Good morning, everyone, welcome, here in the Lincoln School Center and online. So we're going to have a practice commitment period starting April 2nd and the dharma aspect of that, the text we'll be using, is the Malakirti Sutra, a wonderful, entertaining Mahayana text that talks about the great lay, awakened lay practitioner from Shakyamuni's time, the Malakirti. So what I want to talk today about today are lay adepts in Zen history as background for the practice commitment period. And actually the Malakirti, there's no evidence that he was a historical person, he appears

[01:05]

only in one other text, I believe, one of the Mahayana texts, just amongst a list of other Bodhisattvas. But the influence of the sutra in China and Japan was very strong in terms of supporting lay practitioners. So for us at Ancient Dragons Zen Gate, we are basically a lay Sangha, a non-residential Sangha. Most of the Ancient Dragon priests and practice leaders have, and others have gone and done some residential practice at Tassajara and Green Ghost, and that's the background actually of Zen and the Zen that came to America.

[02:07]

And that kind of practice is very helpful. However, our practice here in Chicago and with all our friends online in various places, I see Indiana and Ohio and New Mexico online, is about being in the world. Yes? We're having some audio problems. I'm going to try switching the audio to that laptop really quick. Okay. Good. Okay. So I was saying that the Zen practice we received in America from Asia is basically received from monastic practice in China and Japan, in East Asia and Korea, and that kind of residential practice is important, and some of us here have done that, Tassajara or Green Ghost or

[03:09]

elsewhere, but we're basically practicing in the world. So the Vimalakirti example, Vimalakirti is said to have been very immersed in all kinds of different realms in the world. And, you know, we have a lay Sangha, wonderful people practicing regularly and engaged in the world in Chicago and elsewhere. We're looking for a new long-term temple building, and when we have that, there'll be rental spaces and hopefully ancient dragon practitioners will be renting there. But at this point, we're practicing in a way like Vimalakirti, practicing in the world, immersed in the world. So, as I said, Vimalakirti is, there's no evidence that he was an historical person,

[04:14]

although he's very important in Chinese, Korean, Japanese Zen history, as an example. But I wanted to mention today a few historical people who were lay practitioners, or in some cases, former monks who were practicing in the world, just as examples. So, I'll start with Layman Pang, Pang Yun, very famous Chinese practitioner, and basically in the 8th century, he dates to 740 to 808. There will not be a test, but I just want to tell stories. So, Layman Pang was a historical person. He was a student of both Shito and Mazu, who were the two great teachers in that period. Shito is an ancestor in our lineage, Soto Zen. Mazu was an ancestor in the Linji or Rinzai lineage, but they sent students back and forth

[05:18]

between them. So, Layman Pang studied with both of them, and later on will be chanting the Song of the Grass Hut by Shito, which is related to this idea of lay practice. And I'm going to talk about people who actually practiced in thatched huts, small huts. So, Layman Pang, there are many, many, many stories about him. And I'm just really mentioning him briefly. He was a layperson in the world, a wealthy merchant, like the Mahakirti is said to have been. And Layman Pang, two or three times, gave away all of his fortune to feed homeless people, destitute people, and then regained it. And he was a family man. What he sought for practice was a family affair.

[06:23]

So, Layman Pang, his wife, his son, and especially his daughter were also great bodhisattvas. And there are many stories about his daughter, Lingjiao, who was actually the model for one of the 33 forms of kannon in China, the bodhisattva of compassion. Just one story about Lingjiao. One time, Layman Pang stumbled and fell down on the ground. And Lingjiao ran up and fell down next to him. And he said, what are you doing? And he said, I just came here to help you. So, they fell together. I also want to mention someone in a story about Zhaozhou, who was a little later than Layman Pang. Layman Pang died in 808. Zhaozhou died in 897. And he's a historical person again.

[07:36]

He's documented that he lived for 120 years. But there are many stories, many, many, many, many stories about Zhaozhou. Zhaozhou is his name, as it's pronounced in Japanese. I'm just going to tell one story. This is Case 31 in the Mumon-Kan or Gateless Barrier. It's Case 10 in the Book of Serenity. Two records of encounter dialogues or Zen stories. So, this one's about the woman of Taishan, Mount Tai or Butai, which is the home of Manjushri, who's on our altar, the Bodhisattva of Wisdom, in northern China. So, whenever a monk was going to Taishan, he would ask a woman who was on the road there, which way is the road to Taishan?

