Next week, maybe, we'll start the 50th case, and one of our recently deceased classmates suggested that we have a party. And... So, yes? Next week is the week we're skipping. So, next week is the week we're skipping. So, the following week. August 5th. Next week, I won't be here, so please don't come and have the party without me. Do not come here next week. Bruce, Bruce, come on up here. Oh, no. I can't hear you, Bruce. I'll sit right there. How about that? Fine. Is there anything you'd like to tell us?

[01:03]

No, I said it all. So do you want to have a party to celebrate the 50th case, or do you want to wait till the 100th? 50th. 50th. Should we have 50th first? Well, if we do that, then we're going to have to wait for quite a while. Say it again, Martha. Well, those of us who were getting on missed a good party, you know.

[02:09]

So, I'm going to have a party on the 5th? Yeah. Okay. So, um... Well, one thing I thought we'd do is start class earlier. Start at 7 o'clock instead of at 7.30. How many people could come earlier? Can you come earlier, Bruce? Yeah. Okay, so let's start at 7 instead of 7.30 on the 5th. That'll give us more time to party. And who wants to be on the party committee? Two? Okay, so there's three people. And talk to Henry, too. And so you have two weeks to organize this thing. Okay? And then that will be the last class for a while.

[03:12]

Until when? Until 1997, I guess. When are you going away, Miriam? I'm going away on September. Yeah. Goodbye. Just going to study at the Buddhist college in Devon England. She's in the first class of the college. What is the case party? What is the party? I don't know exactly what it is. but it might involve some sense of celebration of having persisted in studying this collection of Zen stories for about five years.

[04:41]

And that there's enthusiasm to study the tradition somehow, for some reason. Kind of an amazing thing that people keep coming to study these ancient stories. when they could be watching TV. It's kind of a celebration of that kind of enthusiasm for the study. It could be more than that too, I suppose, but that's one idea that occurs to me. That wasn't my idea, but that's what occurs to me. So it seems appropriate to do that. And the next one, of course, will be in the next millennia. So that'll be a In the year 2001, approximately, we'll have the next party. Yes? Who are the original students? Who are the original students? That's a very good question. Who are the original students?

[05:45]

That's it. Martha, I think, Flew. Yeah. So I think there's some other people, I think, that were in the first classes that aren't here tonight. Do you want to invite them, the people that are not here now, but were in the original class? You're in charge of the party with these other... I'm in charge of... Well, you're in the community, so if you'd like to invite some of the other people that have been to a lot of the classes, then maybe that's a good idea. All right. So this case, there's quite a few things that I... I wanted to talk about it, bring up, I don't know if I'll be able to bring them up all, but one thing is, last week I asked you before class just to read the story, and a lot of you just did read the story.

[07:03]

And then, after that, so this story is a story which refers to a ceremony of offering, making offerings during a memorial ceremony. And then, and then, The story in the book says that while making the offering, the Zen Master Dung Shan told the story, but they didn't tell the story in the case. So you didn't know the story, so then last week we brought the story out, and I wondered if people could tell something about what happened to you, how did your perspective on this story change? And so there's some new people here tonight, right? You never read the story before? Did you read the story before? Okay, so we'll read the story now, okay? So you can hear it, just hear the story for the first time.

[08:05]

You can hear it. And some other new people, like Will, you didn't hear it before, right? Oh, you read it before? Okay. So, Bruce, you didn't read it, right? I read the 49th. You read the 49th story? I read the 49th story. Did you read the commentary? Yes. Okay, well, we can't test you, but we can test you, huh? Okay, so let's read the story one more time. As Dungsan was presenting offerings before an image of Yunyan, he retold a story from before about depicting reality. At that time, a monk came forward and said, when Yunyan said, just this is it, what did he mean? Dengshan said, at that time, I nearly misunderstood my late teacher's meaning. The monk said, did Yunyan himself know it or not? Know it is or not?

[09:05]

Dung Shan said, if he didn't know it is, how could he be able to say this? If he did not, no, if he did know it is, how could he be willing to say this? If he didn't know it is, how could he be able to say this? If he did know it is, how would he be willing to say this? So we read that And then we told the background story. And I wondered if you could keep track of what happened to you and how your life changed when you heard the story. Could anybody follow that when it was happening and keep track of your state while you heard the story? Well, if you couldn't, yes. Yes. Um, did you just then at that... Just then at that time, in the class, did anybody, did you go through some process as you read the story, like, had a certain take on the story, you had a certain feeling about the story, and then you heard the background, what happened to you?

[10:21]

Could you feel yourself change as you heard those words? What happened? How did you change? Um, well, I became way more receptive to the case. because of the associations with them. And this is a process that's kind of continued and magnified over the week. But during the class, it made a big difference hearing the story, and it also made a difference to hear that the question had really kind of ordered what the what Jürgen had actually said, what's just this person, that made a difference to us. So for some reason or other, when they rewrote the story in later collections of these stories, when they rewrote it, they changed it from just this person

[11:31]

to just this is it but again he did say as I pointed out he did say very clearly literally what he said was just this man of Han is what he said a Han person is a Chinese person in those days that's the way a Chinese person would refer to himself as a Han person So just this person of Han, just this Han man, what he literally said, which means just this person, which means just this Chinese person. And so what happens when it switches from just this is it to just this person? What happens for you? Do you remember what happened? Could you say how your relationship to the story changed?

