If I speak, I make problems. Very difficult to say more than ummans. You know, every day is a good day. Ummans. way is characterized by being very free of conceptual hand-holes or mind-holes. He just said, quite simply, every day is a good day. Or he said, why when the bell rings do you put on your robe?

[01:05]

As I said last time, the world is vast and wide. Why, when the bell rings, do you put on your robe? I can say there's no real realm where there are any problems. Yet we have some problems. Last time I said greed, hate and delusion are not really about excessive desire so much as belief in things, fear of things or belief that things will help you. When there's greed, hate and delusion, the world is not vast and wide and unobstructed. But this question I've been bringing up of a possession,

[02:34]

Sometimes we think of freedom and bondage as opposites. But freedom and friend are the same word, same root, have the same root. And it comes from a root which means belonging to by love rather than by force. The idea is that everything is possessed or belongs to something but one is by affection or by necessity. I was using wieldy. the other day, which means the ability to use something or power. And free,

[03:49]

I think it's helpful to use words in a very particular sense, not in our generalized, you know, some abstract sense, but like you get a rope free, untangled, or free space or free shelf. The sense of free is unobstructed or able to be used, free for use. I used welcome. Welcome means literally to will or wish to be in step with. So in Uman's koan, Uman's story, When the Bell Rings, do we put on our... Why do we put on our robe? Uman's commentary includes Tozan's famous poem. If you ask to try to see it with your

[05:27]

eye, you cannot get it, but to hear it with your eye or see it with your ear is the way. And there are many versions of this kind of statement. Does the stick ring or does the bell ring? Or stick doesn't ring and bell doesn't ring. or Buddha's, so supposedly Buddha's discussion. Does the ear, do you go to the sound or does the sound come to you? What kind of effort or activity is there when you hear something? Much more than just some relationship between things, some harmonious relationship between things. Destroying harsh words, preserving positive activity of words. More stick and bell, you know.

[07:06]

or being in step with, willing, wishing to be in step with. More than that, we're talking about the incontrovertible facts of your own existence. Koan is called an official document. Koan means public statement or official document, and the sense of that is because it can't be changed. Koan is something that can't be changed. So koan means something, actually it means not some story or created problem, but what comes out of you that can't be changed. This is what Uman's talking about. Why do you put on your robe when the bell rings? What comes out of you that can't be changed? So we're not talking about adjusting things or adjusting yourself to the world but what comes out in everything that can't be changed? And part of Zen

[08:37]

is the ability to recognize a koan. The ability to recognize what can't be changed. I didn't mean to be so strict with you last time. I'm sorry. I don't mean, didn't mean to create a situation where I feel you could understand. I was saying,

[10:03]

There's some difficult situation you have to adjust to or you have to meet up with or match. There's some created problem that you have to meet. I didn't mean that. I mean, when things are unobstructed, where is the problem? When do you meet something that can't be changed? When will you stop adjusting everything to fit you? A you which isn't the you, because the you which you really want is what can't be changed. Suzuki Rishi always used to say, how do we exist in this world? It doesn't have to be some ultimatum or big question, just you exist, you exist in this world.

[12:07]

And maybe in your tummy you will find that warmth of affection, belonging. Which is the first step in wisdom? Is there anything you'd like to talk about? Yes. Not changing things, is that like not leaving a trace as you go by? If you change things that, you know, people say you've changed

[13:50]

Yeah, that's coming at the same thing from another direction, to say there's no trace in your activity. A little different approach to say nothing, to act in such a way that you don't disturb anything. I used to say, first we try to go through the bushes or find the path, then we try to move through the path without disturbing anything, and then we are just the path. That would be the ultimate in non-disturbance, that you are the bushes already. That stage in which you are the bushes already is what I mean by that which cannot be changed.

[15:30]

Yes, I've been explaining. I don't mean I won't try again, but that's what I've been talking about, as you recognize. In a question, it's important to put it on the table, you know, so everyone can see it, or so you can recognize it. But you shouldn't do that at the price of stopping the fermenting process. Usually when you can ask a question, it means if you let it ferment, you've already got

[17:03]

So to ask a question is not to take the bottle away from where it's being fermented, but to allow the fermentation to occur and ask a question at the same time. If that's so, I can give you a different kind of answer. If I see you've taken the bottle off the fermentation shelf, I have to answer in such a way that pushes it back in there. If you still are fermenting, then I can answer some other question, or some unrelated topic, it seems like, to stick another bottle in the fermentation. as I was talking last time about the public relations department of Belusio, or the danger of faith as a form of possessing, depending on the teacher or on the teaching.

