which is very much like the Zen Koan, namely, which is always the answer to the question, Father, what must I do to be saved? Give me a good word, what must I do to be saved? And so forth. There are examples of this. One asked an old man, how much a monk needs? And he answered, in my opinion, alone before the other. When asked an old man, what is the work of a monk?
[56:45]
He replied, the same. The old man used to say, prayer is the mirror of the monk. An old man said, if a monk only prays, only stands for prayer, he never prays. And so forth. In other words, Very pithy sentence, very short, concise, and containing a great deal that one has to take time to reflect on. The extended kind of statement, longer, but also rather important, one attributed to the Abba Joseph, the old man of course, is the Ava, the one who has arrived of spiritual maturity, a spiritual father, who has attained a certain guru. And that is very important for the early monks. Namely, one had to go through a period of probation, one had to go through a period of formation, and one learned then from an elf.
[57:53]
But it's extremely important in this monotheism that we find described and in the writing down to me, and in the airport statement, that while more or less you would characterize an important conceptual, the airport statement is probably going to become gathered together into a compilation of what the notebook stands for, and then they are translated into what they will be, an interpretation of Arthur or Lemuel. We have several different collections in the collectible, and they are translated very, very roughly in North American languages, and so we can't yet unravel them. We can't have any critical text yet, because the alphabet is a plethora of early Christian, or early Native American literature. And the Albany School ain't published, and so forth. What we get is just a picture that you get when you leave the room. Some of you are probably hungry, some of you are drunk, everyone gets high and the very old man goes and all that.
[58:55]
Some of them are homosexuals. Some of them are thieves. All kinds of problems that went on in the desert, like anyway, fell out. But also what you get is the young monk who must go to an old man and give thoughts. And then when I arrived at St. Philip's, he entombed me at the discretion of the wisdom of St. Philip. The way to do it is through the alphabet. I'll give you an example of this. The Abba Lot went to the Abba Joseph, and he said to him, Father, I have made myself a little rule in proportion to my strength. A little fasting, a little prayer, a little meditation. and a little repose. And I apply myself as I can in order to get rid of my thoughts. What more is there left for me to do?
[59:57]
The old man got up, stretched Porter's hands toward the heavens, and his fingers became as so many little flames. And he said to the other lot, If you wish, you can become entirely like fires. Another example of this kind of extended, the Abba Joseph asked the Abba Pastor, tell me how to become a monk? The old man replied, if you wish to find the tools in this world and in the next, on every occasion ask yourself this question, who am I? and never judge another person. More interesting, from our point of view, because of the kind of information it gives us, is the anecdote. And of course, they're more colorful than they are. I mean, there's a lot of stories which involve the historical person, which tells a great deal about the day-to-day living in this fanatic world.
[61:05]
And always have, of course, a teaching. Always have a teaching at the end. Because remember, this is a form, this is a way you give formation. A teaching which becomes part of the construct of our whole gnostic spirituality. The Augustus of Mucius did not willingly drink wine. Once, however, when he was on the road, he fell on a band of robbers. Remember that robbers are part of the daily life. upon the Egyptian desert. They have much right to be there as for Hermes. He fell upon the loggers and he found them in the process of drinking. The robber chief recognized him and he knew that he did not drink wine. But seeing him worn out by his many labors, he filled a cup with wine, holding in the other hand a naked sword. He said to the old man, if you do not drink, I will kill you. The old man understood that this man wished to perform an act of charity towards him.
[62:16]
He thought it. In order to gain him, he took the cup and he drank. The robber chief then made a metanoia, which is a constant, ah, ah, you know, the physical, the frustration, called frustration. made a metanoia before him and said, Father, forgive me for I have caused you pain. The old man replied, I know that my God will show you mercy in this world and in the next because of this cup. And the robber chief replied, none. I have confidence that from now on, thanks to God, I shall no longer do evil to anyone. The old man won this whole band of robberies because he renounced his own will. Have we not forgotten? where there is a profound spiritual teaching that is part and parcel of the anecdote. Another one which I find extremely beautiful is another kind of anecdote. Two brothers went to the town.
