Do you take any sugar in your coffee? No, I don't take no sugar. I never use sugar, not much. I was wondering, on this property, where was the first house ever built? Now, when you see Elizabeth down there, find out about the chemists too, will ya? The chemist was related in to the Nagels or the Powells. And one of the chemists got to be a motorman on that streetcar line up there. He was a motorman.

[01:01]

And Phil Kimmis. So you kind of find out about her what she knows about the Kimmises. Maybe some of these pictures we saw here is the Kimmises, I don't know. That we couldn't get no name off of, you know. Do you know the name of the people who first lived on this property before the Nagels? You know? Nobody. Nobody. Nobody. Except a slave. A Negro. The first guy that lived here on this place, he lived down there where the swamp is.

[02:03]

And he was an escaped slave from the South. And he built himself a little house down there, right along the edge of the swamp. And while I plowed, I'd plow up the knives and forks and stuff like that, and I went to inquire. And Charlie Dunks, up here, remembers that. And he planted four little pear trees down there, and they bore fruit for years. Then they finally wore out, and I dynamited them out. And he was the first center, but he didn't own nothing. He was a squatter. Oh, I see. And he died out, or burned out, and then the niggers came in here. And when they came in here, there wasn't even room enough to set a chair down. Nothing but woods. Solid woods. And they cleared all this land, pulled all these stumps. There are two kinds of soils here.

[03:07]

When you go down the road, This is the oak soil over here. And this way is the pine soil. And the pine soil is loose and shealy, and the oak soil is black and gummy and hard to plow. Oh, I tell you, it's bullheaded. So there's two kinds of land. And the line goes right down through here. It goes over the hill. past my brother's and goes through to the Pennsylvania line. That's a section. And that goes from here, down through here, clear over to Schuyler County. Then, every so often there's a section line. Then, one goes through down there where Bob Butler is. The schoolhouse is up here. Butler lives here. That goes through up there where I am, on the east side of the house, separates me from Bauer and farther up my brother, and that goes over the hill and goes through to the Pennsylvania line.

[04:19]

And from there, it goes through to Schuyler County. Then you go some more farther west, and you find another one. And finally, you come to the Steuben County line. That starts down there and goes straight up there. So it's what they call section lines every so often, see? That's the way they surveyed this land out, see? That's the way they surveyed it out. Did that slave who lived down here have any family? Who? Did the slave who lived down here... No, he wasn't married, huh? No. Charlie up here remembers the Civil War, you know. And Charlie Ewell, he remembers the Civil War. They were old people. So when the Civil War was won,

[05:29]

This guy down here, if he burned down, he could have went to Elmira, too, you know. I don't know what become of him, I never heard say. He could have went to Elmira. But he built down in here to hide, so they wouldn't get a hold of him. I suppose the earliest settlers would have lived along Hendee Creek, huh? Who? The earliest settlers. They would have lived along the creek there. Well, yeah. The Hendees come in here. And the beach is made into the Hendees. And you know, when you go down the Hendee Creek Road, Mr. Eeks had a house sit right along the creek here. You know where it is.

[06:33]

He lived there for a while after he died. One of the Baldwin boys built that house. He bought that off of Mike Madigan, that little corner. Then comes this creek. It goes down across under the road. Then over here on this corner were all these houses. They weren't there. But just a little farther down, I remember the old Handy Home, where one of the brothers lived. And that's how this got to be called Handy Creek, after him. Well, that thing sat there. Chimney there kept tumbling down, kept tumbling down. And then in 1921, they widened the road out. And they took it out of there and destroyed it. Handy was the first settler up here in Handy Creek. And the other Handys settled down below Water Street, down along the river.

[07:36]

Those were the first Handys, yeah. Then came the Dutenhavers. And, uh... I forget some other ones. And I tell you who the boys were now, lived down here where Bozes lived. Sam and Tim Thompson. I knew both of those, too. And they sold out. And they went down Pennsylvania. And the Boze place down here was started by a colored man. And he had a white woman. for his wife. Charlie Wool told me that. And they had a girl born. And she was marked off black over here and white over here. Doesn't seem possible.