[18:49]

best way to approach practice is to not care whether you understand or not. If you say, Suzuki Ueshi used to say, if you say you're following Buddha's way, that's you're off the path. It's not exact enough. What way you're following? You can't say if you actually see what you're doing that you're following Buddha's way. Or Dogen says, If I give you, if you receive something you deserve, that's unhealthy. If you receive something you don't deserve, that's healthy. Some other understanding of cause and effect. Someone in the back? Yes.

[20:28]

I don't want to accept the fact that I'm a player. You have to project your voice a little more. I get as far as I say things that are outside your personal experience. I don't want to, in my way, accept what you say. I don't want to try to sculpt the Dharma or to practice the Dharma. You don't want, in a naive way, to accept what I say. And you don't want to spout... Right. That's good.

[21:50]

And Mumon concerns himself with this very point in the koan I'm talking about, and he says something... I can't remember exactly, but something like, if you think it's all one, that's not it. If you think everything is separate, that's not it. Something like that he said. Anyway, whatever you say, I'll say the opposite. So I want to say something that's... that you know somehow, but at the same time doesn't fit in with what you think. So your problem is, why would I do it? That's your problem.

[23:23]

Why would I say such a thing? Am I fooling you? That might be so, you know. And as long as I can fool you... That's one way... I don't do that, actually, but that's one way of teaching. Particularly with older students, you fool them, you know. until they can't be fooled. Like, a simple example is Zogirashi's teacher telling him he had a terrible disease and his face was going to distort and grow and his bones were going to run amok, you know. There's some disease like that. And Roshi would look in the mirror in the morning, you know. He said, I was rather vain. He was maybe 19 or 18 or something. And what his teacher said was usually right, so he was quite worried about it. Or a teacher says, come back to see me when you have stopped thinking. That's kind of fooling somebody to say that.

[24:49]

finally you come back for some other reason than you've stopped thinking. Maybe that's dealing with something which can't be changed, something which comes out which can't be changed. Or if someone says, nothing exists, this tatami is not here. Am I crazy? Why would I say it? I mean it, you know. Your problem is, you've met me and you're practicing Zen. You can't escape too easily. So far, you haven't escaped. So you have to figure out why you're associating yourself with this person, with all of us who sit and talk about this kind of thing, or who do something. You're doing it, aren't you?

[26:19]

Why are you doing it? Is this something that can't be helped? That you can't change? Is this something that's come out that you can't change? Is it something? that there's no way to say it, so you say something that literally it's like throwing, you know, pinning the tail on something. You can't get it right, but you try. Or are these statements of Buddhism very exact when you have some point of view other than your own, or usual one, or mental world? This is the kind of question you have to ask. That's what I mean. That's the kind of problem. What can it be, some point of view other than your own? Is that possible? Can you have my point of view?

[27:46]

Even if I'm wrong, if you have my point of view, it won't be wrong. What if one spills water? Who said that? Unconscious mental tendencies.

[29:13]

all these visions, yes, yeah I know I can't do this, all these, it's a bundle of unconscious mental tendencies which can't be heard. Why? She's quoting some Tibetan text or some Tibetan commentary, when you're beset by many visions, or... In the bardo? When you're beset in the bardo by all these tempting and terrifying deities,

[30:36]

You can't be hurt because you're a bundle, is that right? A body or a bundle. A bundle is pretty good. A bundle of unconscious tendencies, mental tendencies. Whose translation is that? By Trungpa Rinpoche? Oh, yes. I haven't seen it. I heard about it. Is it good? The unconscious, the bundle of unconscious mental tendencies can mean almost anything.

[31:40]

It's true, though, you can't be hurt by the terrifying and tempting visions. It is not? No. Tendencies can't be destroyed? I don't know. I'd have to see the book Because you all have many, all of you are bundles of unconscious tendencies which I would like to destroy. And I intend to. Yes? Last year you once said discipline I believe, if I remember correctly, you were speaking of your relationship. You were speaking about your relationship with us and saying that you weren't interested in disciplining our personalities, but wanted to discipline ourselves. So maybe that's becoming a path. What role does disciplining our personalities have in that?

[33:16]

Again, out of context, it's difficult to know. But is the difference between personality and self? Self. Self? C-E-L-L-S? Even self. It's difficult to know. But right now I'd say that for most people your personality is a bunch of mechanical problems and it's useful to be able to see it, you know, as we've talked about car mechanics once. It's useful to be able to see your personality as a kind of mechanical problem.