[12:36]

Did you have a sense of that? Well, it changed the... It brought it to more of a... I don't know how to describe it. It brought it to more of a point. You know, it just... It brought it to more... Did you say it or something? Mm-hmm. Because the difference between saying just this... which is fine too, but it's more expansive to just as a person, just more right here. That's what I experience. Yes, Mifflin? The Tibetans have a practice, maybe it came from India, where they imagine a guru or a teacher or... Buddha, or I'll keep this on, sitting on your head.

[13:38]

I did that practice for a while. If you're trying to keep a precept, or you're trying to do something, sometimes I get a real strong feeling. There's a Buddha telling me, or saying this to me, But now when you go, you have to change the story again to just this man called Charlie. It changes it again. Oh. It's just this person. Mm-hmm. What's your name?

[14:44]

Jennifer. Jennifer. Do you know each other? So, now, the story that they're telling here, that they didn't tell, is that when the great Zen master, Yuen Yuen, Dongshan, was going to leave his teacher, he said, I'm leaving now. And many years from now, in other words, after you're dead, if someone asked me to describe your teaching, what should I say? And his teacher said, just this person. For me, it became much more personal. Yeah? It seems to be out there. Right. and when we changed it to just this person, then it fell back on itself.

[15:46]

Right. Right. I think that might happen, right? And it's a funny thing, this story is bringing up the funny thing about Buddhism that I think is In some schools of Buddhism it's not necessarily pointed out. In most schools it's pointed out that the problem that we have is that we are too concerned with ourself, that we make too much or too little out of ourself. Making too much of ourself is being too concerned with ourself. Making too little of ourself is being too concerned with ourself. Underestimating ourselves is too much, is going too far. Doing anything to ourself at all is too much. But anyway, that's our problem that most of us have. So what is the teaching of this Zen master?

[16:50]

Just this person. So the teaching he's conveying about how to become free of taking ourselves too seriously is just this person. I just want to finish the story. And then he says, then Dongshan would start thinking, after he said just this person, he started thinking, and his teacher said, now that you've assumed the birth, You know, you've got this teaching of just this person, now you've assumed this burden. It's just this person's burden. You must be thorough going.

[17:52]

So, there it is. Then Dung Shan walks off and he's crossing the river and he sees his picture in the water. He sees his reflection in the water and he has a great awakening. meditating on just this person, he sees his reflection in the water and wakes up. So, before we go any further, I just want to say that you didn't necessarily ask your teacher the question. after many years from now, a hundred years from now, in other words, after you're dead, many years from now, if someone asks me, what was your teaching, how should I describe it? And if your teacher says to you, just this person, and then you start thinking about that, and your teacher says to you, now that you've assumed this burden, this responsibility for this teaching of just this person, you must be thoroughgoing.

[19:10]

So, do you feel up to receiving that burden? This is, you know, you didn't talk, you didn't talk, in a sense, you didn't talk to these ancestors. You didn't talk to Yuen Yuen like Dung Shan did. In a sense, you didn't do that. In a sense, you didn't ask Dung Shan either what his teaching, how you could depict his teaching, okay? But that lineage is coming down right to now. It's here now. Think about whether you want to receive that same responsibility of the teaching of just this person and be thoroughgoing about it. In Zen, in this particular lineage that comes from these people, teachers of this lineage say, you can receive their teaching from a thousand years ago. You can accept that teaching.

[20:20]

If you ask them how to depict their teaching, they say to you, just this person. If you receive that teaching, then they say to you, now that you've received this teaching, now that you've taken this burden, this responsibility of this teaching of just this person, you must be thoroughgoing. The question is, have you asked... And have you received this teaching? And now are you carrying this teaching? And if you are carrying this teaching, do you understand that they tell you you must be thoroughgoing? And then, what does that mean? So think about that. Where do you stand in relationship to this ancient... It's not just the teacher dumping this on you. It was given... Upon request, the student said, what is it? What should I say it is? He asked. The teacher told him. When the teacher told him, he received it and started to struggle with it. The teacher then said, you have received it.

[21:21]

Now, take care of it. And then this monk who received it, yes? Don't Sean come up with the five ranks, please? Yes. So, his receiving these words from his teacher... Yes. ...that were so unique with his teachers... Yes. So, since he so sincerely transmitted this to him... Yes. ...was he able that to... Did his teachings stem from this clearly telling him this was the teaching he was giving him, just this person. So he himself then, his experience of dustness are these five ranks that he then teaches. Yes. So that's, I'm just trying to get the structure. Yeah. Is that what I would, I mean, that's how I understand it. Is that what you're saying?

[22:23]

Yeah. And Dongshan then writes this, we chant, Frequently we chant Dumsan's song of the Jyul Mir Samadhi. At the beginning of the thing he says, the teaching of dustness, the teaching of just this person, that's the teaching of dustness. The teaching of just this person has been intimately communicated between Buddhas and ancestors. Now you have it. So, take care of it. It's the same. He's repeating his teacher's instruction, which now is going down over the centuries. We keep listening to this story every time we chant that. It's the same story, one generation later, and also... Sixty generations later, almost sixty generations, well, fifty-five generations later.

