How was your discussion? What would be good to be shared with the others who weren't in your group and with yours truly? Yes. Oh, you were just like Santa Claus about to go up the chimney. Well, you don't know. The night before Christmas, Santa Claus puts his finger beside his nose and he goes up the chimney. Maybe it's easier than to say something. Go up the chimney or something? Yes. Well, you have a shamanic side, so, you know.

[01:03]

It's just, it's the shamanic American Santa Claus. Okay. Gerald, you scratched your eyebrow. Yes. I can start, but I have permission to do this in English, because I was with the English group. You have permission, okay. And, Paul, you'll help me. Are you going to translate yourself? You can translate it for me. I'll make it as easy as I can. You're both from Lake Constance. So, the questions were, how do you read the koan and how does the practice refine your life? And reading the koan, a lot of people expressed a certain resistance to reading these koans. They go ahead and do it, but it's an intellectually very frustrating affair.

[02:11]

It appears to be literature sometimes, and there can be beautiful phrases in the poetry and so on, but often then you can't find the turning point without the help of someone who is more initiated into it. Several people confessed to listening to the CDs while they were driving. Why is that a confession? I don't know. I don't do it. I don't drive. Well, as long as they're not sitting cross-legged while they're... Maybe you turn.

[03:17]

One person said the best thing about listening to them in the car is how wonderful it is when you don't listen to them anymore. What a relief it is. I'm glad I can create small moments of happiness. Did they register the koan or did they listen to Oshis? They listened to the talks, yeah.

[04:29]

Then the koan is a very physical presence for many people in their lives. The book is there, open. has a significance and seems to sort of capture their attention. Even if they don't look at the words, the koan is somehow present. Can you translate that yourself? Well, this is like an object that holds a prisoner. It is always present, the book is always there and open, and sometimes you look inside and sometimes you don't, but you are always aware that it is there, or often, let's say. there is very often a physical interaction with the elements of the cone, so that the elements are associated with physical feelings.

[05:32]

When the elements of the cone go through your mind, or if you read them, they call forth certain physical responses, sometimes always the same response. Sometimes new and surprising physical feelings. It seemed to be a fact that when you are involved in zazen with good breathing and good posture, that letting the elements of the koan arise gives you a possibility for a new approach to them, that they open up in new ways. That's only the first question.

[06:35]

I don't think we have time for such long reports, but go on. I mean, I'm interested. Did I forget anything important, Paul? No. Thank you. But what had happened with the second question? Oh, the second question. Well, one person said that there is an effort to find a mutual language with people in her life who are not involved in this sort of spiritual path.

[07:45]

A Christian mother who is concerned that you don't go to church anymore and finding a way to communicate the value of what you're doing to someone who is suspicious or afraid of what's happening. Someone also expressed that she is looking for a common language with those who do not practice. As an example, a mother mentioned who is Christian and does not understand what she is doing and therefore tries to explain the values ​​of this Buddhist or spiritual practice to her anyway. And the pictures and ideas tend to inhabit your life. They become a part of the your daily experience, the association. If I am right, there was also an attempt to become stupid, quit trying to crack the nut intellectually.

[09:04]

And encouraging other people to do that by asking them to summarize the corn in one word. Anything else? Pretty, but... Is there anyone else in the group? Maybe two other things that we talked about. We talked about the value in this practice of refining, of the fact that it's a mutual, that we do it together, and that something arises even in the group, just us being together. that occurs through a mutuality and the situation refines us, not just some idea of what we're doing refining us.

[10:13]

Absolutely. Oh, and truly. We also talked about the value of repetition. Continuing to bring ourselves to the situation of the koan and our breath regardless of certain circumstances. Now adults, it would be interesting if any of you have an experience of having practiced refining your sense of patience, your emotions, your attention, and so forth.

[11:18]

Mindfulness. Christian, do you want to add something to what they said? Yes. I see tremendous relief because I always have such difficulties trying to understand. And I see that the tools with which I successfully work in life just don't tackle here. Intellectually I understand it can't work. It's such an unbelievable relief to just leave all this understanding rubbish behind.

[12:27]

and just take the word. Or just to use the anger or take the anger that's created through the not understanding of it. And I don't need to take it personally anymore and that is refining. Okay. Thanks. You know, we're doing koans because the Winter Branches group decided they'd like to do koans. So anyway, we're continuing at least this time. And talking about the refinement of the body, we have to decide Wednesday evening what we do.