[63:18]
Many of these are gathered together on this subject. The one I just read to you is in the alphabetical collection, the Bible Collections of Alabama. This one in Jamaica, this one in Puerto Rico. Two brothers went to the town in order to sell what they had made. Remember that they did not, the Hermits did not necessarily live alone. At times they would live two or three in a house that they usually constructed themselves, and always within a certain distance of another. Even if they lived alone within a certain distance. And on Saturday and Sunday they came together for some laughter. for the Eucharistic service, both on Saturday and on Sunday, and for the singing of the Song, which was always said, sitting at a seat on the floor, while a solo monk, solo reading down the rest of his volumes, stopping at the continuous solo for deep silence and prayer, prostration, and then continuing with the reading.
[64:23]
But in other words, this was it. Ending with a meal, the Aionagapé, are together. At this meeting on Saturday and Sunday, any other kind of business, including bishops, would take place under the jurisdiction of the priest. Very often, the priests were not monks. Later on, more and more of them are. But the priest, the monk ordained the priest, or the hermit ordained the priest, is still a rare phenomenon. By and large, it's the lay community. They go to the town to sell what they have made because they get their living out of the work of their hands. Remember, it's not a simple job to weave baskets. No, they're not doing something like this. They're not putting away their time. It is labor. It is hard. It is difficult. It is smelly. It is painful. And it is a pain. We must never get in the notion of the Egyptians playing at what they were doing. They lived a very hard life. Not too hard for them. for the life of an ordinary Egyptian peasant, but it was still a tough life.
[65:26]
It was still a tough life. So they go and sell what they make, in terms of buying the necessary things, especially produce that they would need. So many of the stories take place in the atmosphere of the small town to which they must go. Two brothers go to the town, they want to sell what they have made. In town, they separate, and one of them falls into impurity. A little later, the other brother comes back and says to him, my brother, let us now go back into our valley. Nope, I'm not going back, replied the first one. Why not, my brother? Well, when you left me, he said, I was tempted, and I fell into impurity. But his brother, wishing to gain said about and said to him, You know the same thing happened to me.
[66:29]
After leaving you, I, too, have gone to Earth. Let us both go back, and let us both do penance with all our strength, and God will pardon us the sinners that we are. When they had returned to their cell, They recounted to the old men, which was normal, you tell your innermost thoughts to your father. Now you do the sacramental confession, where you tell your innermost thoughts to your father, as if you're having a new event. Innermost thoughts, you have to refuse. When they would go back to the old men, they recounted what had happened to them. These latter prescribed to them the manner in which they should do. One of them, however, did penance not for himself, but for his brother. And did he have sinned himself? And God, seeing the trouble that he took out of love, revealed several days later to one of the old men that he had forgiven the one who had fallen into impurity on account of the great charity of the other who had not sinned.
[67:37]
And the thing ends now. This is the spiritual message. You see what it means. reveals one's life or one's trouble. And this is very interesting, and I have nothing to do with the moral conclusion, it's not something I've been sent. But what does it really mean to lay down one's life or one's trouble? The interesting thing about the example statement, in real terms, is that they reveal a spirituality which is very diverse. which has certain extremes to it. That's why one is going to read the Apocrypha and read them all, balance them one against the other. It's like the saying of Jesus, you must balance them one against the other. Don't just take one as an example, because they tend to contradict each other. No, they're not doing any tributaries, giving you the whys and wherefores and developing a full-blown theology.