[23:25]

We're fifty-five generations from Dungsan. So, this is echoed every generation, this teaching of just this person is transmitted. The just this person doesn't get transmitted. The just this person doesn't do anything, doesn't go anywhere, okay? It doesn't come or go. The teaching gets transmitted. And think about whether you have received it, have you asked for it and received it, and do you want to take care of it? Michelle? I woke up very early, and can I share a story about something that happened around this lesson? Is it appropriate to do that? Yes, but if you do it, please... Say it loudly so they can hear in the back of the room to the back of your head. I woke up very early and decided to read the whole 49 again, which I did, and it felt a lot clearer to me, reading it again, and it was a week.

[24:34]

And then something happened rather extraordinary, and that was that I had a story come to me, and it wasn't in a dream state, and I'm not sure if I was totally awake, but it was in a different sort of place, and I haven't really experienced this before. And it was a very clear story about a horse who I was trying to saddle, and I knew this horse very well. We had ridden a lot together and I knew that this horse loved to be free of the stable. And the horse, for the first time in our relationship, refused to let me put the saddle on him or her. I'm not sure what gender the horse was. And without speaking to the horse, I said, why are you not wanting to go out riding? And the horse turned to me, looked me straight in the eyes and said, without speaking, but it was very clear, just because. And I didn't accept that because I took the saddle off and I was checking the saddle to make sure it wasn't hurting the horse.

[25:38]

And then I noticed that underneath the girth, the horse's belly was sore. And so my assumption was, aha, that's why you didn't want to go out riding. You have a sore belly and the girth would hurt you. And at that point, the horse turned to me and said, you may think that, but that isn't necessarily so. And it was like... Right in that moment, this horse and I became melded and were one, and there was nothing else there except for this clear communication in this horse. And the story ended, and I can't say I woke up or anything like that, because I wasn't sure. I was asleep. It was such an extraordinary experience. But when moments later I thought, gosh, this horse has brought me this very clear message. And the burden of the saddle, the thoroughbred, the thoroughness. I mean, there was a lot of symbology in this for me. And it left me with an incredibly peaceful feeling. And I hadn't realized that I'd actually woken up rather anxiously about worrying about some financial things.

[26:42]

And this horse was just this gift. And it felt like everything that was revealed in this lesson was symbolized by this exchange with this horse. It was just amazing. And it was almost like the horse was also saying, just this person, it's like just, it's not person even. And it was just, and this horse image has been coming to me all week, like a real token of a gift from something. So, what do you think of that, Jay? Congratulations. Oh, really? My experience was not... I didn't really... I was just listening to when you started to speak, and I read the case, and I guess I gave myself the sort of assignment as not to create any stories about it.

[28:12]

So... I was just trying to stay with that. As you started to tell the story, I had a great amount of appreciation, but my anxiety started to increase. It hit about heart level. During the class? During the class, when you started to tell the story. Your anxiety started to increase? Mm-hmm. What was your anxiety level when you first read the case? Um... Not as high as it got. I mean, it was a general... There was a conversation going on with myself when I first read the case of not trying to make anything out of it, which sort of placated the anxiety that comes up when I want to figure something out. And so when... you started telling the story, my anxiety increased.

[29:16]

And then there was a definite shift when it came out that it was just this person, instead of there, I had to connect, but the anxiety just sort of started to, I couldn't get a full breath at that point, sort of like right now. And then when you, this part of the story, when you said that in the culture of it being a confession of guilt, and when there's a crime, and then when the teacher said that you must be thoroughgoing, And all of a sudden, either I'm going to faint or I'm going to ask you to go further into it. And about 30 seconds later, you started speaking of it again.

[30:17]

And all of a sudden, my anxiety just kind of went right through me, like out the top of my head. And what I felt was... how to describe it, the guilt, just this person, the burden, the burden of my conventional being. Then you went into the story of the child. I guess when the teacher was a child and saying, wait, no eyes? I have eyes. No ears. I've got ears. And just that sense of it opened up the space for me to look into a place of my convention, without the guilt, without a compassionate place to look at what I'm guilty of, my manipulations, the places I don't want to admit are my humannesses that I do for love or to survive, to exist.

[31:26]

So that's when I just all week, I just feel like it just opened up the space. Well, can I make a comment? Yes. Although I wasn't here last week, I've been sick, but I have the... Okay, I'm getting better. I just wanted to say, it seems to me that this is talking about not only what's being transmitted, but how things are transmitted, how teaching is transmitted. And it's like a story that I heard from Amy Blanchard, one of your folks, talking about how somebody had a teacher, a Buddhist teacher, a master that he lived with for years and years, and the teacher never overtly taught him anything for years, and finally the person came to the teacher and said, Well, how come you don't teach me how to become enlightened?

[32:32]

And the teacher said, don't I have you sweep? Don't I have you drink tea with me? Don't I have you serve the tea? Don't I have you do this? These basic things. The message was that the way he lived, the teacher, the way he lived was the teaching. It wasn't any specific teaching. a lesson other than that. Just this person is the teaching. And that seems to be something that's being said here, too. I don't know if it says it in this commentary, but this story is about when Dongshan is doing a memorial service for Yunyan, right? So on another time he was doing a moral service for Yunyan and one of the monks said, you know, you were recognized first by Nanchuan.