[34:37]

which you tinker with or adjust. Some people have one set just because of their habits or parents or circumstances, and some people have another set. Tsukiyoshi always spoke about a perfect personality. This would mean When you don't, your personality is no obstruction anymore in your relationship. But we don't, as Sugrivasi has said, and Dogen and other people, you know, we don't ever... to try to efface your individual personality is not our way either. I talked about that one day. Here? A long time. What that means, these words are all so overlapping that it's rather...

[36:02]

to say, to express, to give you a feeling for what it means not to efface your individual personality. It's the same, actually, as why do we put on our robe when we hear the bell. Tibetan Buddhism has a little different way. It's virtually the same. But Tibetan Buddhism has a little different way of expressing... First, it has a little different way of involving yourself with practice. And it has a little different way of describing.

[37:25]

I'm not necessarily answering your question, but there can be some, if you read Tibetan Buddhism, there can be some confusion, because they describe things we don't describe. Zen always emphasizes emptiness. So we emphasize getting rid of Buddha. And they emphasize some vision of a Buddha sitting on your head. That's right, it's a mistake to think this way. It's a fundamental error. Buddhism says this is the fundamental error people make. They misplace the absolute. So, you do it. You know the statement. And you are a human being. So you do it.

[39:10]

How do you do it, or when do you do it? How do you deal with that constant conflict? You have some idea, or some idea, and yet you do something wrong. It's that constant conflict. That, again, is what we're always talking about. Why do we do it? Why can't we do what we want to do? And why is there a division between what we want in the short run and what we want in the long run? We eat too much, and right now we want to eat it, but tomorrow we know we wish we hadn't. Why do we have that problem?

[40:16]

First, it's a matter of discipline. And later, it's a matter that there is no conflict between tomorrow and now in your desires. But how you get to that point is mysterious. It's easy to say. But luckily, you know, We don't have to figure it out completely. Just do Zazen. Trust your practice and your way. And one day you'll find you do it. You have an intimation of it. You've done it a little. And once, if it's happened once, you know eventually your whole life will be that way. If you're patient. What's the concept of tomorrow? You're starting Buddhism from the beginning. Recreating Buddhism with your questions. Each of your questions so far is worth about two or three years apiece. Takes two or three years of focus on

[41:50]

time, our existence in time and space. Does it exist or doesn't it exist? What is future and past? You have to do something, you know, but you find out, as you just said, you can't do it, right? Or you have some resistance, or you don't feel so good. Most people's minds are, you know, I was describing mind as buoyant the other day, right? Most people's minds are very jumpy and fragile and skittery, just a slight insult, and their mind leaps back, or slight criticism, or some implication that tomorrow won't go well. Our minds are very like that, the surface anyway. But we have a second wind. We can go crazy at that level, or kill ourselves at that level.

[43:18]

But if you have some endurance, which you get by zazen, if you smash that level completely, you find there's no problem. Like Pam was saying. I don't know how to express it, you know. This hand can hurt this hand. Actually, you can want it to. But this can't hurt that, you know. Unless you have cancer. This can't hurt that. And what's the difference between that and that and that and that?

[44:23]

What's the difference except our ambivalence or what's the difference? Why can't we do that in everything? The answer is very simple. I won't tell you. I've told you too often. Yeah, that's true. Hmm. What I mean, it's not really, I'm not supposed to mean something general, but... Faith has... Faith for a hateful person.

[46:25]

is good practice. Faith for a greedy person is a very dangerous practice. Do you understand? It's because of the anger. Yeah, it's so close to making a career or I think it's pretty clear. You know, it's a big problem for some people. It's related to the problem of freedom and friend and bondage, which I've been talking about. Buddhism is not power or something like that. Our personality has to be quite perfected to have disciples. Because most people who have disciples or followers

[48:09]

people who practice with them or believe them. The important thing is that free shelf, free and unoccupied. Zen emphasizes this point pretty strongly, you know. We're always pushing... teacher is always pushing the disciple away and making it rather difficult to stay. Or if someone says, I should leave, you say, oh, good. I don't mean there shouldn't be faith, you know, or trust. But it's very difficult, you know, very difficult to meet someone

[49:43]

who asks you about Zen or who has some difficulty. If the teacher's feeling is, I possess Buddhism and you don't and I can help you, that's what I mean by that danger. We don't possess anything. You just coerce people. Could you hear what she said? She said, skittery, easily upset mind, or something like that, sometimes seems to dominate your mental situation, something you said. Not dormant, you said dominate, right? And sometimes she tries to

