When you wash the dishes, you are doing the dishes. Why didn't you do it? When you are washing the dishes, you wash the dishes. You don't wash the dishes. You wash the dishes. There must be another word in there somewhere. You are washing the dishes. You are not washing the dishes. Yes, right. You are in the moment of being immersed in the act that you are performing. You are not thinking. You are performing this act that is... Well, I used to think it was an act that is so amazing, but yet,

[01:08]

so part of being... It is awesome dignified presence. And the way he explained it... Zen priest or whatever it is I want to call myself. That is kind of like sitting in Zazen waiting for enlightenment or washing the dishes in order to get them cleaned. And actually, that is our usual human world, is that we do things in order to whatever.

[02:10]

We do a... Yes, and it is not that there is anything wrong with that. It is just that that is not reality. It is not... Again, we need to accomplish things. We need to function in the ordinary. So the ordinary mind, the ordinary everyday activities... Let's go back to the everyday activities thing he says because I think that is one place where maybe we can work with this. Where is that? In the third page. While the everyday activities of active Buddhas invariably allow Buddhas to practice, active Buddhas allow everyday activities to practice. Can we allow this washing the dishes to be... to practice, to express the realization of washing the dishes? So our activity of washing the dishes is this total dynamic functioning, transformative functioning of the practice of awesomely washing the dishes.

[03:14]

Now it also... We end up with some clean dishes in the drain. That is fine. But we usually think of our activity as something to do for the sake of something else rather than for itself. The Dylan line, people who do what they do just to be nothing more than something they invest in. So we can spend our life doing resume building activities for the sake of a resume. But actually, what is this that thus comes? This level of active Buddhas is just washing the dishes, just eating the orange. We don't eat the orange... I mean, it's true that we get nourishment and vitamin C and so forth as we're eating the orange, but eating the orange is just eating the orange also. You can negate also that you clean the dishes.

[04:20]

You wash the dishes. You can negate that. That's true, yeah, of course. Because... And you are always serving something. There's always... There is something to be done. Yeah, you've got to serve somebody, right. Right, exactly. And to be an awesome presence, let alone awesome, it's so big. It takes, like I said, it takes so much to be able to see those two things, that you're eating a knowledge because you're eating the knowledge, you're eating the knowledge, but you're choosing the nutrition. Right. You're choosing the two things, not just one. It would take a lot to spread that. Yeah, and yet, again, your conception of, your cognition of awakening is not awakening.

[05:23]

So your idea about what you're doing is one thing. What's actually happening is active Buddha. But it's not my purpose to create the light. That would be like... Yeah. How could you create enlightenment? That's true, that's my business, yeah. Well, you know, there's... Given the state of the world, I think I have some long-time job security. Right. Yeah.

[06:28]

I think you can figure it out. I mean, I would like to be able to eat like that all the time. But, you know... But I mean, I think that's... The understanding... To just... To really thoroughly enjoy just this is the point of our Zazen, in a way. So, you know, most of our activity... Quote-unquote worldly activity is about, you know, making a profit, getting, you know, you know, worldly gain and fame and all of that stuff that we do. This is our ordinary human activity in the world. Again, it's not that you shouldn't do that. It's not that it's bad, exactly. But in the course of that, in each moment, there is, you know, the everyday activities

[07:34]

which an active Buddha allows to practice. And so to allow... So it's not exactly either about fully tasting... You're fully tasting the orange. It's about allowing the orange to fully be tasted. So it's not about... Yeah, so it's letting go that is willing to be just this. It's really slippery to talk about. And anything I say is going to miss the mark. It's not going to quite get it. But still, that doesn't mean that we just kind of, you know... Actually, later on in this essay, for those of you who are brave enough to read ahead, he talks about the malakirti and silence and kind of refuting that idea of silence as being the only truth. So there's a reference to that much later in this text. So there's a lot... I mean, this is... You know, we could spend many weeks talking about this, obviously. But, you know, I think this...

[08:35]

Just to talk about this section where he's talking about that story, about what is this that thus comes, I think is pretty good and gets to a lot of what's going on in this issue of awesome presence. And yet, in terms of going back to our zazen, so the point of zazen in the Dogen school, where we're not sitting in order to get something else, is that while in our ordinary everyday activity we're trying to, you know, make more money or whatever, we might have very good, wonderful things that we're trying to accomplish, and that's fine. Zazen is not about something else. So just to have... So I emphasize everyday zazen just because to have even 10 or 15 minutes every day where you're in that space where whatever happens is okay, you're paying attention, and whatever arises is just this. That's great.