[33:36]

Nanchuan, much more famous Zen master than Yunyan. And before Dengshan met Yunyan, when he was a young monk, he met Dengshan. I mean, he met Nanchuan. Nanchuan had a huge following and he asked all the monks, and his following again at the time of a memorial ceremony. So while he was doing a memorial ceremony for his teacher, Master Ma, he asked all the monks, will Master Ma come or not? And none of the monks could say anything but this young monk, Dungsan, came forth and said, he will come if he has companions. And so he was publicly recognized at that time. So then, when Deng Xia was doing memorial service for Yun Yan, the monks were saying, how come you're doing memorial service for him?

[34:38]

In other words, why aren't you doing memorial service for Nanchuan, the first and famous Zen master who recognized you? And he said, as for Yun Yan, it's not the profundity of his teaching and so on that I value, but that he never taught me anything directly. That's what I value most about him. So one of the characteristics of this lineage also is not to teach directly. When you make that distinction between just this is it and just this person, when he says just this person, he sees himself as a criminal Because when he does that, he begins to convey me beyond his personal experience. But he has to do that in order to teach. Yes.

[35:39]

And you have to do that in order to be a student too. Yes. You felt more comfortable? I felt more comfortable with just this is it. It is more comfortable. I like the mystery of just this is it. And the energy of it. I thought that just this person took, diffused energy. Mm-hmm. They said it required more words. And more words require more meaning. And more meaning creates more energy. Mm-hmm. Martha. I wasn't at the last class, but I did listen to some of the tape. And during the week, I had this experience of, well, this tremendous responsibility to become a struggle.

[36:47]

Being Buddha, you know? I mean, it's the image of Buddha, yet fainter and fainter as I read or think or live with the story, it becomes more and more like very close to just this person. And that sense of Buddha being outside, or the teaching being outside, or that you just touch the teachings in class and meditation, and there's time off, you know. There's no time off. Yeah. And when we hear this kind of stuff, we might get a little sad because we might have had an idea that practicing Zen was something you could do part of the time. And so it's a little bit sad when you have to let go of that kind of practicing Zen where you did it part of the time.

[37:52]

That was kind of a nice kind of Zen. That part-time Zen was kind of cute. during Zendo or on Saturdays. But a practice that you do all the time, it kind of, you lose a lot of other versions of practice. I mean, there's an infinite number of versions that aren't all the time. And all those kind of like, Bye-bye. They're all cute, too, actually. All those little compartmentalized versions of practice. A lot of them are really sweet, you know. And a lot of them are best sellers, by the way. But this actually full-scale thing, even though it's totally, incredibly wonderful, it's kind of sad, too, because... Wi-Fi, little zens, little practices.

[38:55]

I think Reggie was next, and then Liz, and then Miriam. I wasn't here last week either, but these sort of these three points that we're talking about, just the spirit, just this is it, and we must be thoroughgoing. They seem immediately all the same to me. Mm-hmm. Yes, all the same thing. Just this person, just this existence, if you do the same thing, you understand that, then that in itself requires still goingness. Yes. This? Well, actually, yeah, after what you just said, I realized this week I really did get this feeling of, I'm kind of tired, I think I need a break.

[40:03]

Yeah, I did. You know, I just had this feeling I was tired of trying to do the right thing, of, you know, putting all my energy into this and and it felt like trying to be good, but I also have the feeling that somehow I must be... I must have the right perception here because, you know, I'm sure it's not... I mean, somehow I'm holding this incorrectly by seeing it as good or bad or doing the right thing, you know? When you say holding this, what is this? the idea of what we're doing here. In this ring? Yeah, or in Zen, or, you know. I mean, at the same time, this cone was playing through me, and... At the same time the coins were going through you?

[41:05]

The cone, number 49, you know, I would... with my friends and whatever, I use it as an example and say, yeah, just this person, I cop, you know, that's me. I do that. So even though I was kind of trying to give myself a break, I kind of kept doing this without meaning to. But I guess what I'm also kind of wondering is, there is something wrong with this perception, right, of... I mean, I'm kind of wondering where this is coming from, this feeling of, God, I need a break. What is it that's creating this tension, I'm wondering, that makes me feel I need a break from it? Because it feels like, by holding it that way, that I'm putting part and saying, this part's okay and that part isn't. You know what I'm saying?

[42:06]

So I'm wondering... What's wrong with this picture? What's wrong with the picture? Nothing's wrong with this picture. This is a perfectly good picture. Perfectly good picture. Now what are we gonna do with the picture? Now what? Now what are we gonna do with the picture? Yeah, what? Perfectly good picture. What are we gonna do? Watch. Okay, now, first of all, resting is often a sign that we have been holding things in such a way as to get somewhat disoriented or to deplete our energy when we feel like we need a rest. And resting is sometimes a good thing to do. Resting is part of being enthusiastic. So you know how to rest.