[08:38]

And the woman would say, go right straight ahead. So, there are many stories about, sometimes they're called Zen grannies, these women who were living near monasteries, who sometimes they were tea sellers. Usually they're described as older women, although there were young women who also were, who are mentioned in the records. So, the woman said, go right straight ahead. And whenever the monk had gone a few steps, she would say, a fine monk, so he goes. So, one time a monk told Zhaozhou about this woman. Zhaozhou said, wait till I check out this woman for you. The next day, Zhaozhou went and asked her the same question, which way is the road to Taishan? And the woman also answered, same way, go right straight ahead. Zhaozhou returned to his monastery and said to his group, I have checked out the woman of Taishan for you.

[09:42]

So, there's a lot that could be said about this story. And some of the commentaries, including from Dogen, criticizes both Zhaozhou and this woman. But I'm mentioning her just as an example of the many women practitioners and women masters, really, who in some cases reprimanded the monks or put them in their place in one way or another. But with very, very few exceptions, none of them are named. This is a relic of Asian patriarchal culture. In the Vimalakirti Sutra, there's a goddess friend of Vimalakirti who lives with him in his house, who has a whole chapter in which she, well, I don't want to give away too many spoilers,

[10:47]

but it's a really entertaining chapter. She educates the monk Shariputra on gender fluidity and against gender discrimination. So, there are a number of stories like this in Zen lore. And, of course, you know, in this traditional Asian culture, it was very, very patriarchal. They don't record so many of the great women Zen teachers, some of them. And, of course, now, here in our American culture, women are being persecuted, especially by fascist politicians in Texas and Florida. And what they're doing is actually influencing the whole country, especially removing basic women's health care.

[11:49]

But, of course, women earn less than men from the same job still, and so forth. Anyway, these stories of women in Zen lore, well, the one in the Vimalakirti Sutra, especially, speaks against gender discrimination. So, we'll get to that in the practice period. I want to talk mainly today, though, about two historical figures from Japan, Tosui and Ryokan. And many of you have heard about Ryokan, maybe not so many about Tosui. He died in 1683. He was before Ryokan. And we don't know so much about him. What we do know is in a tribute written by Menzansuiho, who died in 1769.

[12:51]

So, a while after Tosui, his tribute was written in 1749, but not published until the year before he died in 1768. And I just want to mention Menzansuiho, because he's very, very important in Soto history. And there are some things in English about him, but he basically reformed Soto Zen in his time, along with his teacher, Manzan, and a few others who helped. But, yeah, he really established modern day Soto Zen. And again, he died in 1769. So, Menzansuiho is an important figure. But he had heard about this guy, Tosui. So, he wrote about him. I'm just going to say a little bit about him from these stories from Menzansuiho, which is our main source. So, Tosui was a monk from a very young age, age five.

[13:58]

And he became a brilliant student and expressor, a spounder of Zen teaching at a young age, 13 or 14. Eventually, he lived in Kyushu, the southern island, I think in Kumamoto area, where I did a practice period too. Anyway, he left his temple at the end of a practice period. And we don't really know what year, what his age was. So, there's a book about him called Letting Go. And he left. When he left the temple, suddenly, abruptly, at the end of a practice period, he left this poem.

[15:00]

Today, the retreat comes to an end. The assembly arrives to bid farewell. But the old monk has gone ahead. This old monk has gone ahead to the east, to the west, wherever his spirit leads. So, he was a true free spirit. He's considered in Japan to be like the first hippie. So, he's described that way now. Three of his disciples searched for him after he left. A couple of them found him, and he sent them away. He was living like a layperson, scraggly hair, and not like a proper monk. And he challenged them to stay with him, and they couldn't. They couldn't do what he was, his practice. So, he lived in the world for a long time. Anonymous, mostly anonymously. But there are stories about some of his disciples chasing him, trying to find him.

[16:04]

And he did various kind of odd jobs. There's a section here. This book, this is from Letting Go, a book by Peter Haskell. So, the master traveled to Ise. There's a great Shinto shrine. And he mingled with the beggars in the vicinity of the inner and outer shrines. He also spent time in Agoya and in Nara, where he worked at such jobs as a sweeper at the Daibutsu, the great temple. So, I don't know if any of you have been to Nara and seen this huge temple towards Aiji with the largest bronze statue in the world, and the largest wooden building in the world. And this is a statue of the Dharmakaya Buddha, or Jhana Buddha, anyway. So, he just worked doing menial work there anonymously.