[09:43]

No. But it misses the mark. It's not that it's not fine, it's just that it's not awesome presence. You don't, but Stephen does. He doesn't, but you do. Because you want... You're... Okay, so this is a really good question because, so particularly in the Suzuki-Roshi lineage, there's just a little bit of an issue for me that we talk about non-gaining mind all the time, and so that's what we're talking about, that zazen is non-gaining mind, that we're not sitting in order to get something else. Now, part of that is recognizing that, yeah, I want to lower my blood pressure, I want to be, you know, feel, you know... There are all these positive side effects. Calmness, and I need to de-stress, and all that. So that may be there too, but this non-gaining idea in the middle of zazen,

[10:57]

we emphasize, and yet, I think people confuse that with there's no purpose, and there is a purpose to our zazen. And the purpose to our zazen is... Dun-dun-dun-dun... That their transformative function flows out in their speech, reaching throughout time, space, Buddhas, and activities. So, we vow to save all sentient beings. We do this not by saving particular sentient beings, but by... awesome presence. Or just... The word awesome, I think, is a little too much now. Dignified presence. Some people like the word awesome, but I don't think they do today. That's true. It's like the Bodhisattva vows. Yeah, it's awesome. So that's okay, we can use that word. But if that word feels intimidating to you, just dignified manner. So even if I,

[11:58]

the transformative effect of saving other sentient beings... It's not saving other sentient beings, it's just saving sentient beings. Don't exclude yourself. You need to be saved too, Miriam. I'm sorry, go ahead. Could you stop with the question, why Vajrasattva? I wouldn't say that. So what is this that thus comes? It's just facing the wall.

[12:59]

So that thing I quote from the Vinca Koan a lot, that to carry yourself forward and experience myriad things as delusion, that myriad things come forth and experience themselves as awakening. The myriad things coming forth, it includes, of course, yourself. It's not happening out there. But then when we can just allow the world to appear as it is, that's dignified presence. And that does have a transformative function when we're willing to sit on our cushion and do that every day and allow that space to be in the lives of ourselves and those around us. That's okay. You've got a problem. It's just something I say.

[14:05]

So from now on, if people ask you that question, you can say, no, you can say that I sit sasan because it cannot be defiled. They might be even more, yeah, it might be a big problem if you say it that way, but anyway. Okay, but there is a purpose to it. But the purpose is the non-gaining idea. Beverly? My sister asked me why I sit and stare at the wall for hours.

[15:08]

And, you know, just in thinking about the answer, I sit sasan because it cannot be defiled. It's probably not a good strategy to say that. Well, not only that, because I'm sure that's going to bring up more questions than answers on their part, you know. But to me, I can't even say that that's why I do it. Okay. That's an answer, but it's not... It doesn't connect. Yeah, anything you say will miss the mark. Still, there are ways to talk about it. I don't know, Stephen, why do you sit sasan? Because that's what all the cool guys do.

[16:13]

There you go. There you go. There's an answer for you. Dale, why do you sit sasan? No, why do you sit sasan? Okay. Not knowing is most intimate. Okay. Gregory, why do you sit sasan? Good. Very good. He said, I owe it to somebody. Okay. Mary, why do you sit sasan? Good. When you do sit sasan, why do you sit sasan?

[17:21]

Maybe I'm drawn to it, I'd say. But I don't sit at the campus. It's not like... I have to sit every day. You know what I'm saying? There are times that... That's fine. So you could say, Beverly, when your sister asks, because I'm drawn to it. That's good. I guess any answer to that would be what I would call a provisional answer. But yours comes really close to what the cool guys do because I have noticed that people who have practiced seriously, whether it's God, them, or another religion, I like being around them. They have an awesome presence. Ah, it's the awesome presence of the cool guys. That's what Reb used to say

[18:41]

as his reason for why he started sitting sasan was that he read these stories about these old Zen teachers and he wanted to be like them. And then he heard that they did this practice, so that's why he started doing it. Ron, why do you sit sasan? That's a good time to ask this. You know, I love what I've seen in those days over the first time I took a lesson in 1969. But, you know, a lot of it has to do with the fact that they deal with emotional problems that they reach and their desire

[19:44]

to deal with life tangible problems but then by just I think you get the habit off the ground and that's what's going to happen and it kind of keeps itself going. I found that I couldn't even go as fast as I've gone backwards and it just didn't persist anymore. So that's where I was and that's what for me is what works. Instead of slogging away at it in my own kind of set up way and that's where it gets me where it goes. There are worse things.