[43:11]

Go ahead and rest. And then come back again. And I got this one of the images that came to me the other night was that it's like our self is like You know, it's like a rubber inner tube that goes in a tire or like that goes in a car tire or a bicycle tire, the inner tube. And if there's a hole in the inner tube, in order to find the hole, usually it helps if you put some air in it and blow it up. Then you can find the leak. And if you blow it up enough, you probably will find the leak.

[44:17]

But you can blow it up not too far and find the leak if you blow it up and put it in water. You'll find a leak. So a part of what... Zen practice is about, and Buddhist practice is about, is to blow up the self enough so that you can find the leaks in it. The leaks in the self are the places where you gain and lose something. It's the places of good and bad, right and wrong, gain and loss, existence and non-existence. Those are the places on ourself, around ourself, where we gain and lose things. There is, or there isn't. And around that issue, we like get inflated, we leak, or we expand, you know.

[45:23]

Gain and loss, and so on. So, these kinds of issues, which hover around this... appearance called the self, these show us in some senses, in a sense, what do they show us? They show us the places where we're not just this person. And just this person we use just this person to find the places where we're not just this person. And the places where we're not just this person, on the surface of this person, show us where we're adding too much or not, you know, we're taking just this person too serious. So Zen is about being good, but what is good is not the good and bad good, the gain and loss good.

[46:30]

What's good is to be perfectly just this person. Your virtue is for you to fully exercise this inner tube, this limited human. That's what's good. And it is about being good. But if you take being good in terms of gain and loss, or good and bad, it isn't that the whole thing is shot. It's just that then you will notice on the surface, if you're into good and bad, and you fully express yourself around that issue, you will notice energy will start pumping you up, or deflating you. I mean, not energy. You'll become pumped up or depressed. You'll be deflated or inflated around good and bad. Good and bad then will become, unless you are just this person, good and bad then will be a place where you gain and lose things.

[47:41]

If you're just this person, when the issue of good and bad arises, there'll be no gain or loss. That's called good. That's just a person. That is practicing good. That is avoiding evil. But it's very hard to be just this person. It requires tremendous mindfulness and presence and patience and enthusiasm and compassion and wisdom to do that. To put it the other way, if you work on this one thing, just this person, all these virtues start to develop. And they develop by noticing these leaks around the person.

[48:44]

And by noticing them, you'll notice that you're not just being this person at each one of these points. At a gain-loss point, at a good-bad point, at an existence, at a self-other, at all these points, you're not just doing your person part. You're doing the other part. You're doing too much, or you're not coming up to be yourself. You're shrinking back, or you're overdoing it. You're gaining, you're losing. You're asserting existence, or asserting non-existence. You're asserting right or wrong. You're blaming yourself or you're blaming the other. You're asserting yourself or you're recognizing the other, not asserting yourself. You're not just perfectly being yourself and letting it go with that. So, in fact, we learn by trial and error and we get tired anyway. But if you assert yourself as fully as you can, you start to notice the leaks more. If you shrink back, or way overdo it, you may not notice this leakage.

[49:52]

If you notice leaks, that's all you have to do. And so, for a long time we may be just noticing a lot of leakage, until we perfectly express ourselves. Just this person. No more, no less. So there's not the up and down when you're just this person? There's not up and down. And your energy then is... Well, in fact, the energy of this person is steady. But the energy of a person who's trying to be more than she is, it gets puffed way up or shrinks way down. And vice versa, the energy of a person who feels not allowed to be herself puffs up or sinks down. Sometimes you can puff yourself up by holding back. Like some people puff themselves up by holding back and then being morally superior to those who are not holding back.

[50:53]

Or vice versa. There's various ways you can do it. But anyway, either way you do it, Whatever strategy you use, other than just being yourself, it blows you up and then pops or shrinks back, and you notice you get tired. Well, you get tired, then it's nap time. You throw a blanky out and rest, and then get up and try again. Renewed and enthusiastic, you try again. Another mistake, rest and try again. Re-coordinate your energies and try again. That's why it's good to practice it in the morning, or sometimes it's good to think about these koans early in the morning, when your mind's fresh from sleep, from rest, and you come at it fresh. And sometimes you just hit it right on the mark in the early morning, and then you can notice you start to make too much or too little of it, it starts to tire you. So when you get tired from the way you work with these stories, that's feedback to you to look for where you're leaking around your self-expression.

[52:01]

Bruce? Oh, excuse me. Miriam's side. I have to express myself. You do, that's true. Well, my experience after class, or in my meditation last Monday morning, sitting with just this person. Monday morning or Tuesday morning? Tuesday morning. I have this sense of tremendous sadness and remorse because of my life. The way I've lived it has been just the opposite. It's trying not to be just this person. Trying to be more than this person. And it's struggling and all. All of that. I mean, you just feel, you know, it's quite tragic. But then, letting that go, I felt enormous relief that I could just be this person. And I'm going to forget that, I feel. But that experience was very cleansing.

