This is the first sasheen lecture I've ever had. People sitting in chairs. Not just one. Are you all in the sasheen? so

[01:06]

I don't quite understand why. Maybe it's just you're taking better care of your legs, but the number of you have more injury. So... And also a number of you are sitting Seiza, you know Seiza? Legs this way, instead of cross-legged, during Seishin. And maybe it's because of me. Yeah?

[02:54]

if you're sitting differently. Because when Tsukiyoshi was here, even though he would tell people they could sit in a chair, no one ever did. And I don't think almost no one ever sat seiza during zazen, during sashimi, occasionally. But I let people, I started letting people do it at Tassahara. I'm not Maybe also people practicing now aren't so much, maybe a slightly different kind of person is practicing. I think if we sat, I discussed this with Vidyoshi, various times. I think if we sat 30-minute period it would be easier. Can you hear okay? But 30-minute periods have a rather different feeling, kind of. A little bit different practice if you sit 30-minute periods.

[04:16]

Anyway, I don't mind, I don't mean by talking about it that I mind whether you sit on a chair or on the tatami, but I don't want you to miss the opportunity to learn how to sit cross-legged if you can. I think that the best way to learn how to sit cross-legged is to keep trying in some posture. At least at the time I started, when I was sitting, I think it was generally acknowledged that my legs were stiffer and more difficult than anyone else's. And I set myself various goals, like able to sit cross-legged in two years and full lotus in five years. And at the end of two years I couldn't even get my knees to touch. So I gave up that goal. In five years I'll sit. I still thought, well, I'll go pretty quickly. Still in five years I'll sit full lotus.

[05:51]

And at five years I was just being able to sit continuously, half-lotus, right half-lotus. And I couldn't even sit the other half-lotus yet, or left half-lotus. I couldn't sit right half-lotus yet. And now I've been sitting about 15 years. I can sit right half-lotus occasionally. Sometimes, maybe for one period or one hour, but I can't sit full load at all. If I sit in the Tassajar hot pads for a while, I can get into full load. But I did decide eventually, you know, at least I would keep moving toward, I'd sit in a way which kept moving toward half or full load. And so I generally would sit as well as I could for some part of the period and then sometimes change in the middle.

[07:17]

helped me develop some patience. The other day, Saturday, I spoke about physical and mental calmness. The most notable way we can work with calmness, developing physical and mental evenness, is by developing our patience. And patience is usually classified as three types.

[08:34]

patience to do with some difficult or dangerous or irritating person. Probably the most ripe field of practice. And the second is misery or suffering or distressing, irritating circumstances. And the third is the fundamental patience which matures into enlightenment, which opens you to the harmony which runs through everything. Roughly speaking, we can say that It's impatience which causes the problems which lead to the needing patience. So it's impatience which causes us to get angry or try to kill something to remove some obstacle. So the side of impatience is to

[10:03]

begin to stop being insistent, to stop being quarrelsome. This kind of effort is you can get more appeal for in sasheen than any other time, and is completely necessary for practice. You know, yesterday someone asked me at Greenbelt about instant enlightenment, and sometimes It's like concern with some fundamental truth, you know, like that. It's like wanting a Rolls Royce without knowing how to drive. Wanting some immodest arrogance.

[11:25]

view, without wanting the simple qualities which make people, which allow people to develop their personality. The most important thing to do is to have modest goals, or goals which don't extend too much beyond the immediate future. So impatience is one side, wanting something quickly. The other side is, what do you do when you're confronted with someone who's angry or is causing you some problem? One thing that is very funny is that to develop your patience you need some irritating person. You can't develop patience in some vacuum.