[68:42]
They are pithy examples of truth. And they must be balanced once again. But the remarkable thing about them is the insight, a kind of a spiritual insight that they reveal. So one of them is an extraordinary personal emotional person. We think it's extraordinary, but it is very much a personal relationship. The whole emotional-spiritual connection is a personal-personal relationship. And the whole approach to sin. and leading us back to God, the presence of God, and of understanding, a kind of extremism, in psychological terms. This has been the psychological insight of the early monastic fatherhood, an extraordinary one, but we don't have time to look at it. I'd like to read you one last one, but I want to read two of them, because one is a friend of mine,
[69:46]
The second one I want to read really is the basic story, the framework, of a great love. One day their brother went to an old man. He said, Father, my brother wants to leave me and I don't know where he's going, and I'm suffering because of it. The old man encouraged him. Support this, he said, without growing irritated, and God, who sees all the pleasures that you place in this world, will bring your brother back to you. You know well that severity and harshness do not easily change the ideas of someone. For it is not the demon that will chase out the demon. You will bring him back rather by kindness. Our God himself draws souls to himself through persuasion. And then, he recounted this story. The story was a mis-story. Two brothers were living in Athabia. Athabia is found in the region of the province of Upper Egypt, around Thebes, where again, a settlement, a colony of hermits existed.
[70:57]
Two brothers were living in Athabia. One of them, tempted by impurity, said to the other, I'm going back into the world. The latter replied to him weeping, My brother, I don't want to see you lose your dignity and the fruit of all your labors. But the first one said, I do not want to remain here. I'm going back. You can either do two things. Either you can come with me, and then I shall return with you. Or let me go, and I shall stay in the wood. Her brother then went to a great old man, and he said to him, all that is going to happen. The old man saw. Go with them. And God, on account of the pain that you take, will not let him be lost. The two brothers therefore went into the world, and at the moment in which they arrived in the village, God, who saw all the trouble that the brother who was accompanying his other brother was taking, out of love and out of necessity, took away the desire, the evil desire, from the heart of the first brother.
[72:01]
So he says to him, brother, let's go back in the day. Suppose I did sing with a woman. What good would that do me? And so they both return on time and to their cell. That, in a way, I think, is the basis for one of the great novels of Western civilization, which I'm sure you can... I think the man that wrote one of them for me, that was the host of the Leeds Tradition, another Albert Story up there is the Mad Guy, and the Rags to Riches. Can we talk to that for a minute? Did anyone think of what that story would be? The novel? I'm sure you read it. Yeah. Yeah, no, not also, but it has to do with the growth of Karamatsu.
[73:03]
Because remember, the growth of Karamatsu starts in a monastery, and the starets, which means the old man, tells the younger boy that he must go out now and see the starets, to accompany him. He must go and accompany them in a certain sense. Which is a very marvellous thing. The other one I want to mention, because he's always very dear to me. You must not think that in the Egyptian desert, you found only Egyptians, like Anthony was, and you shouldn't speak in Coptic. and they were still speaking Arabic and Portuguese because they told me about lots of invasions. But you must not think that the Egyptian desert is true. It was a thing.
[74:05]
In fact, that's it. The name of a book, another book that you might want to look at sometime, is Derwash City, the Deserted City, plus with New York's and Gladimir's Seminary Press, and 1966, which is a very fine book, very fun book. But don't think that you were at Dearwalt's. Don't ever think, an English historian, don't ever think that you've been dealing here with this rejection. There were all kinds of ethnic groups in the region, as in Rhode Island. and racism as well, and don't think either that everything was just hunky-dory and everyone lived the truth and in harmony. They did not. That's another story. But among those were blacks in the desert. That's why I'm very much attached to this man, because, more or less, the blacks are the typified
[75:11]
First of all, he was a robber, a murderer. He started off with a slave, and the slave master started off with a guy who was a big, huge diner of a character. He just wasn't safe to have around. He left him and decided to let him go. And so, Mother's end up in the Egyptian Bureau, like somebody out of nowhere, just a place to go, and drop out of society. and he was a robber chieftain and robbed and stole and probably did all other things and we don't know how or what the circumstances but Moses disconverted and he becomes a hermit and he figures in quite a lot of the epiphany, there's a whole cycle there are a lot of cycles around these various individuals, ala costa and uh... Joseph, and the Macarius, and so forth, and women like Sarah, and Syntactica, and, um, well, Foreman is the pastor of the St.