[53:10]

Cleansing and relieving. Relieving. Yeah. So, you know, I teach classes, if you may notice. So I come to the class, and I study the materials. I love to study them, but also I sometimes feel a responsibility to be the so-called teacher in the class, right? And sometimes I forget that really what it's about is me coming in this room and sitting here with you, and me being this person is really what it's about. And with other people who are coming here bringing that person in the room. That's why this class is, in some sense... Just this class. Yeah. Because people come to this class. You know, actual people come here and be people, be persons in the class. That's the sort of... As long as that's happening, the class has integrity and vitality. And that integrity and vitality is...

[54:12]

what we use primarily to study these stories. So, for me, if I think I have to be more than myself in this class, then it's pretty hard for me to come to this class. Although I do come anyway, even if I'm caught by that. But I feel much more comfortable just to come and be this person. Bruce? I just wanted to say in the book, It wasn't here for the last time. Yes. But in the book, the question that apparently that Dongshan, the form in which the question, Dongshan's question was stated was, how do you, after you die, and people ask me, how to depict your reality? Right. And the answer was, in the form of you, it was just this person. Yes.

[55:13]

And to me, that means that the person and the reality are the same thing, but not in the sense that the person is that who is experiencing the reality, but rather that there is just this collection of horizons. The person is nothing more than the collection of horizons. The horizons are not being experienced by the person. There is just the collection of horizons. And the idea, in fact, of a person is just another horizon. So later when he was crossing the river and sees his reflection in the river, he sees the old idea of self, the notion of personal self, as another horizon. And that together with the... And to me, I think it was put together that way.

[56:20]

At least that's the way it feels. Well, before you said it was put together that way, I didn't quite understand what you meant by that, but before that, that is correct. That's right. If I put it together that way, I mean that's sort of one way into, for me, one way into the... The meaning. That sequence, as one lay in. Oh, I see. It was put together that way. From your point of view, the whole thing was put together by the story you just told. Yes. By the arisings. At least in this instance. At least in this instance. And that's what we work with. That's what we're being recommended to work with. And it's wonderful because we always have that.

[57:23]

We always have that. And there's no gain or loss around that. If we can just use that. But it's hard. We can make some examples of hard cases of this. Raj? I'm left with a big question from the original case. I mean, I really feel like it's kind of eating away at me. Well, let's hear it. What does Zongshan mean by answering, at that time, I nearly misunderstood what my teacher said? You would think the answer to the question, if the monk asking this question, you would think the answer would be just this person to the monk. but instead he says, I nearly misunderstood. And then when you learn, I mean, to me, the big thing about learning what the story was after reading the case, you know, reading, finding out the old story, was asking myself, well, where in that old story did he just nearly misunderstand?

[58:27]

Did he nearly misunderstand when he hesitated? Or did he nearly misunderstand later when he was fully enlightened? Where did he nearly misunderstand? And what did he mean by saying that to the monk? What was the point of saying that to the monk? And I'm lost in that moment. I just don't... Well, thank you very much for bringing that point up. Now, we've been working in a certain way, right? Now, he's bringing us back to this original case, which brings in another... This is another dimension, right? Now we understand what the instruction from the teacher is, what the teacher's practice is of just this person. And we've been talking about the practice and the reality of the teacher of just this person. Now, when asked, if you hear about this teaching, and someone might say to you,

[59:29]

well, what's Dung Shan's teaching, or what's Yun Yun's teaching? But Dung Shan said, at that time I nearly misunderstood my teacher. Now, if you look at the story, the actual story, at that time, when the teacher said that, he actually, what they say, he was lost in thought. He started thinking. Okay? So one level of interpretation here is that He nearly misunderstood me as I started to think about what he was saying. That's one level you can take that as. But I wouldn't stop there. Because then the teacher said to him, now you have assumed the burden for the great matter. You must be thorough going. Did he then again nearly misunderstand the teacher's teaching? Part of the burden, I would suggest to you, before you accept it, part of the burden is you might misunderstand the teacher's teaching.

[60:49]

I think that's part of the burden, is to carry that too, that you might misunderstand. Part of filling the inner tube is the understanding-not understanding surface. You have to come up and meet that one too without getting into understanding or not understanding. That's another one where you can gain and lose. I don't understand, teachers, I do understand. That's another place you can blow your inner tube, blow a hole, lose and gain. I understand, I don't understand. That's part of what it means to be a person, is to face that issue too. Don't forget that issue. It's not so much where you can understand or you can't understand, or you do understand or you don't understand. That's not what I'm emphasizing. Face that issue. Come up and get cozy with the issue of understanding and not understanding.

[61:54]

And then, see if you can say, I nearly misunderstood. What does that mean? And I feel like, to me, it seems like to settle that question, to take responsibility for that question, or that issue of what does it mean, I nearly misunderstood, to settle that issue, that's part of what it means to fully practice this justice person. If you don't, if I don't, if we don't come and meet that issue, we can work with that. We people can work with that. You have the ability to work with that question too. So that's another dimension to open up. Now, if you feel lost, well, you can talk that way, right?

[62:59]

But still, don't just talk that way and let it go at that. Become intimate with that issue, with that question. Use that question as something that you can bring yourself up to and see, you know, when do you actually touch that question? When are you at a distance from that question? When are you touching that question? When do you push that question over? When do you meet the question? Just meet it. When does that happen? You get to say. When is there no gain or loss in meeting the question of, at that time I nearly misunderstood my teacher's meeting? So if you hear the teaching of just this person, can you face nearly misunderstanding that? Or are you just going to let Dungsan do it for you? Are you just going to let him nearly misunderstand, so you don't have to nearly misunderstand? Yes?