[13:44]

I mean, Otmar has a favorite bar nearby where... In Säckingen. Oh, that's a long ways off. And I have a TV upstairs, which... Anyway, you have to let me know what you want to do. Okay, who else? Did you start to say something there, Frank? Or were you just going up the chimney? If you ask for experiences with refining patients, I instantly have an example. Okay. It means he's a magician. Don't take it. Oh, I shouldn't take it personally.

[14:45]

I have to refine myself. When last year I had to visit the chief doctor in regard to the very severe illness of my father, And I had really regular experience with extreme long waiting for him. And what I noticed, it just doesn't bother me at all. So I minded more that people who minded waiting minded that I didn't mind. That's why I try to at least seemingly have some kind of restlessness.

[15:46]

I see, you're so double compassionate. You were teaching them compassion and showing them restlessness. When I sat in the waiting room with Roshi last week, Oh, yeah, when I had to get x-rays and stuff, see if I was still in one piece. And he really didn't get impatient at all. There I was, and I was impatient. He didn't get impatient. I didn't? He got impatient. Oh. The doctor wasn't impatient either. Okay. Okay. I see that every aspect of my life

[16:52]

is different since i started to practice it makes me participate differently in life waiting yeah i can you know just take waiting for red light or a streetcar There is always meaning there, but I can let it become meaningless or something. There is always that choice is existent. And this really enables a completely different life. Someone else?

[18:22]

Yes. In our group we did not explicitly speak about the refinement. But implicitly many things became clear. For one, in dealing with the reading of koans, It got clear that you have to suspend or wait with this kind of seeming the understanding that And that this happens through pausing repetition and sort of letting it grow, letting it be. And through this a kind of more dialogue-like situation arises.

[19:31]

One goes into a process with an open end. And this openness was experienced by many as a big freedom. Usually learning processes always have a right and wrong or true and false result at the end. And the therapists in the group especially appreciate this openness because they can bring this into their work. There was maybe implicit agreement of everyone that it opens spaces and perceptions.

[20:50]

Koan study does, koan practice does. Yes, that way of approaching situations as processes, to open dialogues. Okay. This morning you spoke about another possibility, a way to read the Quran. And you mentioned that already was a different koan where it says if you see smoke on the other side of the hill then you know there is a fire somewhere.

[21:50]

And there you said there is smoke and there is fire only these two in practice was that. And this morning there was this approach, there's a turtle and there's also fire. And to approach a koan that way is quite difficult because fire can mean so many things. Fire we need for cooking. Fire is dangerous. A candle fell last night while we were killing on the burning candle on the altar.

[22:54]

And if the sun goes onto the black curtains in the zendo, it's too hot in the zendo. Also something to do with fire and warmth. And I find it difficult to find an access to the koan with all these associations which come with the word fire, turtle, horn, smoke, whatever. It can be anything, yeah. Well, everything. I found this a difficult access. Well, two things. One is this fire thing. I asked Frank if we'd come back from Kinian and found the back house aflame, which was a real possibility, who would have known what to do?

[24:06]

And Frank said, I don't even know where the fire extinguishers are. And so clearly, again, I've mentioned it before, we should have fire drills once a month or so, so people know how to operate the fire extinguishers, because this building would really burn fast. I've been in buildings burning fast. I don't have time to do anything. Part of what Otmar brought up is we spoke in the when we talked about the first, second koan, I guess, I don't know, second koan, a pramana, a valid cognition.

[25:13]

Pramana. No, I have to find the word. A valid perception. Yeah, but it really means something like an actualized truth event that leads to enlightenment or lessening of suffering. That's not bad, is it? Enlightenment or lessening of suffering. In other words, it's true from a point of view of Buddhism if it leads to enlightenment or lessening of suffering. Otherwise, it's sort of irrelevant. And what's clear about that is it has to be a percept or an inference. And it can't be scripture.

[26:29]

So all later Buddhism, all the Indian school of logic, which is the background of the Buddhism we study, says scripture is not valid cognition. And that's in the background of this koan. How do you make, so one part of this, as I call it, contrastive paradigms, How do you make sutra valid cognition? A valid cognition? It can be an intellectual knowing. that it had to go down on the gut level.

[27:45]

Oh, that's better, yeah. But it just... Yeah, anyway, yes. Where in the koan do they talk about very clearly when... Sutra or scripture is valid, known. Where are the two words? Well, okay, but piercing ox hide. And zwar das Durchdringen von Ochsenhaut. And the example of, you know, the fly hitting the paper wall, like a Japanese house, the fly hitting the paper walls is how most people read sutras. They're like a fly buzzing at the paper and they don't get through the paper.

