Good morning, everyone. Welcome. I want to speak this morning about the relationship or context of Earth and space to our practice, to our zazen and our practice generally. And I want to do this in terms of some of the teachings of A. A. Dogen, the 13th century Japanese a master who started this tradition of Sojo Zen in Japan. And especially I want to do this in terms of some of his teachings referring to the Lotus Sutra, one of our most important scriptures. So I wanted to talk about a number of specific passages. And I'll start with one of his essays in Shobo Genzo, True Dharma, My Treasure, one of his two great masterworks, that specifically references the Lotus Sutra.

[01:18]

It's called Hokete Hoke in Japanese, The Dharma Flower Turns the Dharma Flower. Actually, I'll be talking about this essay a lot more tomorrow evening. But the essay starts with a story about the sixth ancestor, Guihang, who, in some ways, is really the founder of Zen in China. All of Zen came back from his teachings. Of course, he was the sixth, so there was Bodhidharma and five others. But one time, a monk came to who had been studying the Lotus Sutra and had memorized the Lotus Sutra, which, you know, I think in English translation it's this big, so it's, you know, something like this big. And he thought he really knew the Lotus Sutra, and Hui Nang challenged him and said,

[02:23]

Deluded people are turned by the sutra. Awakened people turn the sutra. So this has to do with the role of study in our tradition. So our basic practice is just this asana practice we've been doing, just sitting upright, being present, paying attention, enjoying our inhale and exhale. settling, and doing this regularly so that we settle into this space where, this creative space where we can bring forth this settling, calm, creative, open energy. But also, particularly in Soto Zen, and Dogen talks about this, and actually within Soto Zen, particularly in the Suzuki Uroshi lineage, which we're connected with, from the San Francisco Zen Center, there's an important role of study. It's not to learn something else.

[03:28]

It's to encourage our practice, to encourage our awareness, to encourage our settling and opening. And this is one of the essays by Dogen where he focuses on that, but he does it in terms of the story. So awakened people turn, turn, deluded people, confused people, are turned by it. So that's the starting point for this essay by Dogen. But from there, he plays with it, as he often does in his writings, till he gets to the point where he talks about actually the non-duality of turning or being turned, and that both turning the Dharma flower And there's many related images. There's the image of Shakyamuni Buddha holding up a flower on Vulture Peak.

[04:31]

And Mahakasyapa smiled. And that's considered a story, not a historical, but an apocryphal story. But that's considered the first thought of transmission in Zen or Chan. but turning the flower or being turned by the flower, turning the practice or being turned by the practice. But Dogen says in the end that actually they're non-dual, that both turning... After going through the ways in which how turning it is awakened realization and being turned by it is confused and diluted, he says both turning the Dharma flower and being turned by the Dharma flower are the Dharma thought returning. So, Dogen often in his writings takes some image or some story and turns it and plays with it and helps us to see the inner dynamics of our own practice. This isn't about some historical event that happened hundreds of thousands of years ago or whatever.

[05:44]

These teaching stories are about the inner dynamics of our own practiced body. But that's sort of background to this expression that he has in the middle of that essay. He says, now that the assembly has experienced the meeting of ancient Buddhas with ancient Buddhas, how could this not be a land of ancient Buddhas? So what I want to talk to you about this morning is the land, the earth. the place where we practice our Dharma positions. So in many places, he talks about Buddhas and the lands. So study with Buddhas. In our tradition, Buddhas being Buddhas, that also comes from the line of the Lotus Sutra. the Jews of our practice, but he said, but here Dogen says to his students, now that you have experienced the meaning of ancient Buddhas together with ancient Buddhas, how could this not be a land of ancient Buddhas?

[07:05]

The study with ancient Buddhas and full penetration of their teaching allows students to dwell in the Buddha lands. So this idea of a land or space goes back from very far in Buddhism, but it's emphasized in a lot of ways, both by the Lotus Sutra and by Dogon. Where Buddhas awaken, the earth must be a land of ancient Buddhas. So that also means that your practice place is a site of awakening. So in our Zen there we have a scroll on the back that says, Straightforward mind, this is the, in Japanese they say it's dojo, like in martial arts dojo, but literally it's the place of the way. Or, and that refers to Buddha's seat underneath the Bodhi tree, the place of awakening. So, straightforward mind, this is the place of awakening.