[17:09]

Later, he re-hired on as a servant and even worked as a carrier, a porter, carrying. So, there was this kind of carriage that people would get rides in on the back of these porters. And he did that. In Kyoto, it is said that he associated with pack horse drivers and the like. He would never remain a full year doing the same thing in any one place, but would move freely around, changing his location, his occupation, and his appearance. At some point, living in Otsu near Kyoto, he made sandals and straw horseshoes and would go out selling them every day. So, he was known as the sandal maker. So, he just was at the side of the road selling sandals. And apparently, they had straw horseshoes back then, too. Later, his customers would come to place their orders and wait for them to be finished. People spoke of the old man of Otsu's shoes.

[18:15]

He rented a dwelling, was a vacant space, no more than about seven square feet, between two merchant houses. So, he had a thatched roof over this little hut and used the space only for sleeping. Didn't have any cooking utensils. Where he made the straw horseshoes and sandals there, he would use the proceeds to buy rice cakes and such. So, he spent two years doing this. So, sometimes he's known as a sandal maker, but he was an already transmitted Zen master. There's other stories of him. There's stories of him, of some of his earlier disciples trying to find him and occasionally coming across him. There's one long story of a nun, who was his disciple,

[19:23]

searching for him under the Gojo, the Fifth Street Bridge in Kyoto, amongst all the beggars. And she found, you know, what we would call homeless people. She found a leper there under the Fifth Street Bridge who Tosui was helping, and she offered food and bedding to Tosui, and he refused it. And she offered him food and bedding and money because she was a disciple of this. Finally, he took them, and her persuading, and gave them all to the leper and the money he spread amongst the other homeless people. So, there's all these kinds of stories about him. Various Dharma brothers looking for him, finding him amid the street people. And then, after these meetings, he would move away somewhere else. Eventually, later in his life, a former student who was wealthier persuaded him to receive leftover rice that was going to be thrown away anyway,

[20:27]

so he can make vinegar and sell it. So, for a while, he called himself the Vinegar Maker, perfecting the way. So, he was a street person, just making a living for a while, making and selling sandals, later on selling vinegar. So, we don't know so much factually about him, but there are these stories that Menzong collected in the 1600s. So, these characters in East Asian history are very relevant for us, even though we are a non-residential lay Sangha. Maybe when we find and purchase a building for a new temple, some of the spaces there will be rented by practitioners, I hope,

[21:30]

and we will have Sangha members there. So, I want to mention Ryokan, who lived 1758 to 1831. Again, there will not be a test. He was a well-trained monk, and he also deeply studied Dogen, who was not so well-known, even among Soto people in this period. Ryokan was a real character. He supported himself by begging. After he left the monastery, he went back to his hometown and lived a recluse life in a small grass hut near his hometown. Again, he supported himself by begging. He was also, in his own lifetime, a famous calligrapher. So, he was an artist. Calligraphy is a high art in East Asia.

[22:33]

So, there are a lot of stories about him. And he's known, even though he was a very learned student of Dogen and a very well-trained monk, he took the name Daigu, which means great fool, and he lived up to that name. So, there are many stories about his foolishness. I'll just tell a few. Well, he used to play with children around the town. He would be going out on beggar rounds, and he'd put his ball down and he'd carry some balls in his sleeve, and he would play ball with the children or other games. One story is he got involved in a game of hide-and-seek, and he was hiding in a barn. And the next morning, the farmer came out and saw Ryokan and said, what are you doing there? And he said, shh, the children will hear.

[23:38]

So, he was a funny, foolish guy. There are also very touching stories about his wisdom. So, I'm going to tell some of these stories. He was also a great poet, so I'll talk about his poetry, but sorry for the sound of paper rustling. So, he was living in his hometown, or outside his hometown. His younger brother became the head of the town. So, this is a story about his nephew. So, his brother's wife asked Ryokan to please help with her son, who had become kind of a, I guess we call him today a juvenile delinquent.

[24:44]

He was getting into trouble, and she asked Ryokan to come and talk with him. So, Ryokan stayed in their home for a few days, didn't say anything to the nephew. And he was spending lots of money gambling and things like that. Anyway, so Ryokan didn't say anything, but as he was getting ready to leave, he asked his son to come help him strap up his sandals. So, I'm begging around, these are straw sandals that one wears, and they have long straw things that you can wrap around your legs. I ended up finding them very comfortable when I did takohatsu or begging rounds near the monastery in Japan,

[25:47]

but they're difficult at first. Anyway, he asked his nephew to come and help him. Asked him to tie the strings of his straw sandals. His mother was standing by watching, hoping Ryokan would give him some strong advice. And the nephew didn't understand why Ryokan had asked him to help with his sandals. Ryokan didn't say a thing. But as the nephew bent to his task, he felt something wet on his neck. He was surprised and looked up and he saw Ryokan's eyes full of tears. At that moment, the nephew felt repentance for his wrongdoings.