[12:50]

So you have to find a good irritating person as your benefactor. And some of us find them everywhere. And to practice should always be somewhat irritating, somewhat demanding some patience of you. Even after you've become quite experienced at practice, taking all of it for granted, still it should require, it should have a nuisance factor. Even for, you know, Buddha, it should be sort of a nuisance. Oh God, I have to get up again and go out and beg this morning and bear my left hand. Anyway, that nuisance factor should be there. The depth of Buddhism is marvelous and unsurpassable because that nuisance factor is, no matter how developed you get, that nuisance factor is still there. So someone who

[14:20]

Of course, we also should understand that they're not, you know, master of themselves. They're pushed around, you know, by themselves and there's no need to smash them. And you yourself, you should be able to look at your own karma, how it caused, how your own impatience brought you to this point. how your own karma got you into this situation. And, as I said, view the person and the situation as a benefactor, but also as a companion, as someone who you're practicing with. The most... The other day I talked about the first five, and then perfect wisdom. And probably, which I talked about at Green Gorge, the most single important factor in practicing perfect wisdom, which is something you actually can't practice, but you shall turn toward perfect wisdom, is the non-abandonment of others.

[15:44]

non-abandonment of others. So if someone's irritating you, you don't abandon them. You view them as a companion to turn the wheel of the Dharma away. And if they are impatient and angry. The only way their patience will be developed is by your patience. Likewise with difficulties. Most difficulty we get into, lack of food, etc., various kinds of deprivation, obstacles, usually we get into because we missed opportunities. And we missed opportunities are a... maybe opportunities are the fruit of patience. And when you're impatient, when your goals will not wait for opportunity,

[17:10]

you get yourself into situations where you don't have enough to eat or money or something. But also, our practice is in the realm of samsara, and it takes fire to fight fire. And if you want to complete your process, which began with conception, and it didn't stop with your birth, You have to, in a sense, fight fire with fire. Our practice should... Real practice will be rather difficult, pretty hard. You may know that illusion itself, difficulty itself, is an illusion. An illusion itself is an illusion. Getting rid of illusion is an illusion. And this may give you some relief, but still, of course, until your patience is quite

[18:45]

complete, the difficulty of sitting and various things during a sashing will bother you. I was talking with someone yesterday whose father is dying.

[19:55]

I think it's okay to say who it is. Rev's father is dying, and his father has a heart attack, several heart attacks, and his heart is so weak, it looks like he can't live. And he also, at the same time, has had a stroke, and the stroke is not so serious, but it's left him unable to communicate. And his father, Reb's father, is a pretty successful person who's used to being in charge, I think. And Reb discovered that his father's stroke is a kind of devastating wisdom for his father. Because when he's had a heart attack, he still tries to control and be in charge of what's going on. and there's not much wisdom or acceptance in his situation. But the stroke has completely altered that, because he can't say things. He can't communicate what he wants to. Often he can only say, acknowledge that he can understand something, but then he can only say, I can't respond. I can't say that. Give me a week.

[21:25]

And fortunately or unfortunately, we need some stroke like that to finally acknowledge ourselves. I remember Tsukiyoshi talking about the kiyosaka being hit with a stick in that line. And I must say, when people ask me a question in which they are not turning away from their question, my inclination is, I must restrain myself. Usually I restrain myself. But knowing it's so close to the surface,

[23:15]

But it can't come out if we think. Last week Sashin, in the city I had to have my, I don't know, some of you were in that Sashin maybe, and I had a dentist who created a third nostril in my mouth, banging into my nasal cavity.

[24:21]

And he then left a suture in there and said they were out and caused quite a bad infection. And I had another dentist with Dr. Gerstein's help clear it up. It healed that extra open. But the infection never went away. And so finally it's seated, I guess, in that old womb. So now I have to twice a week go and have a minor operation where they bang into my ankle cavity from the other side of my knee. After lecture I have to go and have a knee surgery. I don't have much to say except what I'm emphasizing today is

[25:51]

the tangible qualities of patience and impatience and allowing yourself the space which is both impatience and patience. becoming acquainted with that. So I'm saying, without some goal, I'll sit perfectly still, or I'll achieve enlightenment. This machine will help me, or something. Just in the midst of, is your goal. But some thing wider than patience while you're in the midst of it. Maybe imagine you've had a stroke. You can't communicate. You can't speak to yourself. You have no choice but to be.