[76:14]
Joseph's, Foreman is the big one, and so forth. He was a mild woman, I can't think of her name. Oh, excuse me. Well, Moses also had his cycle, about 40 or so apothecary line, the Moses cycle, because he eventually, he was one of those who was ordained a priest. I want to go a little bit more on that. He's termed in history as Moses the Black. I want to go a little bit more on that because there's a whole question of this use of the term black from the apothecary, but that's another story. But one of the important things to keep in mind is that you have people then coming from Nubia, and probably as in later on the Middle Ages from Ethiopia, who would also be found in Ardentosso, that's a monastic tradition, as well as Greeks, and as well as Arabs and so forth, and the Romans, and the Egyptians themselves, who did not already live in Hong Kong. In fact, the whole thing blows up, that's another story.
[77:16]
There's the apple thing, one of the apple things that's about the El Moses is like this. I kind of like it, you know, clothes and the apple thing. A brother of Skeet, a descendant of Skeet, about 40 miles or so to the south, west of Ethiopia, committed a fraud. The old man held a council, and they sent him as the Abba Moses to come. Normally this disciplinary council takes place on Saturday and Sunday with the meeting of all the hermits. They sent the Abba Moses and asked him to come, but he refused. The priest in charge was to be the local parish priest, who normally often was not a monk, in this case he was not a monk. The priest in charge then turned to him and said, come, for all the brothers are waiting for you. And so the Abba Moses, he bought his time, of course, in the making of the character of Peter and Eve, the Abba Moses arose and took a bag's gift that had a hole in it and filled it with sand.
[78:27]
And he came then carrying it on his back. The brothers going out to meet him said to him, what's that, father? And the old man replied, my sins run behind me, and I do not see them. And today I am come to judge the sins of another. Hearing this, the brethren no longer said nothing more, and they forgave his guilty brother. Again, it is the anecdote and then the teaching, the spiritual teaching. There are two names that I would like or should be mentioned. I'll mention them briefly and... Well, excuse me, how much more time do we have? Probably 10, 15 more minutes. Well, before I mention them, I'll mention them exactly a minute from now.
[79:32]
Before I mention them, I'll ask them any question. I talked a lot. I don't know. Another word which I didn't mention, because the rest of the reporters would really be in terms of Hezekiah. How many of you should confuse Hezekiah and Apostate? Hezekiah, of course, is again a great theme, and especially in the Apostate manner. And of course, what it basically means is the contemplative light, is the light of contemplation and prayer.
[80:40]
And it means that a hesychito means being seated. To be seated and therefore in a prayerful position. I think it's extremely important to understand that for the early desert fathers and the early monks, your physical posture is important in terms of prayer. Just as it is for the non-Christian monks. it's the personal Lord's deletion and so forth, the deletion of, the physical deletion of prayer, so that in return of being seated for a little while then for prayer. And that is a, that the whole notion is of inner repose and of prayer. And the, and the key then means then we come down to the life, the life of prayer, which of course already introduces you into a Greek world, but Hezekiah is the work of the monk. And that's why you should keep this cell, and it's manual labor, called predisposing men for this interior prayer, this experience of prayer.
[81:55]
So there's a great deal about the epitheia and the apophlegmata, but it's a notion that develops and grows, and so with it you have the whole rich spiritual tradition that develops from the Eastern, the monks of the Eastern Church. He used to say that Jesus' prayer lived and breathed and so forth, and then the inner light, the congregator, the talmud and so forth. But all of that is a key of tradition. Now, apotheia is to be seen as something that preceded this. The man who uses the talmud apotheia, the man who I was talking about this evening, is a guy named Evagrius. Evagrius of Cornwall. And Evadrius is one of those names that when you bring it up, it all breaks loose. Evadrius is an amazing man.
[82:58]
He became a non-person. He was one of those people who almost became a non-person. But fortunately historians are like detectives. and we are not, we are creations of those persons. And really in the last 50 years or so, the vagueness has been nourished from the murky shadows of oblivion. Do we now assume now a personality that can also take rightful direction with the words? It's nasty, very contingent, but under our name, which I think is dangerous to be thought in that way. I'll mention Evagrius for the time being. Evagrius is the author of the notion of apatheia. That means he doesn't start with it, from where he has it. Evagrius is the one who really puts it around.