[64:01]

I'm really misunderstanding. You're not nearly misunderstanding? You've moved into just plain old misunderstanding? Is your energy leaking out? When I was listening to Miriam... Is your energy leaking out? My energy is going... It's a good circle, actually. And I was listening to Miriam's story of that kind of release, that understanding of years of struggle to be something that she perhaps isn't, and seeing that just this person is okay. And then I hear you... speak about just this person requires, actually use the word requires, mindfulness practice and patience. Yes. You know, it sets up a kind of qualities of this person who is just this person, who you, I, might not... In other words, Mary was looking for something, grasping for something, wanting something,

[65:10]

And then she dropped all that to be just this person. I feel like dropping just this person. But isn't the Mary that's striving also just this person? Isn't it? Sure. But just... Then the other side of it is almost this other kind of person that is... practicing with mindfulness and patience and equanimity and concentrated paramitas, isn't it? Yes. And that's what it requires. Realization. Realization of just this person requires that. You're always just this person. But if you're not totally present with yourself, you can't realize that. You're always... I mean, if you're shrinking back from self-expression, if we're recoiling and hiding, we're just that person. Perfectly. Transcendently. Just that hiding person. But are we present with that hiding?

[66:15]

If so, you realize it. If you're not present with your shrinking back, or you're overdoing it, then you don't realize it. It's this dharma, this teaching, of just this person, is present in everybody, of course. Fully present. Everyone fully possesses this teaching, of course. By definition. But without practice, you can't realize it. And so... But in this case, what's the practice? The practice is... The dharma is the dharma of each person being just as they are. And thereby being completely free of that. That's the dharma of the person. Just by being yourself, you're completely free of yourself. If you don't have the ability to be anyone but yourself, that is exactly why you're free.

[67:17]

And that's always the way it is, and that's always your freedom. However, without practice, it's not realized. And the practice is the practice of being what you already are. which is called the practice of being present, which is a practice of using your awareness to appreciate what you already are, which means being patient with your situation and so on. All these practices are necessary in order to realize the Dharma, which is fully abundant right now. And in order to do those practices fully, you have to give up some other things. And that's the turning word for making presence. That was the clarifying word. Yes? It seems like when Miriam I understood that she was just this person. She maybe wasn't trying to do all these practices, like practicing the paranitas or something, but she was mindful and present and patient at that time, but it wasn't like this burden of this thing that she had to do.

[68:28]

That's kind of how I understood it. She was actually doing those practices, but without even realizing she was doing them, which was definitely doing them. Does that make sense? Yeah. Maybe she was practicing that way. So, congratulations, Miriam, on your morning meditation. Yes? I was talking about an exchange between you and Toby. I was reminded of you again tonight, and we were in case 47. And you were asking us about our commitment to something. And Toby started to look around. And you said, it's not out there. It's not out there. It's in your heart. What is it? And it felt like this instruction to me about almost missing or something, but kind of coming back to just this person and wanting to study.

[69:33]

And it was very, I don't know if that makes the same connection for you, but for me it was really very powerful, because Toby was very concentrated. It was very Toby powerful. Yeah, and it was like a reminder from that to the heart of the matter. Bruce? Well, I was just thinking about, it seems to me like your ear tube analogy, and the way in which Bruce described the experience of just these constantly changing aggregates are, it seems like, two sides of an equation. It seems like what you're describing is that it's very important to have

[70:41]

a really refined sense of ourselves. That's what the inner tape analogy is about, isn't it? And that actually is a crime. A refined sense can be a crime. The The reflection is the realization that the refined sense of your self, or this really refined story, isn't actually a crime. That's the reflection in the water, isn't it? Well, the story, you could say, the story of yourself doesn't have to be refined, but your awareness of the story has to be refined. You can have a rough and ready, you can have a clunky old story of yourself, that's okay. The story of yourself can be real clunky and coarse. But your awareness has to be just as it is.

[71:45]

But you don't have to have a fine story of yourself. You might be that kind of person, but we've got some perfectly good Zen students around here who have really rough self-stories. The story doesn't matter. The clarity about the story is what matters. That has to be exact. And then, leave it at that. Otherwise... there'll be gain and loss, there'll be leaks, and with the leaks, then you don't appreciate the total transcendence of the story of itself. The Dharma of the story will not be released into your life unless you're present with the story. And then let it be at that. And then all the time, all around the story, there's always these possible gain and losses. There's always these ways of being too much or too little, in other words, being more than you are, less than you are, getting into all these other things. Those have to be dropped off, renounced, and just be left with the story, whatever it is at the moment.

[72:53]

And that story, in a sense, if you believe the story has any substance, that's our crime. Admitting the crime, we have to admit exactly what the crime is. Not approximately. I'll sign whatever you say. You have to write your own indictment and then sign it. Just as that. Then it drops off. You study this crime thoroughly, all the fine details, then you say, that's it. And then it drops. And that's... It's hard for us to exercise this person, this limited human person. It's hard for us to do that. And part of the hardness is, as I was talking to some people today, is that to fully exercise this limited person, you have to exercise yourself right up to your limits and stop. And that means you have to exercise yourself right up to each person you meet.