[26:52]

Ryokan stood up and left without a word, and the son told the folks. So there's stories like that. There's also other foolish stories. One time, an old friend was visiting Ryokan in his straw hut, and Ryokan said, oh, I'll go out and get some sake for us to drink. And the guest waited and waited and wondered what had happened to Ryokan. Finally, he went down the hill from his hut, and just a little bit below the hut, he saw Ryokan just sitting there, gazing at the moon. And then he reminded him and Ryokan ran off to get sake. So Ryokan was also a very famous, you know, as well as being a very fool, he was a very famous poet and is still revered in Japan. And again, this is a guy who had done monastic training, but then just went off to live this very modest life.

[27:59]

So I'm going to read a number of poems by Ryokan, just because they're lovely. Here's a couple that I translated with Kastanahashi. Without desire, everything is sufficient. With seeking, myriad things are impoverished. Plain vegetables can soothe hunger. A past robe is enough to cover this bent old body. Alone, I hike with a deer. Cheerfully, I sing with village children. The stream under the cliff cleanses my ears. The pine on the mountaintop fits my heart. So if anyone wants me to repeat any of these, just let me know. Can you do that one again? You want that one again? Without desire, everything is sufficient. Basic Buddhist teaching.

[29:00]

With seeking, myriad things are impoverished. Plain vegetables can soothe hunger. A past robe is enough to cover this bent old body. Alone, I hike with a deer. Cheerfully, I sing with village children. The stream under the cliff cleanses my ears. The pine on the mountaintop fits my heart. Here's another one. All my life, too lackadaisical to stand up for myself. Buoyantly, I leave everything to the harmony of reality. In my sack, three scoops of rice. Beside the fire, a bundle of firewood. Who would ask about traces of delusion and enlightenment? How could you know the dusts of name and gain? Evening rain. In my thatched hut, I casually stretch out my legs. And I'll read some more from Kastanahashi.

[30:04]

There's numbers of books with wonderful stories and poems about Ryokan. I'll read some poems from Kastanahashi's book about Ryokan. Sky Above, Great Wind. Before listening to the Way, do not fail to wash your ears. Otherwise, it will be impossible to listen clearly. What is washing your ears? Do not hold on to your view. If you cling to it even a little bit, you will lose your way. What is similar to you but wrong, you regard as right. What is different from you but right, you regard as wrong. You begin with ideas of right and wrong, and the Way is not so. Seeking answers with closed ears is like trying to touch the ocean bottom with a pole.

[31:08]

So we don't have little cups of water by each seat to literally wash your ears, but just get, you know, let go, let go, let go of your ideas. Another one, a shorter one. One thousand peaks merge with frozen clouds. Ten thousand paths have no human trace. Day by day, facing the wall, at times I hear snow drift over the window. So this is an experience we could have had in the last days, sitting facing the wall as we had light snowfall. So there's so many of these, and they're all good, but I'm just, I just selected a few.

[32:13]

Past has passed away. Future has not arrived. Present does not remain. Nothing is reliable. Everything must change. You hold on to letters and names in vain. Forcing yourself to believe in them. Stop chasing new knowledge. Leave old views behind. Study the essential and then see through it. When there is nothing left to see through, then you will know your mistaken views. And again, anybody who wants me to repeat one of these. Would you read that one again, please? Sure. Past has passed away. Future has not arrived. Present does not remain. Nothing is reliable. Everything must change. You hold on to letters and names in vain. Forcing yourself to believe in them.

[33:16]

Stop chasing new knowledge. Leave old views behind. Study the essential and then see through it. When there is nothing left to see through, then you will know your mistaken views. A couple more. And this is, this great Zen fool, Ryokan, who left the monastery and lived in a grass hut. On a quiet evening in my thatched-roofed hut alone, I play a lute with no string. Its melody enters wind and cloud, mingles deeply with the flowing stream, fills out the dark valley, blows through the vast forest,

[34:19]

then disappears. Other than those who hear emptiness, who will capture this rare sound? Could you repeat that, please? Sure. On a quiet evening in my thatched-roofed hut alone, I play a lute with no string. And this references to that lute with no string in a number of koans. Its melody enters wind and cloud, mingles deeply with the flowing stream, fills out the dark valley, blows through the vast forest, then disappears. Other than those who hear emptiness, who will capture this rare sound? And I'll read one more. It's short. How could we discuss this and that