[84:01]
For him, apatheia is the entranceway to the contemporary world. in the entranceway and the contemporary way. Now you get, when you arrive at the upper third, and you begin to realize the concrete. And there's a key at the bottom. There's a foot of cherry. There's a flower of cherry. But that's how you moved it. There are two separate arms. You didn't mention it specifically, but I'm wondering how, if at all, the art of beer influenced historical beer, and it comes from the early writings from that. Well, historical beer is a collection that was made, if I'm not mistaken, based on an earlier collection originally made in Greece, and they aren't from a place in North Carolina.
[85:06]
This collection is a kind of a collection of various fathers. Now, as a historical work, we know that you don't always have the text of the original father. There are textual problems with this collection. But it comes out in the New Year on those who are in the anti-Catholic tradition. Because the whole purpose of the writing is to teach you the method of prayer, of inner prayer, which is the uses of the Jesus Prayer, and all of that, those wicked uses of the Jesus Prayer, that take root without knowing that you are having a certain mystical strength. But, what it supports then is to give you the earliest running of the father, going back to origin and so forth, and give that traditional prayer.
[86:11]
Now, it is possible, because the nourish, the technique, the breathing technique, the use of a monological prayer, has already been done with the daddy's father. No question about it. They have a lot in certain things. It is very intuitive, but there are other practices. Use a single phrase. And, of course, the mind makes that known. It's passion. Well, I would also like to mention cattilio, because you can't mention cattilio without mentioning verbiage. You know, that's where the whole problem lies. But the, um, the use of this, this time, I'll, I'll, I'm, I'm, I'm going to ask a question. And the colloquial idea, it comes to, Taro reads them, he puts them in there. Apasea, if I'm not, I'm not exactly sure, but I'm ready with that mind and then do. I don't think that Apasea as a search comes into it, it's more of a cheat.
[87:12]
I don't think that Apasea comes into it, and I won't explain why. What do you think will generate to a perfect atmosphere in terms of becoming a single level of universal light by next fall? Will it be a totally integrated universe? Or is that pushing it too far? Well, I think in terms of understanding our alliance today, there will be some value. I don't know, in that sense, there's a lot of philosophical debates. We speak about how our psychological and empirical and emotions and so forth are under control. I think all of that is there. I think when the ancients used it, they didn't use it, of course, all the time, but now I think that's really anachronistic, but most of us don't have that sort of perspective. But yeah, I think so. I think that humanity should be staying a little more to the basics. being dropped basically in our tube, is also based upon mental health.
[88:25]
What the criticism of people for it, and it's a corrupt criticism, it's a declaration, is that If you're going to be without emotions, then you really are, you are not really human, you are a stone. But, back then, no one thought, heaven knows, we promised, nobody knew shit. But the, um, and we don't care about it, you know, we should, we should, uh, we should, we are the support, we are the thought and function, and so forth, and that team comes out, leaps on the stage with me. And for a long time there, we're describing more or less the significance of the Christian idea. Those who would declare it, would say, well, we're in the opening now. One shall never plead for shit. I would see patterns and emotions. But the idea is to have a balance. And the other way around. not so much a complete inner control, but as a variety of harmony, and so forth.
[89:31]
And I think that always, you see, there are going to be tendencies either to... that one has to overdo one side or the other. I think the notion that there comes out of a certain spiritual worldview that at it's extreme, don't be non-christian. That's why I was very unnerved when I went to be very genuine and to be able to run an amative mission could also end up being non-christian and eclectic as well. But I am able to do it. I have people calling from both sides, in terms of a lot of spirituality. And in everything, evasion is subject to certain caution. And emotional failure is subject to certain caution. Now, we can remember a kind of spirituality we may have learned and picked up, where you weren't supposed to get upset about a lot of things in history, but you were supposed to get upset about so much and so forth.
[90:39]
And that, I think, in the end, would be a kind of travesty on a very I preached an ideal, a fundamental ideal of when a home is formed and a home is made from a tree. You don't have to be slave of the machine. I probably would go over a million. Fine.
[91:17]
@Transcribed_v004
@Text_v004
@Score_JJ