[20:55]

Maybe there are better things, too. But the emotional, you know, sitting for emotional difficulties, though, for me that doesn't go away. I sat in a session this morning because I was having some emotional difficulties and it's not that I wouldn't have sat otherwise but, you know, I actually really really needed it this morning. It just happened, so it happened. It did a little bit, yeah. Yeah. George, what do you say? It feels right. Yeah, that's a really good answer. I think it feels right. Lynn? My experience with the law and my original experience with the government was pretty routine, right? I mean, I used to work all the time and I started making it. Can I not? Well, that took a long time. But, you know,

[22:00]

it's really emotional, you know. It's a great thought. And it helps. You know, I kept at it because there was nowhere else to go. It's a long process. So all of this is about letting go is immeasurable. All these answers, each answer in some ways is an immeasurable example of just letting go, which means acknowledging, you know, I owe it to somebody or it feels right or whatever.

[23:07]

So in Duggan's talking about this, and I appreciate everything that everybody said, a lot. Well, we've talked about this, you know, actually pretty well. There's this issue that he talks about, about teachers' excellence and disciples' strength. Again, I think there's more we could say about everyday activities and allowing everyday activities to practice. Abandoning your body for dharma, to abandon dharma for your body. To give up holding back your life. To hold on fully to your life. I mean, he puts those together. It's not that those are separate. And that's a good one. So I guess I felt my own intention for Zazen at times is about wanting to not be holding back, wanting to be completely alive.

[24:20]

And yet, that's not separate from holding on fully. So are you still feeling perplexed by this section? No. Great. Letting go is a measure. George. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. It...

[25:36]

I explain what's going on. You fall into this philosophical structure. This is another window. And you can do it right there with this. And the difference between this window, which is about dignified presence, and the windows of the various philosophies that you use to explain it is that this isn't an explanation. And that we see that any explanation misses the mark. And yet, I sympathize with your... I feel particularly you have a kind of tenacious wanting to... probing mind that's trying to explain or find some handle. And it's... certain kinds of minds do this more than others and certain kinds of personalities.

[26:39]

But I think it's a natural function that we want to be able... Some of you are saying, well, how do I tell my sister why you're sitting facing the wall for hours? We want to be able to give some explanation. And yet, that's not what this is about. It's beyond that. It's beyond... And it's not that there's anything wrong with explanations, I guess. Although I did have a teacher once tell me to not explain anything to anybody for a year. And that was one of the... That was a very interesting year. What's that? That was later. Thank you. Actually, I was working with these two guys at the time at Tassajara Bakery. And I was trying to do this practice of not explaining anything to anybody. And...

[27:40]

So when Catherine would ask, why are you late? I'd say, oh, I'm late. Or... It was a very interesting year. But... So I had a very, very strong pattern of wanting to explain things. So I recognize you're looking for explanations. But that's not what this is about. And yet, you said it when you were talking about it. As you were talking about it, you came to a place that wasn't an explanation. And I forget exactly how you said it, but... No, no, just at the end of what you just said. It's a way... of... being with a question. Maybe that's something you could say.

[28:41]

So, Nanyues, going back to the original dialogue, Nanyues, anything I say would miss the mark. But then is there practice realization or not? Can you actually practice without an explanation? Can you have actual awakening without being able to say anything about it, without being able to tell your sister why? And he said it's not that there's no practice in realization. But it can't be defiled. So can you... So in a way, an explanation is kind of like a defilement. It kind of... You're giving it a name, which is... To say myriad things come forth. Myriad things come forth, right. So all of this is... Again, this is not... This is not just kind of a philosophical inquiry. It's actually how do we express our own...

[29:44]

each of us in our own way, our own inherent... What about the word inherent? Our own manner of dignity. Some of you talk a lot. Some of you don't talk very much. And yet I can see the dignity in each one. It's not a matter of... It's not... It can't be defined. It can't be photographed. It can't be explained in terms of this is the way to be... This is the way to express awesome presence. This is not the way to explain awesome presence. Is this awesome presence? Or is this awesome presence? Or is this awesome presence? Well? You know, we've been just like talking about often about not changing our minds. But I've been thinking... Thank you. That's the gaze of awe. That's the high holy gaze of Judaism. Uh-huh. It's a... It's a question of wonder. Yes. Yes, yes, yes. And so that's awe. It's a kind of thing. So awe in and of itself

[30:44]

requires explanation. It's not just wondering. It's wonder by itself. It's a more open question naturally. Good. Yes. The sense of wonder is really important. Yes. So awesome implies this wondrousness or I wonder. You're talking about the... What a way of thinking. But... This reminds me of... It would be a perfect... But... Okay. Okay. Again, I'm just searching for answers. But... But what was the question?