[35:20]

without knowing the whole world is reflected in a single pearl? So there's a Dogan essay, One Bright Pearl. I'll read this one again. How could we discuss this and that without knowing the whole world is reflected in a single pearl? So, I'm just sharing, in honor of the Malakirti and our upcoming practice period, a number of stories of great lay practitioners. Some of them had trained in monasteries before, but they just went off and lived in the world. I want to close, and then we can have responses and discussion and so forth. But I want to close with a movie recommendation. And I think I saw Nicholas online. Is Nicholas still there?

[36:21]

Oh, good. Yeah, and Nicholas had mentioned this, I think, in a Friday morning or Thursday morning discussion. And this movie is called Living. It's with Bill Nye, who's nominated for Best Actor in the Oscars tonight. The movie is called Living. It's set in England. I don't want to say too much about it, but it starts off with a kind of Kafkaesque world where Bill Nye is head of a group of bureaucrats. And this movie is based on a famous movie in Japan called Ikiru, which means to live, by Akira Kurosawa. So this is a Bodhisattva movie. It was Suzuki Roshi's favorite movie, Ikiru.

[37:24]

And Living with Bill Nye is really good, too. So, again, talking about the examples for us of lay practitioners, lay Bodhisattvas, in Asian history, inspired. Some of them literally inspired by this Sutra on Dhammakirti that we will be studying in the upcoming practice period in April and May. But these are just examples. And there are many, many others, actually. These are not the only ones, by any means. There are other examples of Japanese Zen people who left the monastery and ended up doing things like selling, well, like toastly selling sandals or vinegar by the side of the road

[38:27]

and helping people, like toastly helped the leopard, or just playing with children like Ryoko. And, again, this is something for us to consider, given that Ancient Dragon Zen Gate is a lay Sangha, a non-residential Sangha, coming out of a monastic tradition in China and Japan, and now in California. So, again, as I said at the beginning, some of the people in this room have practiced at Tassajara Monastery, where I lived for a few years, or Green Gulch Farm, where I also lived. There are three-week intensive practice periods at Green Gulch in January for people who can manage to get away then. Don't just came back from one as Thiruvan. So we practice in the world, in the world of Chicago or wherever.

[39:29]

Again, I see people online from Ohio and California and New Mexico and Nick Nichols is in Indiana. So how do we share this teaching and this practice with all beings? This is our challenge. Even as we live in the middle of this big city, people here in this room anyway, and some of the people online. So, maybe that's enough for me to say. We will be considering all this with the various teachings from the Malakirti. Some of them are rather amazing and even humorous. That will be in the practice period in April or May. But for today, any responses or questions, or if you want to share other movie recommendations, that's fine too.

[40:33]

So, Yosan. Morning. What? Changing the audio. Yes. In the room and people online also are welcome too. So, Yosan. Yes, I just, I mean, I have a real interest in these kinds of figures. You know, later we're going to chant the Song of the Grasshopper. And these people always strike me as not stuck outside, inside, or in between in a very particular kind of way. And I just want to note that, excuse me, my ear is a little… I just want to note that you've raised a number of historical figures, but these people are still in the world. When I traveled in Korea with a former teacher, we encountered many such people. And maybe you know, I read a book some years ago,

[41:36]

which I've forgotten about, I gave it away. And it was about a man, I believe he was a student of Sawaki Kodo. And he was known for, he lived for years in a kind of a shabby boarding house. And he had a piece of cardboard, he'd take it out to Ueno Park. And he would just spend all his time there. And he was known for two things. One, he could pluck a piece of grass. And, I mean, some of us could probably do this and make a sound. This guy could play tunes, and he would play tunes for people, and people would give him coins. And then he was also a very accomplished calligrapher, and would do calligraphy. Maybe you recall his name, it was post-war, like 50s. Yeah, there's a book by Arthur Brazenman about some of the Sawaki, Ueno Chiyama teachers. I think he's in there, but I forget the name of the book. Where were you being met? In Tokyo.

[42:37]

Ueno Park is a big part of Tokyo. Yes, so there are still people like this. And, you know, the point is how to take on Bodhisattva practice without being in a monastic residential practice center. Having some experience of those is very, very helpful. And again, when we get our new temple, maybe there'll be two or three spaces for people to practice. But, basically, we're out in the world. Yeah, so there are many examples of this. And not just necessarily Buddhist practitioners, but people out in the world helping homeless people like Tosu. Comments, questions, responses, maybe recommendations or whatever.

