It's more like a trust, but also a trust in my resistance, a trust in my resistance. It's not just a trust in such a dynamic that is there and then makes it, it's also a trust in the whole ambivalence of the situation. Because this is my living being, and this is the way I can show myself living, by seeing and living both my closing things and also the need to open myself. I think I also have a need to close myself, not just a concept. For me, the Buddha and the body of the Buddha Something like being there with everything I give. That everything is allowed to be in place.

[01:01]

That it is allowed to be in my presence. That even closes the closing and the going away. So that something is there, then I first want the peace. And that's what I mean with openness. I would like to emphasize openness here. The openness to be able to close my eyes. And that for me is the key to being together. That everything is there. And the lonely thing about it is that only I can do it and no one else. And for me it belongs to say, I would say that this is not a necessary question, if we can all be lonely for a while, then we can live well.

[02:09]

and that the resistance should also be there, because I have the impression that if they are there, they will then get a tendency to rebel, without having to do it. Yes, I think so too. What I like about the whole closing in and closing out is this decoding. I see the Buddha as... or I see something decoding in the quality of the Buddha. Something that feels the possibility and I decide to realize it. And that is also included in this being-letting and resistance and openness and so on.

[03:28]

That a living being is somehow a kind of total experience or is so tangible and I also decide to realize it. Do you mean to close yourself, or do you mean to withdraw? There is a very big difference between whether I have to withdraw from above in order to be able to return, or close myself. That's a rhetorical question, isn't it? I think there are things in me and in all of us that are more closed or more careful, and things that are more open and more open.

[04:34]

And to get to know them. Maybe that's what Christian also means. For me, practice is an access to get to know what it is. And also to look, when do I pull myself back and when do I go ahead? Or when do I need this and when does this happen? And there I really need an openness rather than a concept or something. That's how I understood it. I had to think about what Marshall said last week, that sometimes he feels like an empty suitcase that you can take with you and then you can put it away and then he feels comfortable. And that's not how I feel. I see it for myself in such situations as here as a great challenge to look at what exactly is it that I need at the moment? What is my need? Is it important to be in this togetherness now?

[05:46]

Or is it good for me to look at the moment and say, okay, now I pull myself back and now I am for myself. And so I understood you too. And that's why the work is so great, cutting vegetables. Because it's a room that's big enough, even though so many people sit together, it's a big room to look at myself or to be alone. I asked my daughter Lea how she likes it here. And I said, great. I don't need to talk to anyone because I don't feel like it. To socialize, I don't even know what the German word for it is, is terribly exhausting. I think it's about not having to withdraw, not wanting to do that, and simply being in the room with people, I think that's something very pleasant.

[06:55]

That's what I'd like to say. I think it's wonderful that you're here and that you don't want to withdraw, don't want to maintain any conformist societies here, and to be the way I want to be, and I think that's absolutely normal. You live here, I've never been here, but I think it's just necessary that you think of yourself in such a way that you do what you want authentically. Of course, it leads to loneliness, because I would say that in the end you are lonely for a lifetime, or alone, and you can gain a lot of strength from being alone. I know that from my own experience. I have gained a lot of strength from being alone and from loneliness. This, of course, has far-reaching consequences for me in my private life, and I bear the consequences. I think it's wonderful. I am grateful for everything that has happened. It's great. It's a bit more complicated, I think, for a group of people who also share their daily lives.

[08:14]

Because the nice thing is that you don't have to talk when you don't want to. It's a practice mode. I already know situations where people come up to me and say, you are lost. And that is directly pointing back at me. You are not in contact. I say, I would like to go, but... I don't want to say what I say. I would say that there is this difficulty and that That it means to stand in front of them with a certain force, that I am in contact with them and that I have hurt someone. Or I am disappointed. It can be a minimal thing, but it is still appropriate to notice that it is so. For me, it is unusual.

[09:22]

I would rather not have been able to find contact with anybody. and the space is also full of these needs for contact and for constant appeal, for constant friendliness and willingness to communicate, and that always means to allow oneself to avoid this silence and loneliness, Not always, but also again and again a break with such expectations. And that is also a learning process, I think, in a community, to take such things personally, when someone doesn't speak, to say, oh, that doesn't mean anything now, but now I'm not liked or so. That means, on the level, I think, there is the task of developing a strength, because it is not easy

[10:22]

It's not easy. I think it's something you have to learn. I'd like to hear it now, because Christine has something to say. I think she's speaking in a similar direction. In that case, I'd like to continue this conversation after Christine, otherwise it will be too long. Thank you very much. After five presentations, of course, I don't have much more to say. Yes, the question for me was what touched me in these two weeks that I have been here.