[31:46]

Maybe something... But the emphasis wasn't on the answers. It's just on looking for questions. Uh-huh. I find that a very hard thing to do. Uh-huh. I just want... I find myself wanting an explanation, wanting a search. But when I can just live with the question, fully open, completely... open my mind, open my life, that isn't possible otherwise. Uh-huh. It's... Yeah, that sense of awe. To be able to... It's the sense of awe and it's the expression of the sense of awe.

[32:48]

So I've been talking about the oneness of practice, realization, expression from other... There's a... And I didn't talk about this today, but there's another... There's an essay... There's a Dharma letter in... In Hikoroku where he talks about the oneness of not just practice, realization, but practice, realization, expression. And I feel like... This is what active Buddha is about. It's not just a kind of passive wondering. It's an active... It's the actual practice, an active activation of... sense of awe, of dignified presence or manner. It's... And it's not... Again, it's not about some formulation or explanation about it. It's physical. It's... It has... It's more of a posture than a... postulation or something. It's more of a... It's more of a way of... way... mode of expression that allows question.

[33:49]

It's not... It's not... It's going beyond Buddha. Again, it's going beyond... It's not stuck in some particular view. So maybe that's... Maybe we should go back to... Just that... Where is that thing about view that he says early on? Um... Um... Yeah, towards the bottom. Let's see. Where is the... Yeah. Yeah, experiencing such views, even for a moment, you cannot expect to meet liberation. No. Oh, yeah. Bound... Bondage to Buddha means to be bound by the view that our perception and cognition of bodhi is actually bodhi on the first page. Seeing bodhi as... Bodhi means just awakening, right? As nothing but awakening may appear as a view that corresponds to awakening. Who would imagine calling it a crooked view? But this is to tie yourself up without a rope.

[34:51]

So this way in which we get caught by our views... I mean, we're coming back to this. Becoming further and further bound up. You know, the tree doesn't topple and so forth. Um... Teachers of Buddhism, scholars of sutras and treatises who listen to the Buddha way from a distance say to arouse a view of dharma nature within dharma nature is no other than ignorance. So that's... So we've been saying that in a way. I mean, that's... They're right about that. But these teachers talk about arousing a view of dharma nature without clarifying the bondage to dharma nature. So that's a subtle point he's making there. But I think it's related to what we've just been getting to. That we... We can have views about the nature of reality

[35:58]

that catch us, that get us caught. And we can have very good views. So this is, again, about looking for an explanation. And we have a strong habit for that. Wanting... You know, we want to understand. It's not that there's anything wrong with that. But understand that that's not... Understand that. Even if you don't understand it, how can you express your own sense of deep awe and wonder and appreciation and gratitude for how vast and mysterious our reality is? The active expression of that is the dignified manner of active Buddhas. And yet it doesn't have to be verbal. It doesn't... It's... Some of us at the Boa Sashin were doing Oyuki practice,

[36:58]

serving and receiving food in the meditation hall. And just to be served or to receive food, there's this silent but awesome enactment of giving and receiving. And this is going back to the thing about tea ceremony. Tea ceremony is... In Japanese culture, it's really the way that Buddhism found its form in Japanese culture. I mean, it's really... It's actually a really good example. Not just in tea ceremony itself, but in that and in all the other ways of appreciating a teapot, a pot, just this thing, of really appreciating it. Or the simplicity of flower arrangement in a tea room or of a garden. There's so many... Just to bring that into our culture, this is the awesome presence of active Buddhas. Without any necessarily talking about Buddhas

[38:00]

or Dharma or any of this stuff, to actually find a way to express something. I'm kind of trapped by being a Dharma bum, and so I'm talking about Dharma all the time. But actually just to have as your practice, I don't know, whatever it is, something very simple and everyday. Those everyday activities completely express the Dharma as much, if not more, than any of my babbling about it. But I can't. So anyway, we've been babbling so long that it's five o'clock, and we're going to be here again next week, continuing to talk about this. And again, I'll review highlights for people who aren't... who show up next week who weren't here today, if there were some of those. And you're all welcome.

[39:00]

And before we stop, though, I just want to give space for anybody who wants to say anything, about anything. Thank you for your time. Amen. Well, have a safe trip back home.

[39:50]

@Transcribed_UNK
@Text_v005
@Score_85.3