[74:01]

You have to go right up stop before you go too far to go right up there and say here I am all the way up to you and then stop and say now you start you have you have you need that other person to stop you you got to start that other person to stop yourself you got to get into that dynamic very hard to like go right up there and Exercise yourself right out to the person, and let the other person exercise herself right out to you, and meet there. That's what it takes. You can't do it by yourself. Just Pat? Is there a fear... Of getting mixed up in the victim of the ego and figuring out... Is there a fear?

[75:07]

That just brought that... There can be a fear, but even if it's not... I mean, is that a... Can that happen or am I missing it? Can what happen? Being who... I want to say you think you are. Being who you are. Being. Okay, so being who you think you are is part of the job. That's part of the job. You have to do that part. Okay, that's part of it. But being aware of who you think you are, too, is what this is about? Being who you think you are as part of the job? Being aware of who you think you are as part of the job? Yes. Okay. One of those definitions is either ego or victim. Then you have to accept responsibility for thinking that you're a victim.

[76:16]

Yeah, but what if you haven't identified it as such? then you need to be aware of what you have identified it as. I guess the problem is that... That is the problem. The problem is that I don't always know if that is what's happening or not. And that's a leakage. That would be a leakage if you didn't know what was going on there. Or even if you didn't know what it would be, that would be a leak, thinking that you're a victim, okay? No, but I wouldn't be thinking I was a victim. I would be thinking that this is who I am. You'd be thinking, I'm such and such. Right. And if someone else saw it, would they think that that would be a victim story? Is that what you're saying? Okay.

[77:25]

I guess, is that the way you find the truth of it? Is what the way you find the truth of it? By putting yourself in the other person's place to look at it that way? No, you don't put yourself in the other person's place. You put yourself in your place, and then you tell the story of the place you put yourself. You take the person that you think you are, and you bring it out and show it. to yourself and to somebody else. And you get to see it. And if the other person can't see what it is, then you can say, well, it's very clear. And then they can say to you, well, tell me about it. And you can explain. And then if they start to see, if they start to understand it better, then you probably understand it better too. If it's unclear to them, it may be a little bit unclear to you, but maybe it's not unclear to you. But it'll get clearer if it gets clearer to them. Sometimes it's actually quite unclear to the person who's explaining and showing. Very unclear right now to me.

[78:29]

Okay. Yeah, but even, yeah. So you bring it out, you show it, for example, you show it to me. And if I think it's clear, then I can say to you, do you think it's clear? And if you say no, I can say, well, this is what you just told me. And you say, what? Or you can say it's very clear, I can say I don't get it, and you can say, well, what don't you get? And I can tell you the parts I don't get, and you can tell me more, and then it gets clearer to me, and then it gets clearer to you. The more I know, the more you know. You need me to understand you to understand yourself. If I can't understand you, you don't thoroughly understand yourself. I don't know if that's true for everybody. Did you want to tell me that it's time to stop the class? That's right. Can we have a little left hand on your strike? So that's, you know, the ultimate thing is that everybody needs to understand you. You need everybody to understand you. So if that's too scary, just start with one person.

[79:34]

And start with somebody who actually, who says, I will sit here and listen to you while you tell me who you are. And I'll tell you if I don't get that. You have to start by finding somebody. I asked one of my classes, I said, this week's homework assignment is, now you have two weeks homework assignment, see if you can find somebody who would like you to fully express yourself to him or her. See if you can find somebody who would like you to. Would you like me to fully express myself to you? Ask that around until you find somebody who says yes. See if you can find somebody who would like you to fully express yourself to them. They may say yes, but they may not. Let's start with that. Start with somebody who says yes, and then you can start practicing it.

[80:39]

So that's how I give you that assignment, too. See if you can find somebody that says yes to that. And then, I guess I would suggest you start doing it, if you get somebody that says yes. Probably they'll maybe want to know what you mean by that, and you can explain to them. And if you don't know how to explain what that means, then just say, wait a minute, I'll ask next week in class. I won't cash this check until I find out in class. And since it's past 9 o'clock, I can't tell you anymore, but if you don't know what that means, just find the person who was open to the idea, and then if they wanted to know what that meant and you couldn't tell them, then you come back and we can give you some additional help and find that. But we do need this person. We need this person in order to be just this person. We need another person. We cannot do this by ourselves. We cannot. Because just this person is not an independent person.

[81:42]

And just this person is not an independent person. It's an interdependent person, just this person. Less than this person, more than this person, that can be independent. But this person cannot be independent. This person is the Buddhist teaching. Just this person. Okay? So... I'm serious. Please try to find somebody. Go around and ask around, see if you can find somebody. Excuse me for saying so, but not me. Because I'm already telling you, I'm already telling you, I am such a person. I do want you to fully express yourself to me. So you've got me, but I need one more person besides me. Find that person. You have two weeks to find him. And when I went home from class, I went home and asked my wife if I could do it. What did she say?

[82:49]

Must have been good. It was very sweet, but it wasn't exactly yes, but it was very sweet.

[82:54]

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