[11:30]

And yes, what touches me is first of all and is simply to practice together. I am, I come from outside, I am, I am in the weeds, as they say in the choir, so someone who does not practice in the monastery. And so it's just being together, that it's possible to be together and to practice together. That's like a... like a whale that is stranded and then rolled back in and is fast and can swim. And that's just great. And I'm happy and I'm grateful that there is the Johanneshof and that there are the people who keep him fast and who practice here and who allow me to dive back in. And yesterday we had this free day, the day with the other schedule.

[12:44]

And it was very nice for me to see how Johanneshof can change, how it suddenly becomes a normal house, how people somehow wander around and go out and in. Sometimes you have the feeling that you don't really know what to do. It's nice out there and you miss something. You don't really know what. And then you see the people arrive by taxi and they also come from a different world. And then they are trained. Then they are told how it works and how to treat these food shells, which are very important here. And then there is this timeline that is also very new and you have the feeling, yes, that's quite a lot that's coming for the people who are new. And that seems somehow so foreign and somehow uncomfortable.

[13:49]

And for me it's just For me it is then overnight, the place turns again and when the bell rings again and I get out of bed, then I wake up again in this wandering Johannishof, which somehow simply has warm walls and where you go out with with a spirit that is not yet really together, but is somehow tied up in the robe. Then you just go down there. And then it's just this gliding into the form, into the structure. That's kind of what I want to say, too, that the structure and the form, that it simply enables a lot of things that you can experience here.

[14:51]

So that it looks deceptive, but actually for me, I experience it in such a way that it enables a lot. So this This not speaking in the morning, this not looking at each other, this not asking, how did you sleep or what did you dream? I always have big problems because Erich tells me, he just wants to talk in the morning or at least somehow have contact. And I actually just want to go into the wardrobe and then out into the house. And then to experience this experience of encounter, so to bow down to each other. We can only bow down to each other because we don't talk to each other and don't look at each other. Otherwise it wouldn't be possible to experience the house.

[15:51]

And somehow I have the feeling that Johanneshof in this time, on this morning, that Johanneshof allows us to move in the house like that. that we somehow enter every room. And then this wonderful meeting outside at 4 a.m. under the stars. I mean, where can you look at the stars at 4 a.m. with other people and no one says, oh, how nice. You just go there and look and then you go to the radio. And that's one side for me of practicing together. And the other side of practicing together, which I would also like to talk about, namely when it becomes difficult to practice together. And there is also, well, there is also this, well, I think we somehow felt in the last week that the practice makes one thin-skinned.

[16:58]

That was a word that came several times. And thinning means for me that not only the body becomes alive, but also the emotions become alive and you somehow become And yes, what do you do with it? You would like to experience this boundlessness and at the same time you also learn how to build boundaries. And for me it is important to study this. I would also like to look at this side. What I see is, yes, practicing together can mean that when difficulties arise, I get on my nerves myself and others get on my nerves. And these are just, these can be stupid things, yes. For example, I don't know, why is he snoring so loudly in the sense or yes.

[18:00]

Du hast sie noch gar nicht geschnauzt gehabt. Oder, also, diese Person, die mischt sich einfach überall ein. Oder, warum muss der immer Witze erzählen? Oder solche Dinge einfach. Und dann gibt es dann noch dazu diesen Über-Drüber-Prozess, dass ich mich dann über mich selber ärgere, weil ich mich über jemanden ärgere. Und das ist dann der Prozess, den nenne ich dann... the practical depth. The absolute practical depth is to be annoyed that you are annoyed and to think about why you are annoyed. Then the highlight is the question, What is my practice worth when I get angry at others? And how can you get out of it? What is it and how can you get out of it? And when I look at what is happening, I get angry. And that's just after what we learned last week. I'm in likes and dislikes somehow. So Roshi said there are

[19:06]

These three strings, yes, either you are really in hate and deception and blindness, or a slightly weaker form, you are in liking and not liking. And where we should move is pleasant and unpleasant. And then even further between pleasant and unpleasant there is a field of neither. Good, but I'm sometimes in liking and not liking. And then there's the idea of thinking. I think in the moment when the thinking comes in and gets me into the process. How can that be? Now I've been practicing for so long and I'm annoyed about the people. Then I identify with the thinking. So I'm hooking in here. And it can be very difficult to get out of there. That's why it's so deep in practice.

[20:17]

You can really sit deep in there. And then, yes, what can you do? And what I have found, what I can do, is first of all, this thinking, such thoughts, or to take the physical feeling of it as a signal and to take a step back with this signal and to look. And that takes me back to a level First of all, a level of acceptance. And for me that acceptance lies under the four foundations of mindfulness. Because that acceptance somehow enables me to look, enables me to see what is happening and also enables me to look at things in myself that I don't want to see.