[08:08]

And here Dogen says that, And this practice place is a site of awakening. So, I'm going to just refer to a number of different passages where Dogen talks about this issue. In one of his dharma hall discourses, in Dogen's extensive record, a quote from his other great work, he first quotes a statement by a teacher, an important Soto teacher in China, a century before, who says, Buddhas within the land manifest everywhere. So the relationship of awakening itself and of Buddhas, the awakened ones, and of the space around us is the issue here. And how

[09:09]

So we sit, you know, we don't just sit as a kind of self-help practice. Of course, doing this practice regularly does help to develop calm and flexibility and openness, but part of what we, an aspect of what we learn physically when we do this practice regularly is this kind of interconnectedness, that we are growing out of the land. out of the space, out of the ground, and that we're connected with everything. So here we are in our center, Chicago, in this big city, and yet in some way that we can't quite understand, we're very connected to everything around us. So in this essay, in this short talk from his extensive record in 1248, Dogen says, the Buddha of the land pervades the body, and is the entire body.

[10:12]

The lands of the Buddha are the suchness of reality, and they're not suchness. So in reality, it's not possible to separate Buddhas from their place, from their land, from the place where they awaken. The location where they express ongoing awakening sometimes Dogen calls this their dharma position. So this idea of dharma position is interesting. We each have our own dharma position. In some ways, we could say that we could translate that as our own particular situation. Each of us sitting here this morning has our own context, our own background. All of the many people you've ever known are part of what's sitting on your kushina jara. in ways we don't necessarily realize. But everybody you've known, and of course, some people may be more than others, some beings more than others. But what's happening on your seat is vast.

[11:18]

Of course, we have our own, if we just kind of thought of all of that, we couldn't function. But really, all of that's going on, and then we have our own stories about who we are, our addresses and phone numbers and email addresses. We have all these ways of identifying some self that is on your sheet right now. But part of what our practice points to, or maybe the heart of what our practice points to, is the richness of this dharma position. With each inhale and exhale, it's impossible to comprehend or grasp or encompass, well, as Walt Whitman says, I'm vast and contain multitudes. There's this just immensity of each moment, of each breath. And there's not something we have to do about that, that reality.

[12:23]

We don't even have to understand it or remember it. And yet, we start to, as we settle, we start to feel this deep connectedness, this dormant position. One of Dogen's major disciples, Tetsubikai, who was the successor to generations after Dogen, we say in our ancestor chant, Hei Dogen Daisho, Konejo Daisho, Tetsubikai Daisho, He awakened after hearing a particular short talk by Dogen, in which Dogen connected this awakened land and the particulars of the earth. So, Dogen quoted Shakyamuni Buddha, and I want to give some background in the Lotus Sutra, about the Lotus Sutra in a minute, but he quoted Shakyamuni's saying he had this actually inconceivably long lifespan.

[13:26]

And I'll come back to that. And then Dogen said, all dharmas dwell in their dharma positions. Forms in the world are always present. Wild geese return to the north woods. Orioles appear in early spring. And hearing that, Tetsugikai had some realization. So it's not just some general idea of the earth or the land. This particular place, the lake nearby, the birds that fly over it, the trees, the particular people who walked down Irving Park Road, each is part of our dharma position. So the natural activities of the earth itself express Buddha's ongoing wisdom. So this is something that actually goes back to early Buddhism the basis of Pure Land Buddhism, which is the main form of Buddhism actually in Japan.

[14:29]

But this is an old Buddhist teaching that when a Buddha awakens, the land itself awakens. Dogen says it in one of his earliest writings, Fenyuan, when one person sits upright and fully expresses the Buddha mudra with their whole body and mind. So that's what we're doing, sitting here, what we just did, sitting here. We're, you know, with this body and mind, expressing the centeredness and the calmness of the image of Buddha that's in the center. That's just a statue, but represents that uprightness that is available to all of us. And Siddhartha says when one person even for a short time, wholeheartedly, with their body and mind, expresses this buddha mudra, this buddha attitude or position, this strong position.

[15:35]

All of space awakens, which is this mind-blowing, radical statement that we can't get our head around. Of course, that's mean. But then he specifies earth, grasses, and trees, Fences and walls, tiles and pebbles, all things support the person sitting, and vice versa. So this deep, intimate connection between ourselves, doing this Buddha practice, and the specifics of the land is what's the issue here. And Tenshikai heard this when he talked about the wild geese and the Orioles. I'm just going to give some more examples of Dogen talking about this, and we'll have some time for questions or comments or responses. Another essay from Shobo Genzo, one of my favorites, that I've talked about a lot, is called The Awesome Presence of Active Buddhas, Gyobutsu Igi.