[28:49]

Piercing oxide is more like piercing parchment. Your concentration is so intense, you know what's on the other side of the paper. So there's a lot of... discussion in Dharmakirti and so forth about when does scripture satisfy the requirements of truth? It's only when you can realize the practice being presented in the scriptures And that is only when you can manifest what is presented in the writing.

[30:10]

Yes. Samuel? Yes. I experience it a little differently, I would like to ask. I experienced this a little bit differently and like to ask if this is also legitimate. I let myself be guided by that what I get attracted by and what I like. Okay, so I then take this into everyday life and into the zazen and this is not really like piercing holes, it's more an organic process of, let's say, decomposure.

[31:31]

You know, it's falling apart of the parts. Okay. And the rest, I didn't like that much. And the rest, which I don't like so much, I just let it come. It comes, and if it doesn't, I just let it be. And without this kind of giant effort, I have the feeling it's kind of guides, and I think it's not that bad. Yeah, okay. I don't think it's so bad either. Ich glaube auch nicht, dass es schlecht ist. Aber die Frage ist eigentlich, fehlt mir da etwas?

[32:37]

The question is more like, is something missing here for me? No. Perfect. Also ich muss nicht die Eigenwortwand aufschreiben. She doesn't need to look for the Eigenwortwand, which is the steep name of famous climbing face in Switzerland. No. But, you know, sometimes, as it says in the Quran and in the commentary, through the holes in the paper, light may come, but also sometimes a silly fly. Now, I tried to give you the most fundamental way to study koans, which is to treat it like, as I said, the ingredients for a recipe you don't understand.

[33:39]

And you have to have the patience of a bodhisattva like Frank. To let those ingredients work in your daily life, in the kitchen of your life, sometimes for years. Okay. And throughout your lifetime, these koans continue to enrich it if you happen to be a person who can make use of koans. So, I mean, we have to really decide whether the experiment for our kind of practice and our kind of ability to... time we can give to practice, it works.

[34:57]

And as you know, I'm going to, I want to ask you at some point, I'm going to try to write it down, because I think having to spend a week sashin, a week The Winter Branches seminar, there's a lot of time for somebody each year, and if we're going to continue this, what kind of program can we have that works practically for people? Did you all notice when winter branches are referred to in the koan? So when you can see spring and autumn on the budless branches. So maybe we have the spring group, the autumn group, and the winter group.

[36:11]

And the dead sticks. Okay. All right. In addition to And parallel to this more fundamental way of working with koans. And this fundamental way of working is not just about koans. It's how to look at the whole of your life and big aspects of your life. The practical way is to look at the teachings specific teachings in a koan. So if you wanted to be practical in this koan you'd ask yourself What is dwelling in the realms of body and mind?

[37:26]

Okay, so you kind of fool around with that. And it means for sure not just that you have experiences, that you have sensations, feelings and thoughts. And it's not just that you have experiences, feelings and thoughts? but that you dwell in those feelings, sensations, thoughts. So you establish your continuity, your sense of self in feelings, thoughts and emotions. Now, that's worth a few years of studying. Do you establish in feelings, thoughts and sensations your sense of continuity, of identity, etc. ?

[38:38]

Well, you certainly do. Is there an alternative? What would it mean not to dwell in the realms of thought, feeling and emotions? That's challenge enough for the first few years of Zazen practice and mindfulness practice. Okay. And then, to not get involved in myriad circumstances. Can you imagine being present in the world, conscious, and not being involved in myriad circumstances?

[39:59]

And what would not being involved mean? Okay, now this koan gives you very specific instructions. It's prescriptive. We can say it's performative and prescriptive. Performative? It shows you? No, you have to perform it. And the prescriptive is, it prescribes, know the five scandals. Know the five clusters or five standards. Then it says, know the six senses. Know the six sense objects. And know the fields and minds created by the joining

[41:00]

of the sense, the particular sense and the particular sense object. Okay. Well, I mean, I think we've been here, I've been teaching in Europe 20 years. I think some of us have got shorter to the end of that list. And it's actually quite an accomplishment. And especially if you feel it. And then it talks about the five methods of breathing.

[42:30]

Counting. Following. Stopping. And stopping is to hold at the top or bottom of your breath. And it's also the rhino gazing at the moon, but that will come to you later. So just you're breathing every day, right? You get familiar, you let attention articulate the breath. Ihr lasst Aufmerksamkeit den Atem artikulieren. And you let breath articulate attention. Und ihr lasst den Atem die Achtsamkeit artikulieren. When you read, what are you doing? You read a word, pause, word, space between word, word, phrases. It's all word, spaces, word, spaces, right?