[08:36]

And she was awful shy. She never showed herself much. And Charlie Wool, he'd seen her a few times. And she died. And across the creek, over here, was a little orchard. There were some apple trees in there. There's where she's buried. Buried right in there. Oh, you see, Charlie Uhl knew a pile of history around here. He came in here young and early. And I was always a great hand to eat that stuff. I just loved history. And I listened to all of it. I just loved it, you know. And their name was Thompson? No, no. I don't know what this colored man's name was. I forgot. He probably told me, and I forgot. And he's married to this white woman, and he sold out to the Welshers. And they farmed it there. And they had a team of young horses, a team of colts.

[09:42]

And he hooked them up on the wagon, was going to break them, and they run down in there where that barn is there like that. and throwed him off of the wagon and he hit his head on a stone. He died right to the skull. Then they sold out, took Tim and Sam Thompson. They lived there for years. And finally, Tim and Sam, their relatives was down in Pennsylvania, and the Hartmans came along, George Hartman and Emma, and they bought it. And the Thompson boys went down there. And I think we went down and made them a visit many, many years afterwards, and they still was all right, but they're gone now. So that black man, the first black man, did own the house then? He built that house there. He started it. You'd be surprised at a lot of color that came in here. Then they left it there. And if I hadn't had Charlie, you would tell me.

[10:53]

about Chief Police Weaver's grandfather, and those two buried on that bank there, nobody would know anything about it. And you know what Police Chief Weaver's grandfather's business was? He dug all these cellars under these houses with a slip scraper and a team of horses. He dug the cellars here for the Nagels, he dug the cellar for the Madigans down there, and the Kellers, that was a heartland barn. And that was his livelihood. Go from place to place, wherever they started to build, he'd take his horses and dig their cellar. Boy, that must have been some job, you know. And I remember Police Chief Weaver well. I remember him well. I was back in the teens, in the early 20s. Then there was another Weaver. They're all related. He's the one that built that big hotel down there that Sammy Matthews had.

[11:59]

You remember where the washette was down there? He built that. That big house right, that big white house right there, that is the old Weaver Homestead. And he built that bar in there, that hotel, and that grocery store and drinking place. And I remember when that hotel was a boomerang. Finally lost out. And then there was a hotel on Handy Creek, where Dutch Hill, Dutch Hill comes down here and Handy Creek comes here. There was a hotel in here. That was Polly's hotel. There was a kind of a fad, like everybody was building hotels and they paid. The lumberman was in here. The first hotel, Polly's Hotel, was down across from Fred Diggerson. You still could see the arch back in the hill.

[13:00]

It was laid up with stone where they kept the beer, to keep it cool. It all caved in now. Then they moved up here. Then, when my father came in here in the early 12s, 13s, the thing was getting empty. Didn't pay no more. They were set. So, empty. And right above was Wolf Sawmill, big sawmill. So, one night, before the thing was abandoned, a guy comes up, comes up with a horse and buggy. And comes up there around midnight. He ties the horse fast to the tree. and the buggy with the horse, and he climbs up in there and takes a rope and hangs himself. Gets up in the morning, they had dead men hanging in the tree. And I remember that tree, it was a willow.

[14:03]

Then Drexel and I ever bought it. And he built that little house across there, that pretty little house, and he put a store in there. And he sold everything. Hardware, and horseshoes, and nails, and belts, and radiators. He was a big businessman, that guy. And he bulldozed, had that wall of tree bulldozed out where that guy hung himself. You know, way back in the early 17s, they were lumbered in here already, you know. Oh yeah. Do you remember when they found those two great big gears, wheels in the river, up above Jake Rode's cabin there, where the four branches are?

[15:08]

No, I didn't know about that. There was a big sawmill up there, a whole monster. And the turban lays up there yet, unless it washed away. Oh, they saw lumber up there. Then, before they got a sawmill in here, they'd tie them together in rafts, and float them down the Chemung River, when the river got tight, and float them to the Susquehanna. When they got down in the Susquehanna, it took an expert to get those things through between them rocks. There were rocks sticking up down in there, but they'd get them through. And you know where that landed them? All down in Chesapeake Bay. And they saw them. And they saw them all. Am I keeping you? No, no. No, I ain't. I ain't. Those great big wheels, they were made out of cast iron.

[16:09]

They found them. They're up in the big flat museum. Oh, I see. Oh, yeah. You'll see them up there. Up in the big flat museum. That was what they called the old gang's mill sawmill. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There was a kind of island there, wasn't there? That's a kind of an island. The river goes in four channels. And they're swift. And they picked this channel over here on this side. And that, that was, turned that, that turbine. Oh, the thing, the thing was a great big turbine. And that was on the saw, and they sawed lumber, you know. Then we tied that together, too. They kind of, kind of shaped like this. And just filed in, roped it together, and then let her float. There was no railroads around here, nothing like that then, you know. Then I also remember, talking with men that worked on the Erie Canal. We had the Erie Canal in here.