[27:18]

incapacitated. Maybe we're all incapacitated, our legs sewn into position. If you want to understand what will happen to you in your life, You have to be ready for anything. You have to be able to do this kind of practice. If you don't want to live in dread of your life, in dread of the possibility which befalls you, you can accomplish that freedom by sitting in this way. Is there some question about sitting, zazen and practice that you'd like to talk about?

[28:37]

It was good to know that I would be going through that. And he said, just be there. And again later he said, follow the beat. Especially, I think, here in the city, we have some distance. We have to really travel very much on our own to find our own distance, our own dialogue of what is too much. And a question that's passed me very deeply is, sometimes I know I can try.

[30:09]

But sometimes, sometimes I stop and it doesn't work. And the question is at that moment then of, is it enduring or is it bad? What is it that changes that? Is it enduring or is it what? At the point when I said, I lost something, I lost my Presence. It's gone, and I don't know where, and I don't know how, and it just rolls over. In that moment, when I know, okay, this isn't working, and I don't know what to do next. And at some point, if I keep going, I can, I can feel it spiritually into, into all my glands and muscles, some substance which is quite painful but doesn't want to go away, some, some technique. If I move, when I feel that moment, once relaxed and that moment is safe, then I can start again.

[31:31]

What I'm wondering is, is it alright? What I'm wondering is, is there some catalyst? Or is that what the teacher is? Is that that moment? The teacher is the catalyst? The denominator is the catalyst? Everything is? How do we learn to Something you said, you said, by accepting this now, you're saying, okay, I'm living safe now, I will die safe. Something you said, you're just pushing me away. You're just saying, in 20 years, I'll die safe. Is that some cycle between the present and the transcendent? Sometimes able to transfer, and sometimes only to the present? Okay. I think you described what many people feel, and the question which arises for people is, which part is real? Which is the real attitude or the real one to do, etc.? And I think we find by experience you can't know. Or after a while you decide, well, I'll decide these types are real.

[33:24]

You're not quite sure, but you'll say these types are real. Because you've sorted out, you've seen most of the permutations of your attitude. Eventually you begin to find out there's a kind of stock phrases, stock responses that you have. And one of them seems to be more, seems to be preferable. So you can stick with that. is not a matter of talent or some special ability or effort or in any way a sign. As long as you think of practice or emptiness, as long as it's still in the realm of an attitude or a sign or an entity, especially as long as you think you have some choice about practice,

[34:26]

Your practice can only be a therapy or benefit you. It can be an extraordinarily potent therapy, but it can't lead to enlightenment. So, unfortunately, most people retain a little area of choice. I will practice as long as it works for me. I'll practice, certainly I'll devote the first 20 years of my adult life to practice, and then I'll do something else. Any idea like that is, you have a choice. That doesn't mean practice isn't something you should be doing, or shouldn't be doing. But what's required for the kind of practice? We can say, when you're patient, okay, when you're impatient, you have to be patient with impatience. You have to keep extending the patience. Then you're patient with impatience, being patient with impatience, etc. You can extend those attitudes. So you're patient with being patient with impatience, etc. But that is a kind of gain and a kind of development of the possibilities of entities, the possibility of concepts.

[35:55]

I think particularly those of us who are intellectual have to work out the limitations. When you take the world as real and you meditate, you can find out the limitations of viewing the world as real. Then you can try viewing the world as unreal and you'll find out it's a much more potent, much more productive way to view things, a much realer way to view things. But practice is its most fertile and patience is its most perfect when you have somehow come to a decision, to practice which is no longer a decision. like having an arm. You don't decide to have an arm in the morning. Today I'll have a right arm and no left. Today I'll have a left and a right arm. Somehow you've made a decision that practice is one with heartbeat, breathing, etc.

[37:06]

that if you give up practice, like for instance, you can say in session, I will try, I will keep trying. But what are you going to do when you stop trying? Well, when you've made that kind of decision, you can say, you know inside, even when I'm not trying, I'll try. Even when I stop trying, even when I give up practice, I'll practice. That has to be so complete. that there's no more decision about it at all. When that's true, one's practice is very fertile and very fast, and it doesn't matter how talented you are at all. But, anyway, it's not so easy to do that. Why would anybody make such a crazy decision?