[16:42]

And he emphasizes the role of the earth and the land for Buddha's activities. And actually, before I give that quote up, let me go back and say a little bit about the Lotus Sutra. There's a lot of really cool stories in the Lotus Sutra. There's a lot of teachings. There's teaching of skillful means. But one of my favorites is the story about the underground bodhisattvas. just to make a long version short, throughout the first half of the sutra, Chakramuni Buddha, the Buddha who lived 2,500 years ago in eastern India, keeps asking his disciples, in the future evil age, who will come back and share this teaching, and express this teaching? And nobody really responds, and then at one point,

[17:47]

So all kinds of strange things are happening in the sutra, and there are buddhas and bodhisattvas who come from distant galaxies or whatever, different solar systems, different buddha fields, to hear the buddha expounding the Lotus Sutra, and there's a buddha who comes whenever the buddha expounds the Lotus Sutra. So it's kind of mind-boggling in itself, but at some point some of these distant bodhisattvas say to the Buddha, OK, we'll come back in the future evil age here and share the Dharma. And Buddha says, actually, you don't need to. No problem. You don't need to do that. There's no need for you to protect and embrace the sutra. Why? Because in my world itself, there are as many bodhisattva, mahasattvas, great ones, as there are sands and 60,000 Ganges rivers. Each one of these bodhisattvas has as many followers as there are sands in 60,000 of Ganges rivers. After my extinction, they will be able to protect and embrace, read and recite and teach this sutra everywhere."

[18:54]

When the Buddha had said this, the earth of this 3,000 great thousandfold world trembled and split open, and from it innumerable tens of millions of billions of bodhisattvas, great enlightening beings, helping to support universal awakening. These Bodhisattvas sprang up, out together, from this open space under the earth. These Bodhisattvas all had golden-haired bodies, and so forth, and it goes on. It kind of worries rhetoric of some of these sutras. So, right under the ground, there are these ancient Bodhisattvas ready to spring forth. That's what the Lotus Sutra is saying, and what Dogen refers to a lot. And then it goes further, and this is sort of background for the next little quote I was going to give. In the next chapter, the regular disciples of Bodhisattvas of the Buddha say, wait a second, where did these guys come from?

[19:58]

Who are these guys? Where did they come from, these great Bodhisattvas? We never saw them. Who taught them? Who was their teacher? And the Buddha said, oh, I taught them. And the Bodhisattvas are even more perplexed because Well, we never saw them around and we know that they're very ancient, obviously, and it's only 40 years or so since you left the palace and awakened and have been teaching. And then the Buddha says even more mind-boggling that actually since I started practicing and since I awakened, it's been a very, very, very long time, because it's astronomical time. image of how long it's been. It's not infinite, but it's like a really long time. And I'll be around for twice that long into the future. So the whole idea of life and death and the Buddha as a historical person is kind of, you know, he was an historical person. And also, he's got this very long lifespan.

[21:00]

In some ways, he's still there. Dogen talks about how it is that he's still here in this room now. So there's these wild images and stories that are part of the context of antarsatva, of this practice that Dogen taught that we just did this morning. So that's kind of background for the next quote from this awesome presence of active Buddhas. So Dogen emphasizes the indispensable active role of the earth and the lands for Buddha's activities, he says, that which allows one corner of a Buddha's awesome presence is the entire universe, the entire earth, as well as the entirety of birth and death, coming and going, of innumerable lands and lotus blossoms. And this is kind of outside of our usual way of thinking about everything.

[22:05]

And yet, it points to the depths that this practice expresses. And especially the lotus is a symbol that's used for the active role of the earth. It grows and blossoms into beauty. from out of swampy mud. So lotuses are interesting entities. They're beautiful, and yet they grow out of the muck and mud. And there's a line that W uses a lot, which is kind of just a throw-off line in the booklet record. He says, the more mud, the greater the Buddha, which indicates the fertility of Earth. but also of our own karmic obstructions and suffering. So, the more mild the greater the Buddha.