[17:14]

Now, you go down towards Wellsburg, and you come out of Wellsburg, all this over here on this side here is the Erie Canal. You can still see the canal itself, yeah. Then you go up here in the big flats and go above the village and up in there, you can see all the old canals up in there, yeah. And then this man that worked on the Erie Canal, he drove horses. And he also was a veterinarian, his name was Potter. And he saw his last days out over here with Lou Daly on the farm where Shirley is. Where Shirley slept. That was the old Seymour Daly farm, as I told you. And Lou inherited it. And then Lou sold it and built a house downtown. And he took the job of being a turnkey in the county jail down there.

[18:16]

County jail, yeah. And this old Pickering down here, lived down here, where this cabin that I had, the 72 flood took out, his father was sheriff of Sherman County. And Pick was born in the county jail. Because he lived in the county jail, because his father was sheriff. And he had an uncle, or a great uncle, his name was Colonel Pickering. And he was a big shot in the American Revolutionary War under George Washington. And then Frank down here had a brother in New York City. He was a jeweler. And you know there's some of these pickings in here yet? That liquor store over there, a bulkhead out there. Those are Pickerings. They're all the way back. They're related back to this old guy down here. The Pickerings was always in politics and they were highly educated people.

[19:20]

This guy down here had a college education. It was fun to talk with him. But his sister stuck him up here. Too much of this. Couldn't handle liquor. So... In the summer, he'd farm it down there. He had a horse and a cow, he'd raise strawberries, garden stuff. In the fall of the year, he'd put an eel rack in, cost him $25 license. He'd catch sometimes two, three hundred pounds of eels in one night. Oh yeah, it was good. Everything went for booze. So his sisters stuck him up here to get him out of town, to get him out of mischief. And then he'd go to work. He'd bolt all the windows, shut the doors, and go down to Barker, Rose, and Clinton, and get a job. And he was shipment clerk. Then when spring comes, he'd come to Mr. Barker, and he'd say, Mr. Barker, I heard the birdies sing this morning.

[20:31]

He says, I guess I'll go back on the farm. He'd quit. Oh, were they tickled to death to get him back again in the fall? There was very few educated people like there is now. Nowadays, everybody's got a college education put in there. Not then. And that's what them business people wanted. They wanted people with a college education. I wonder where he went to school. I don't know where he got his hobby in Elmira or someplace, because his father was sheriff of Shimon County. Then, up above, Grigori was right swan. He was another one. He was the most brilliant carpenter you ever saw. Talk about talent.

[21:33]

But, this stuff. So his sisters, they got sick of him too, and they put him up there. One of his sisters was Mrs. Shrappy. And the other one was related in, or married in, to the Keefe's insurance. And Frank, uh, uh, Ratswan's father built the city hall. He was a contractor. But this guy, he spoke Bratton. So when the old man died, She gave the girls their share, but this one down here was dished out to him so much a month. Or we'd have walked right through it, see? And that Rat Swan was the most brilliant man to talk to. He was well-read, good-educated. But an alcohol. Very worthless. Is that his nickname? His right name was Rasta Swan. We called him Rat. I tell ya, he was quite a guy.

[22:41]

When this 46th flood was, he got washed out. He lived up here with my mother and father for a couple of weeks. My father and him, boy, could they ever get together and visit. My father traveled the world, you know. This guy here, he's been around too. And I don't know how he could do it. He built a sleigh. to pull his groceries across from the road over, where the streetcar was, over to his place. And that sleigh was all put together with tenets. How he ever got those tenets made like that and got them in there so smooth and so square is more than I ever could figure out. Well, on the last day, he come downstairs with us. He got cancer. And on the 4th of July, we took him out. and took him down to St. Joe's to remember Hope. And I took the slate, and I kept it for a souvenir.

[23:42]

And my guess is if the 46th Flood didn't get a hold of it, it's gone. It's gone, yep. Is that hot enough, John? Is that coffee hot enough? Sure, it's hot enough. It's nice, yeah, it's okay. Well, I'll be moving along. I don't want to bother you anymore, no. Well, I appreciate your coming over. Did those swans, whatever happened to their property down there? The property, his swan? Yeah. His sisters bought that. Then he had a niece. And she didn't take to it. The county took it over. It's county property. The county took it over, yeah. Then right down below, about as far as from here over to Barnes, was another cottage.