[21:18]

And if I can't take the step back, then I can't see myself and then the practice is somehow closed to me. So what I can do is to take a step back. And how do I take a step back? And what helped me there, I read the book about Issan and Issan was, I never knew him, but he experienced a lot and was somehow apparently maybe that's why an accepting person. And in St. Louis I read, when there was something and someone complained or complained, then Issan said, that's how people are, that's how human beings are. So that's just the way people are. So just, that's okay. And with this sentence I practice. So when this dynamic runs in me, then I say to myself, that's how people are. So that's how people are. And these people, that's me too. So it works in both directions. It works with the others.

[22:18]

Someone snores loudly, that's how people are. It's okay, you can still snore. And someone gets annoyed about it. That's how people are. People get annoyed that someone snores. And that helps me to take this step back. And then there is another exercise that I developed together with Regina and Erich here at Johanneshof. And it's called letting go. And it works like this. So if something happens and you notice, so that would be something now, I could get angry about it now. Or I could start such an inner game with it now. then you just don't hang on to the spirit, but let it go. And that going through is like when you pour water through a sieve or pour the soup through that you actually want to eat.

[23:22]

I don't know if that's ever happened before. And then there's just nothing left. You don't have anything left. Yes, it's stupid. In that case it's cheap, because you let it go through and maybe only a little bit of it remains. In any case, the soup is not so thick anymore. And yes, maybe you have other ideas that can help me further. Because yes, you can always need it. I think it's just an exciting way and for me that's also the body of truth, just a kind of inner looking. I almost feel it like eyes in the body, somehow huge eyes that look at what is happening there. I don't know where they come from, I don't know if that exists anywhere, but that lies below accepting.

[24:26]

There is no more accepting, you just look at things the way they are, if possible. Thank you. Can I ask you something? When you talk about the eyes in the body, I imagine, although it doesn't always work, but more and more often, that in every cell or in every pore, so to speak, there is an eye and a smile. And that I then transform that, this anger or this dislike or whatever else comes up. It's just this inner smile that I check everywhere. Does it work more often? Thank you very much. Nevertheless, whenever someone says, then I'll just do that, then I get annoyed, then I get angry, because then it's not exactly easy.

[25:54]

And then I have to ask him, how do you do that? So it's a nice picture with the soup and it's nice to say it's easy, but I think it's very difficult. The need to develop the exercise came from the fact that it is so difficult. You just have to deal with it. You can't do it yourself. Now I understand that you are saying that. We still keep things hanging. It's not like everything always goes through. But it's just a physical picture, because I also notice it physically, how I attach to something that happens, that bothers me somehow, or what then simply triggers a process into the feelings or into thinking. And do you then say something like, I'll let it go now? No, that's actually more of a label, yes, let it go through, that's the terminus technicus that we somehow found ourselves in.

[26:59]

It's more of a physical feeling, it's a physical attitude. Maybe that you don't allow any activity or that you don't allow this grasping. But I just feel it in my body, also really as permeability. I know Christine very well. I've known you for a long time. And I always experience this throughness when Christine transforms into a breathing body. You suddenly really hear the breath in her. And I don't know if there was anything dangerous or annoying. But I feel very quickly when something has occupied you and that you are also there, what to do with it physically. It's always very touching when I'm close to you. I think especially when you eat oriole, you notice that you are very in your breath.

[28:00]

Whoever always sits next to Christine feels that you are really there with them. What I like about it, and I have already said it to you, because your article in the Lenten Schriegweiter goes in a similar direction for me, is a completely unobtrusive, authentic, honest expression in it. That's how it is. What is interesting for me is that out of it a kind of lightness arises again, so you are talking about earth, but actually there is something funny in it, and I think that is a very good starting point to approach things, and that is something that I appreciate very much.

[29:20]

Me too. Maybe that's the Austrian style. It's not possible to stay serious. Yes, so I will also include the term praxis deep in my vocabulary now. It's interesting that with the practical depth you have the feeling of being removed from practice. But that's not the case. But it can be so. For example, Sashin is a classic situation, because you are so alone and have so little exchange with yourself, that at some point you really have the feeling on the third or fourth day, I'm sitting around and it's hopeless.

[30:35]

And then you really just need to take this step back into looking and ... and Erich comes. And then you just arrived, or you didn't. So, we haven't missed the topic and the new family is a bit younger. That's what we've been doing for the last two years. And it has become more or less the same as it has now.

[31:44]

I think it's very interesting. We can also take our programme in the future. Is there an evening cook here? They have already come. Did they say when the dinner is over? They left when I started. Of course, I suggest that we do a test until dinner and then decide when dinner is over. And then we will sit for one or two hours and then we will sit for the rest of the evening. Thank you very much. Is that right? Good. And then I'll let the cook know that you'll be there ten minutes before dinner, if you don't mind. With the children. It's nice to see you again, Hansel and Gretel.

[32:56]

It's nice to see you again.

[32:57]

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