[38:09]

to practice life. What motivates us to do it? That itself is quite extraordinary. Maybe for some people we've seen the impossibility, the impossibility, the utter impossibility of abandoning others. deep recognition has to come up. Then from then on, everything you do, as I said yesterday, carpentry or the work of a Buddhist priest or neighborhood foundation, writing, working for some company, whatever you do is actually just an opportunity to practice with people. And you develop some skill just to practice with people, not in the sense of a possession or attainment. So I think it's pretty easy to understand what I just said.

[39:36]

but very difficult not to become discouraged and not to lose the point. Something else. And in some senses there's no alternative but now, there's no later. But if now for you is something you have to do, There's plenty of time, because when you recognize, if you move toward sitting posture, if you move toward, always are moving toward that utter recognition, so there's no choice involved. It doesn't matter what you do.

[41:00]

Somehow we often have to unwind our various possibilities. We're not quite strong enough or confident enough to cast yesterday's goals away, realizing that yesterday's situation can't meet their goals with today's situation. So whether we unwind those possibilities by activity or by zazen, mental, It's not so important if we're moving toward that utter, that decision which is no longer a decision. Yes? I feel like I have a turmoil of patience with other people and maybe a lot of things with myself. I feel like I create myself further. That's why you have to practice harder. Could you hear what she said? She said she's got pretty good patience with others and better patience even with herself. She's willing to wait for herself forever. That's very good. We should feel that way.

[42:45]

not sure everyone else has enough patience to wait for her. That's the problem. So we can forget about waiting and get to work. Although I prefer sitting up to talk, my situation is such that I'm not sure how to mature my dad, who matured at a very young age. He said he's very well.

[43:50]

And in the experience of sitting in a chair, I found to have a Christian leader, although it can be in some ways restraining, to have a Christian leader in a chair. Some particular outstanding problem Yeah, it takes much more wisdom to sit in the chair. It's true, right, but it sounds funny. If you sit this way, your body takes over and you have one whole you can get. You can sit very still without much decision involved and you have one whole experience of your body or more than your body. Sitting in a chair it's pretty difficult not to experience your body in parts.

[45:09]

your back or muscles or legs or something. It's very hard to have one overall sense which begins to drop bodily distinctions, but you know, there's no word for it. Some feeling which, when there's calmness and resolved patience, some joyful feeling That experience is a little difficult to have in sitting in a chair, because our body doesn't easily feel that way. And that feeling allows your mind to relax. It takes over your mind. But if you sit in a chair, When I say more wisdom, you need to resolve your practice through differences, not through oneness, which requires more wisdom. You can resolve your life through any activity, but it's more difficult than through stillness, physical and mental stillness.

[46:27]

So the most important thing is if you want, the more you want to bring your body to the aid of your practice, the more you want to find some way you can sit without any mental decisions about the posture. This way, that way. It's very difficult when you're sitting in a chair because there's a tendency that you have to hold yourself forward or back. You can't relax and completely relax or you'll slouch because your legs and back and buttocks aren't in a way that supports you. So I think that if you have concluded that you will be, I think what I would do, if I concluded I could not sit, maybe when I'm old or something, this will be the case, if I concluded that I could not sit for some years or forever, on a cushion, but I knew I was, you know, I was going to be practicing with others. It was important to sit with them, plus it's helpful to my own practice. I would probably, but I think my motivation would be more because it's more helpful to others if you can sit with them. I would start and I would pretend chairs didn't exist.

[47:51]

Do you know, Dan, well, when he came back from Japan, where chairs don't exist in the world he was in, he painted great paintings of chairs, clothing in the sky. And when you went to visit his house, as you came in Berkeley, there was a chair that he made out of wood, which was so high, when you stood, it was flat. Ask Dan about it. Anyway, you turn chairs into some vision like that. Then you figure out, how am I going to sit? So maybe I would start building myself some wooden contraption that would allow me to sit with my back straight and my weight sliding forward this way, like that.