[24:46]

And that was carried. And he was an umbrella repairman. And he had a single out downtown, Umbrella Hospital. And he fixed umbrellas. And he fixed umbrellas for my folks too. Then when he got old, he retired down there. And he lived in that cabin there. Well, the first year of deer season in 1936, I got up in there. And I stopped in and visited with him. And he was a nice guy. He was broad-minded and bright. And he was a mechanic. And he was failing. He was getting kidney troubles. And I think that winter, towards spring, he died. So the place was empty then. So the county got that, too, after a while. How much acreage did they have? those people? Oh, not too many acres.

[25:51]

Swan grew peaches and asparagus and garden stuff. And after he got older, he couldn't work the land anymore and then he dropped it. And he probably had a couple, two, three acres around there and Kerry down below, I don't He might have had a couple acres down there too. And Jake Rodey down there, he had two or three acres around there. Now on Pickering property, I think there was around 14 or 15 acres there. Okay, now my sister was coming back in February. Oh yeah? And she says if the weather is rough up here, she's going to stay a little longer. Yeah. And the weather is pretty rough. Yeah. So she might as well stay. It's been one of the nastiest winter that I've seen in quite a while.

[26:54]

We didn't have too deep of snow, but that bitter, stinging cold, oh, it's awful. Yeah. And the turkeys up there, and the deer, and the wildlife is getting awful hungry. Yeah. And the other day, 22 turkeys. come into my brother's too, sir. Really? That's how tame they are. Really? Yes, sir. And a friend of mine went by and they stirred them out and they went up in the wall of ours and they went up to the line fence and worked their way back down to the woods over towards the creek over here, the county creek here. Yes, sir. And I tell you, it's tough. If the snow would get off a deep here, they'd starve to death. But now it's kind of opened up a little, you know. Okay, I left my car over there. And I'm glad I had a chance to help you out a little bit. Well, I'm glad you could come over, John. I'll tell you, I gave you a good reference there on her.

[28:01]

She'll know a lot. Then, something might come to me when my sister comes home and I'll find out what Paul's last name is. I think his last name is Paul Respekt. He was adopted. And he's a Catholic and he's a very devoted Catholic. And he lives some place here in down here what they call Mossy Glen or South Corning. And she'll remember more about him than I did. And the last time I saw him We was going to a funeral together. And you see, I haven't seen him in years and I've kind of forgot about him. And I'll find out through my sister. Or you can find out from Elizabeth Smith. She knows him well. She's related to him. Not by blood, but by being adopted. His mother was a Sister of the Guardian. Oh, I see. Oh, there's a man that can help you out a lot.

[29:03]

What about these dailies? Were they Irish? The dailies were Irish. They came from Ireland. Yeah. Well, did you know that Brother John's mother was a daily? You know, she's, you know, Brother John. Was she any relative to these dailies out there? I don't know. I'm going to ask her. I don't hardly think so. Yeah. I wonder when they come over. They come over early, you said? Yeah, these daddies come over here already around 1750, 60, somewhere in there. Oh, really? Yeah. There is a grave, if it's still left. up here on the South Corning Road, where you're going to Mosset Glen. And that's right in a barnyard. It's a shame. The cows are all walking it down. There's tombstones in there from 1700 and something. And some of these old first-timers, they came in here early. They were pioneers. And the last... Elmer Daly is still alive.

[30:09]

He was an electrician. I went to school with him. And I went to school with Edwin. And Edwin was the great grandson of this Daly that came in here. And I told you, couldn't read. Edwin just died here a year or two ago. What was the first name of that Daly that came in? You mean the old man himself? I couldn't tell you what his first name was. If... Elmer Daly would maybe know. And you'd be surprised, though, how little sometimes people know of their grandparents. Yeah, or their great-grandparents. They don't seem to be interested. They don't seem to be interested, yeah. Well, thanks very much, John. Appreciate it. Oh, you're welcome. That's all right. I'd help you out a lot. Summertime, you get caught and busy. Yeah, yeah. I do it all, John. Oh, no, I don't. I don't have to use that much at all. I take very good care of them.

[31:10]

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