[51:44]

be one with it. Sometimes she tries to ignore it. Try both at once. You know, it's... I'm enjoying sitting here with you, so... I hope your legs don't hurt too much. So I'll think of something to say. Your skittery mind is you, so there's no choice but to be one with it. But maybe the relative importance you give it, you can change. Okay, my mind is skittery, but I'm going to ignore it. To ignore it and try to be separate from it, it won't work. You, in Zazen, had that state of mind which isn't located anywhere. Right? Maybe? And your knees hurt, but it doesn't matter, it's way off there somewhere. That's the state of mind you want all the time. If something is bothering you, oh, it's... You don't... It doesn't knock... It doesn't... You know, if you're sitting on a campfire,

[53:21]

It's rather uncomfortable. But if you see a campfire from across the lake, it's rather pretty. And it doesn't deny the campfire, it's just the scale of your concern is different. So why do we insist on sitting on the campfire, is the problem you were asking. It's our state of mind is not calm enough for our focus to get free of something, of ego or something like that. Yes, it is a form of attachment. You're getting rewarded by the attachment. You think so. It's very difficult to figure out the game. But someone told us once, if we stick with it, something good will happen. I don't know. It's crazy. Yes.

[54:51]

If you can approach that state as it's superficial, as it's conditional, say, if you can do it at Tassajara, I don't think you'd be able to do it at Tassajara or some other place. If it's some other place, you can do it. Is it superficial in that way? Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. If it comes at Tassajara, I'll be grateful. Okay, is it? My God! What the thing is? Yay! That's all right, I'd like to hear it. Well, like in the city, very difficult. Yeah, I know. And my own feeling is, when I'm here at the Tesshara, I feel very relaxed and easy and no problem about anything much. When I go to the city, I feel nearly the same, actually. But I begin to feel like a warehouse.

[56:37]

And people keep stuffing things in the warehouse. And I don't mind, because I... How much is... Like, I don't... I'm still... My experience is still the warehouse, not what's in the warehouse. But after a while, your warehouse feels awfully full. I don't mind, actually, how much stuff gets in the warehouse, but sometimes it feels a little stuffed. And if I come down here, it's different, you know? But I think it's not different for you, except maybe when you go to the city, your warehouse is not so big yet, you know? And sometimes people put boxes down on top of you. and then you lose the warehouse. That was kind of silly, but anyway. There's an aspect of practice which is gradual.

[58:06]

your warehouse will get bigger and bigger. And pretty soon anything can be put in, or sometimes we say it's like the ocean. And when you're identified with the surface... This is the way you explain Buddhism, actually, to young people. But, like Sukheshi said, his teacher used to, when he was young, talk about mirror mind, that nothing's on your mirror. It's actually a rather useful way to think about it. When you take something away from the mirror, there's nothing on the mirror. But this kind of explanation can be a little bit... it's too easy, but anyway. Sometimes, in the same kind of vein, we say, in the ocean, if you're identified with the waves, it's quite disturbing. But when you identify with the center, calm, deep ocean, it doesn't matter how many waves are on the surface, or how many boats, an armada, you know, can be going. It doesn't make any difference. So by gradual practice, you know, and by an effort, which you can say is superficial,

[59:28]

Not there, if you're not wishing it, but still, what is wishing then? What is trying? Is that artificial? I don't know. So, by gradual practice, you more and more get to the bottom of the ocean, shall I say. Or, more and more, don't identify with what's in the warehouse, but with space or the warehouse itself, okay? That's clear enough. But gradual practice will never get you all the way. If the pressure is great enough, you will shift back to identifying with what's in the warehouse. Or pretty soon, if the ocean is absolutely clogged with boats, sinking to the bottom, etc., your mind will become disturbed. This is not Zen practice. This is something Zen practice is trying to cut free of, this kind of approach. But this way of practice, you know, Zazen, to give you some taste of this way, Tassajara life, which is rather unobstructed, you know, once you get used to the schedule, is to give you a taste of this kind of life.

[60:52]

But sudden practice, you know, means you come to the point at which you completely drop your mental world. Then images of mirror and warehouse and stuff don't mean anything. Do you understand what I mean? But that's the hard part, to get to the point. Gradual practice is very nice and quite easy. very satisfying, but to actually drop it is difficult, and depends on timeliness and timelessness coming together, as I said the other day. Depends on your being ready for the circumstances. You can, by gradual practice, get to the point where, even without protecting yourself, the city won't bother you. But still, it's not enough.

[62:06]

It means you have to be pushed, be able to see the box you're in. The koan is that which can't be changed, that which you can't argue with. There's no gradual approach to it.

[62:55]

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