[23:09]

At times when you might feel your own greed, hate, and delusion, and your own patterns of resting, and all the muck of that, This is a useful line to remember. The more love, the bigger the Buddha. So these Zen sayings have, you know, kind of overtones. I mean, on one level it's just, if you imagine a clay statue of a Buddha, it's, you know, the bigger the Buddha, the more love that you put on it, the bigger the statue is. each of us, and maybe to see this in terms of human beings in general and all the muck we're going through now in our world, in our society, and climate damage, and corruption, and so forth. Anyway, lotuses grow out of the mud.

[24:10]

Awakening arises out of our own struggles and our own difficulties. So this is one of those lines that we can take comfort in. The more mud, the greater the Buddha. And in another place in this extensive record, Dogon says, the lotus shrine has never been tainted by the mud in the water. So the lotuses grow out of this muck and mud and make this beautiful flower with lovely petals. So, how do we see our practices, not separate from that, not separate from the difficulties of our own lives and of the world. So, yeah, so a few more statements that Dogen makes about this.

[25:14]

So, he talks about the bodhisattvas arising from out of the earth, and they're arising from space itself. So, he says, the multitudes of the thousand-fold world that spring out of the earth have long been great honored saints of the Dharma flower of the Lotus Sutra, but they spring out of the earth being turned by circumstances. in turning the flower of dharma, so when we turn the dharma flower, we should not only realize springing out of the earth and turning the flower of dharma, we should also realize springing out of space. We should know, with the Buddha's wisdom, not only earth and space, but also springing out of the flower of dharma itself. lofty way Dogen talks, he's talking about how, so we think of space as something that's empty.

[26:30]

But emptiness is form, we say in the Heart Sutra. So the very specific stuff, to use a technical term, of our lives and of our world is how we arise, how we awaken, where we awaken. So this dynamic concurrence of earth, space, and the Dharma flower. He describes further in another one of his essays the space flowers, the flowers in the sky, where he says, only the Buddhas and ancestors know the blooming and falling of flowers in space and flowers on the ground. And they know the blooming and falling of flowers in the world. Only they know that flowers in space, flowers on the ground, and flowers in the world are all sutras. They're all expressions of Buddha. So for Dogen, the earth, space, and blossoming flowers all harmoniously expound the Dharma. In another talk he says, what is thicker than earth is that which arises in earth.

[27:37]

What is vaster than empty space is that which arises in empty space. What goes beyond Buddhas and ancestors are those who arise from Buddhas and ancestors. This way of talking about our deep connection to, you could say, reality itself, but also the specifics of our own situation, of our own dharma position, of our own condition, of our own problems, of our own mind, together and individually. This is where we practice. So enlightenment or whatever that is, is not something in the future. It's not some fancy understanding or experience that we'll have later on. It's about the way things are fundamentally. This morning, here, now. And our practice is about just kind of connecting with that. Seeing this space that we occupy, this dharma position,

[28:41]

your particular place in this animal, your particular place in the world, your life, your work, your family, your relationships. That's the space out of which the lotus grows. So, in another Shogun's essay, he says, you should penetrate the inside and outside of space. You should kill space and give life to space. You should know the weight of space. You should trust that Buddha Ancestors' endeavor of the way, in aspiration, practice, and awakening, throughout the challenging dialogues, is no other than grasping space. How do we see this place that we live, this situation of our life, this week, this month, this lifetime? How do we use that as an opportunity? So just a couple more references to this. So again, going back to this awesome presence of actor Buddha, as I said, he says, although this moment is distant from the sages,

[29:55]

you have encountered the transforming guidance of the spreading sky or space, it can still be heard. So, Dogen, you know, and people in Japan at this time felt they were very distant from India and from Shakyamuni, and we might feel that even more. You know, here we are in the West, in Chicago, in America, we're very far from the great Eastern mystics or whatever, however you want to think of that. And yet, although this moment is distanced from the sages, 2,500 years since the Buddha lived, according to history, you have encountered the transforming guidance of the spreading sky that can still be heard. So because we have the Lotus Sutra, because we have Dogon's teachings, because we have all of these old stories of ancient masters we can still hear this. There still remains this transformative guidance of space itself, in space itself.

[31:03]

So I'm going to close with talking about the point of all this. So again, a couple more references from Dogen. He says, Well, it's just that this bodhisattva vow, these bodhisattvas, these enlightened beings, and we'll say the bodhisattva vows at the end of the talk, the four vows, to awaken all beings, this fundamental principle for clarifying and expressing not just reality, but also how we act, monkhayana ethics, how we can function helpfully rather than harmfully in the world. So there's another essay from Dogen's extensive record in 1251, late in his career, where he says, the family style of all Buddhas and ancestors is to first arouse the vow to save all living beings by removing suffering and providing joy.