[43:33]

That's scriptures. Wenn ihr lest, dann ist es Wort, Lücke, Pause, Wort, Lücke, Pause, Satz. Und das ist dann die Schrift. And you have to bring attention to each word. Und dann muss die Aufmerksamkeit zu jedem Wort führen. So, this koan is saying, if you want to have breathing which has the power of scripture. Und das koan sagt, wenn ihr... So it says, for the student, the whole world is his or her text. It means you have begun to articulate attention and consciousness and perception through the inhale and the exhale. You begin to articulate attention and consciousness and perception through inhaling and exhaling.

[44:44]

So breath and attention or breath and consciousness are articulating each other. When you do that, and it becomes the way you are, things happen which I cannot tell you about. Being at a red light or being at the doctor's for hours is not even waiting. There's not even waiting required. So there's counting, following, stopping. And stopping is also having your breath so smooth and... subtle that it's virtually not discernible.

[46:03]

And this is what I'm telling you is in the introduction to this book. It's a traditional teaching. And contemplating is then through the subtle breath being able to know all the parts and organs of the body. Okay. And returning means now breath is mind itself. You've returned to mind itself as the object of attention. Zurückkehren heißt, dass der Atem jetzt Geist an sich ist.

[47:09]

And you return to? The attention returns to mind itself as the object of attention. Okay. Now, this is real basic. What? Mind is aware of itself as mind. The best example I can come up with is if you see a stone in water. When you see the stone, you see the water through which you're seeing the stone. That's easy to do. And you see that the water refracts and magnifies the stone. Okay, so you see the effect of the water on your perception of the stone.

[48:28]

So returning in this six aspects of breathing. returning home, is now as if you were seeing the water, you see consciousness itself seeing the stone. And I have an experience of seeing you within consciousness as clearly as if we were all sitting in water above our heads. Did he say, you have that? Yes. That was a spousal question. Of course, you can take the stone out of the water and see the effects of it not being in the water.

[49:48]

Natürlich könnt ihr auch den Stein herausnehmen und den Stein anschauen ohne den Auswirkungen des Wassers. I can't take you out of mind and see the effects of you not out of mind because that's not possible. Und ich kann euch nicht aus dem Geist herausnehmen und schauen, wie ihr ohne den Auswirkungen vom Geist ausschaut, weil das einfach nicht möglich ist. But I can see the difference between seeing you within consciousness and seeing you within other ways of knowing and noticing. So even if you don't like all of this stuff about tigers, turtles, and mortars, and, you know, Shushan, Shushan, Shushan boy, I mean Shujing, and so forth. We can sing that together, I bet.

[50:49]

Yeah. Shujing. Yeah, so... Then what if you don't like those things? you have these practical things to do. You count your breath, you follow your breath, you stop your breath, you feel this. And it says, and purification I left out, but anyway, it says, those whose preparations are not sufficient should not fail to be acquainted with this. Guishan's admonition says... What's an admonition? A recommendation. A recommendation with a little bit of force.

[51:50]

Ermanung. If you have not yet embraced the principles of the teachings, you have no basis to attain understanding of the mystic path. So Colin says, if you're not quite ready to understand all this, or to approach it in this more fundamental way, You can make yourself ready by doing these basic things. And this opens you to understanding these, the twelve ayatanas and so forth. Understanding those opens you to what it means to not dwell in the realms of mind and body.

[53:10]

and to not be caught by myriad circumstances. These practical teachings are the tools of realization. Yeah, okay. Now, in the winter branches, we could concentrate on just that for the next two years or three years. We could say, we got to go on three, we realized what the problem was, and we went back to one. We could say, we got to go on three, we realized what the problem was, But this Quran assumes you're doing the work of those practical teachings. And I know we're all doing the work of these practical teachings. But I would say few of us have actualized them as the way we function all the time.

[54:35]

And the fruits of these teachings come when there's uninterrupted actualization of them. Okay. Maybe we should sit for a little bit, and if somebody wants to say something, what happened to your group? Thank you for translating. I would say perhaps the main thing to focus on

[56:47]

in our work on this koan this week is to focus on the experience of articulating consciousness and attention through the breath. And feeling and articulating the breath through attention and consciousness. Anyway, it's clear. We may notice other things in this koan and in our practice.

[58:01]

But if we take this one thing, articulating consciousness through the breath and breath through the consciousness, Like a needle and thread. Yeah. This, if we keep coming back to this, this alone will be a big step.

[58:26]

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