[48:54]

and which there was not too much pressure on my legs. Or I would arrange pillows. There must be a way. I would feel there must be a way. But on the other hand, I don't want to pressure you too much to force your legs. The two or three people I know who have sat the best from the beginning, were in full lotus pretty rapidly, which could sit through anything, all have half-damaged legs now, because they sat in some circumstance without enough consideration for their legs. And I've always, I don't know, I still, my legs still click. Recently, now it's, last few days it's been rather difficult to bow because this leg clicks in and out of joint as I go up and down. That's from an injury when I was about 19. But I've been quite considerate of my legs, quite patient with them. And my legs are not damaged. I never had, in fact, the damage that I had from earlier injuries has gotten better. I'm not sure I'd try tennis.

[50:16]

If I wasn't, you know, didn't have this job, I would play tennis because I think it's important, but if I play tennis and ruin my legs, I'll get fired. You could hang me from the ceiling. I could sit in an old swing. And I will try to do a little more of a correction so I can find out

[51:22]

Where's this pain? Actually, I guess I'm stuck. But it starts to happen. My knees start to swell up. Then I move higher. I find I can sit for more pain than I ever thought I could. Then I can hear you, right? She said when her legs start to swell up she loses her judgment. That's too simple what she said. She said some student told her that he sat through his legs. And she asked about the painless legs. Some older student said that he had the same problem or something like that. And then at Kasahara, he sat through a Sashin which his legs were swollen and turned yellow. Maybe he or she was just trying to impress him.

[52:32]

So now she's wondering what she should do. Anyway, that's not exactly what she said. Is that all right? I'll change it over. We're in a non-repeating universe, we don't want to have the same event. Well, most people who've done that, that I know, their legs have not been... Some comes out all right. But some people, their legs have been not so good since the pandemic, their legs and knees, by doing that. But it's difficult to say. Some people, you know, if you go out... Some people, if you go out looking for a job and you're walking around a lot, your ankles swell up. And some people, particularly when there's an emotional situation they don't like, their knees and ankles swell just from walking. So if you're that kind of a person then you can't tell if they're swelling. But I, my own legs would not swell unless they were damaged. So if I ever had swelling I changed slightly so that whatever was causing swelling stopped.

[53:49]

So, in the end, you have to decide for yourself whether it's physical damage or not. Swelling isn't always an indication, but my own tendency, partly because I don't have much experience with swelling, is that if there's swelling, I'd be cautious. But if you notice that the swelling occurs before there can be much any possibility of danger or damage, then the swelling is a part of it, kind of. shocked with action and I'm not. There should be quite a lot of, like the posture you're sitting in right now is okay. There are so many possibilities for changing your leg cycle, having your feet down and then up. up like that. That's not bad. Your back is still pretty good and you're still working on getting your legs familiar with a world with no chips.

[55:12]

Yeah, the more you're pulled together like this, the better. The more you're sort of centered underneath yourself, the better. But the posture you're in right now is sort of traditional rest posture. And I used to use that. I always sat, one of the first sessions I did, I always stayed on my cushion all day during rest periods too. And I stayed in that posture. Sleeper should come and sit with me often. We had very small number of people, not much to do in the day. And when Sleeper could, he'd just come into the window and he'd sit there, cross-legged, and I'd sit that way. And sometimes, I think, just before I began to be able to sit through a week's Sashin without moving, I would sit some period that way. Anyway, my feeling was to stay on my cushion somehow, and I stayed on that posture, if necessary, which Sukhyaji taught us as being traditional rest posture.

[56:38]

This is pretty good. I think I told you that when I first started I could get this foot down like that, but if I did that the right foot stuck out from behind my bottom this way somehow. So I had some arrangement where that would work. I called it the half lily. And I sat that way for years. Modest. a thing just to try to sit, which I could try completely and which didn't seem to hurt anybody, which has me, so I tried.

[57:58]

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