[32:12]

So the point of all this is to remove suffering and bring joy. In an early chapter in the Lotus Sutra, it says the single great cause for Buddha's appearing in the world is to help beings onto the path to awakening. That's the only reason for his appearing. The cause of suffering beings in the world. So the family style of all Buddhas and ancestors is to first arouse the vow to save all living beings by removing suffering. and providing joy, only this family style is inexhaustibly bright and clear." So family style is an expression for tradition in a particular lineage. But here it means the whole tradition of the Buddha way. In another talk he says, just slightly after that one, he says, Bodhisattva studying the way should know how Buddha nature

[33:15]

produces the conditions for buddha nature. This again doesn't fit our conventional western logic, but the bodhisattvas studying the way should know how buddha nature, this underlying reality from which the bodhisattvas spring out into the ground, how buddha nature produces the conditions for buddha nature. So we have this responsibility to investigate how to use our present awareness and expression of buddha nature to foster further beneficial expression of buddha nature in the world. When we connect with this energetic source of awareness and caring and kindness, naturally we want to share this in the world. And how do we express that? in our lives, in our particular lives. And it's different for each one of us.

[34:18]

Each of us has our own particular Dharma position and our own particular interests and abilities and talents, you know, ways of acting in the world to help share this, to express Buddha nature and spread Buddha nature. in one of Dogen's later essays, Awakening in the Bodhi Mind, which is the Daishin, he quotes the Buddha's statement at the end of the chapter in which Buddha reveals that he has this very long lifespan. And this is something he chants sometimes. He says, I have always given thought to how I could cause all creatures to attain the highest supreme way and quickly become Buddha. So this is what Buddha is always thinking about. I always give thought to how I could cause all creatures to enter the highest supreme way and quickly become Buddhas."

[35:22]

In Dogon comments, this is the Buddha's lifetime itself. Buddha's establishment of the mind, training and experience of the effect are all like this. Benefiting living beings means causing living beings to establish the will to deliver others before they attain their own deliverance. So the bodhisattva idea is that it is universal liberation, not just personal liberation. It's not just self-help, although it includes ourselves. But how do we see our connection with all beings, and how do we help support all beings to relieve suffering and to share this awakening with all other beings? So there's a kind of ethical directive here, that we act to support our own awakening together with others. So this is, you know, for most Westerners coming to meditation practice, naturally out of wanting to find some inner calm, find some settling.

[36:37]

This may be, you know, seems beyond what is possible, And yet this is the underlying, the underground, going to South Dakota learners. You can't really just be enlightened ourselves that people are suffering down the street. We see our connection with everyone. Okay, that's a lot of stuff. But it's all about how this place, this land, this situation, your drama position, is your place for awakening. So, questions, comments, responses, anyone? Please feel free. Yeah, how this works, so the practice of skillful means, how do we actually skillfully help

[37:49]

people around us, beings around us, the world, the land around us, and under us, and includes ourselves. So there's lots of different ways to do this. Just being kind to the people around you in your everyday work life, during the week, is part of this, sure. There's lots of ways. Some people find, you know, Some people become counselors or therapists, some people are social workers, some people help. There's all kinds of different ways of helping and being a doctor and helping to heal others. There's all kinds of ways of healing others, but also that means also that we're working on ourselves. So yeah. Thank you. Other questions or comments? Yeah, hi. Yeah, I'll kind of follow on to that. I was thinking while you were talking And I've thought about that because my job and my career is not a therapist or a doctor or something like that.

[39:21]

It's not just helping others. Right. It doesn't have to be obvious. Yeah, go ahead. And, I mean, I guess, yeah, I kind of second that. I feel like a lot of what I do So in the middle, and this is our basic practice now. The world is chaotic. Our society is chaotic. There's gun violence, there's corruption, there's destruction of our environment. We can respond. So the question is how to respond. And a big part of that is finding our own calm in the midst of this. This is what our Zazen training is about. You know, it's not that we get rid of all of our thoughts and feelings and stuff, but that we find a way to sit present and upright and still in the middle of it.

[40:24]

So yeah, and when people in a chaotic situation see somebody who's kind of calmly paying attention and trying to respond, that does something. So there's lots of different ways to express this. in as many ways as there are different dominant positions. Other comments? Yes, sir? I don't know quite if this is a question or a comment or what, but I think it's more than that. I think he says, how do people, practitioners, see how Buddha nature produces a condition of Buddha nature.

[41:30]

And there's a way in which the Lotus Sutra, and it's a very odd text, right? Because in a way, there's nothing preached there except for, you know, of these people convening continually to preach what the sutra is preaching about. It sort of closes in on itself in the same way as people seeing Buddha nature producing I think this all kind of connects with what you opened the talk with, which is this idea of turning. You kind of flip the situation. I don't know where to go from that, but it seems like throughout all the things you're saying, there's this similar, very odd kind of flipping.

[42:40]

Well, another way to say that, and there may be many of them, but that Our practice in the Lotus Sutra and Dargona's teaching is not about something else. We're not doing zazen so that we'll be able to do a better job and work tomorrow. Of course, doing zazen may help us do a better job tomorrow, but we inhale and then we exhale. We're not inhaling and exhaling for the sake of something else. We're not expressing Buddha to get to someplace else. Of course, it would be wonderful if we could stop climate damage and if we could stop gun violence and if everybody just loved everybody else. That would be lovely. Maybe that can happen, but we don't practice to get somewhere else.

[43:43]

I was going to try not to do this, but I'll resort to text again, because there's a wonderful short talk by Duggan where he just expresses this. Wow, there's so many of them. Well, OK, here's one. This is just one of Duggan's short talks. Okay, I'll do this one. As this mountain monk, Dogen himself, today gives the Dharamahala discourse, all Buddhas of the three times also today give the Dharamahala discourse. The ancestral teachers in all generations also today give the Dharamahala discourse. The one who bears the sixteen-foot golden body, that is the Buddha, gives the Dharamahala discourse. The one endowed with the wondrous function of the hundred grasses of all things gives the Dharamahala discourse. Already together, having given the Dharamahala What Dharma has been expounded?

[44:49]

So it's not about something else. It's just this expression of the Dharma. No other Dharma is expressed, but this very Dharma is expressed. So anyway, he has numbers of expressions like that. It's not about something else. It's how do we... not try and run away from our dharma position, but right in the middle of our dharma position, right in the middle of our situation, of the difficulties of your life and of our world, how do we find our way to express something of awakening and care? Yes, hi. I'm just responding to that. Yeah, I felt like For me, it was almost like, yeah, so it's not about something else besides what is here, but it's like, I'm so, what I felt as you were, during your talk was, with all this fantastical stuff, I'm sort of like, what is all this?

[46:02]

And then, but it's not, but the impact on me overall, it's almost like you have to go to all this fantastical stuff just to wake up to what is here because what is here is this richness as you said but it's like normally there's sort of a cloudiness that prevents just really being awake to that, like sort of being stuck in the mud. And so it's like, what is it that allows the flower to sort of rise up out of the mud and bloom? So and just to recognize the reality of this space and time and the people, the beings around us, you know, that it's not necessarily about having to do something to help, or something like that, some idea of being a good person, it's like, what happens when you just wake up to the reality of all the people around you?

[47:05]

Then you just respond differently. Yes, thank you. Thank you. Hi, yes. I appreciated the if this moment feels distant from the time the teachings were first transmitted, which it does. I appreciated that in the sense that sometimes as a Westerner coming to these teachings, there's a sense of distance or foreignness, or this doesn't belong to me, or I'm kind of adopting this or putting this on. But when times as expansive as these stories allow us to feel that it is, you don't fixate so much on cultural differences or geography or language, things that I think can sometimes get in the way of really embracing that.

[48:06]

Exactly. The point is, how do we make this teaching and practice our own? Because it is our own. Just by virtue of your being here. If this is the first time you're here, of Virginia. Any other last comments or questions? Yes, I guess. So I really want to express my gratitude for Rocky Dogan and the Lotus Sutra. I found it extremely resonant, inspiring, this dance that's called the profound support that's mutual, that's occurring constantly. It made me think of This is a long sort of commentary by Delvin through you on Beauchamp's, you know, in the sense of his expressing of violence. So thank you for taking me further. You're welcome. And actually, I'm intending to speak about this in various ways more the next couple of months.

[49:14]

next weekend and tomorrow, and we have some visitors from Belgium, which is wonderful, and I was asked by European Center, should we give a seminar about drug and the relationship to it in Hungary. Excellent.

[49:31]

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