[43:42]

Hi, Dylan. It's an album recommendation. It's called Dose Your Dreams. It's a psychedelic punk album that has been really influential on me. It came out in 2018. It's a concept album. And the narrative is loosely that there's this guy that's working in an office job. I think he gets fired or he quits. It's not the first song. And he falls or jumps out the window of the office building that he's in and lands in kind of a trash heap where there's this woman who's living there or he's hanging out there named Joyce. And the whole concept is kind of loosely influenced by Ulysses by James Joyce. So her name is Joyce and she's an older woman who is a suffragette or a women's rights activist who now is like a street person.

[44:44]

And he has a very transformative experience of just hanging out with this woman who kind of recalibrates the way that he looks at the world. And so it's had a big influence on me. The ending suite of the album has these amazing songs called Love is an Island in the Sea and Joyce Stops Time. So it's been a really important record for dealing with this stage of capitalism, basically, and how meaning works basically now in America. Could you say the name of the group and the album? I could. The name of the group is An Explosive. So the name of the group is Fucked Up. And again, the album is called Dose Your Dreams. Cool. Thank you. Yeah, I really recommend it. Other comments online or in the room? Yes, Aisha.

[45:46]

Oh, thank you for a nice talk with wonderful poems and stories. And I think I just agreed to give a talk on mindfulness meditation to some law students. And I've been thinking about that. And your talk really kind of inspired in me sort of a deeper thought about the value of doing nothing and the ways that we don't value that in our culture. I mean, it's just endemic not to value that. And it doesn't mean that we have to, you know, give up everything we have and beg on the street. Although that is an option. Can we bring, maybe it's more possible

[46:47]

and still just as worthwhile, if not maybe more so worthwhile to bring that spirit to what we do. Yes, not to, as some of Rokhan's poems say, not to, you know, enforce your views or rush around basically. It's easy to become too busy in this world. And there's a famous story in our tradition about a brother telling his brother, you should know there's one who's not busy. So even when we're very actively engaged, yeah, and you might consult. We have at least a couple of lawyers in our song, but a couple of attorneys, I'm not sure if any of them are here now. But yeah, you might consult with them too.

[47:49]

Thank you. How do we, just in the course of events in our life, how do we find ways to be helpful? And again, it doesn't mean giving away all your money. As a homeless person, although it might. But how do we just in the world do things? Yes. Like the people that you're talking about. I was wondering if any of them have patrons and if that changes what you're doing, if you have a patron. I mean, I guess I think a little bit of the model of the, you know, the online patron thing where you can support an artist. Yeah. Anyway, but does it make a difference if somebody is helping your practice

[48:56]

and you're not just supporting yourself selling dinner? Well, yeah, there are lots of stories of monks and practitioners who did have patrons. The point isn't to seek for fame or wealth. Those are poisons. This is throughout Buddhist teaching. And, you know, Dogen had a samurai student who was wealthy and who was lived up in northern Japan. Fukui was an ecstasy who helped him build a agency. It was a one-eyed samurai. So it feels some affinity. But, yeah, the point is, there's a story about Dogen going to the capital, being summoned to go to the capital of Kamakura to meet with a shogun.

[49:56]

And he spent, I don't know, six or eight months there. And when he came back, he apologized to the monks in his monastery and said, I didn't teach them anything that I haven't taught. So, yeah, that's an important question. Thank you. Yes, hi. Hi, my name is Salama, I'm here today. Welcome, welcome. Thank you. I'm thinking about, I'm studying to be a chaplain and I'm thinking about inner chaplaincy and outer chaplaincy. And I've been in a lot of my own grief work, I guess you could say. And sometimes I just feel like all I do is spend my days projecting my own stuff all over the world. My anger, my fear. And I also know that there's no perfection in any sort of act.

[50:57]

So I didn't plan what I was going to say. So first, thank you for your talk. Thank you for being here. So actually, we have in our sangha, I think, maybe a dozen chaplains. So it's a very good bodhisattva job and it's very challenging. And we've had, I don't think any of them are here right now. But anyway, yeah, it's good, right, livelihood. And there are other people here who are helping in various ways as psychologists or teachers. We have a number of great school teachers also. So yeah, the point isn't to live in some, to try and seek out some little cardboard or that grass-roofed hut.

[52:00]

Sometimes some people have done that. We still do that, as Niazan mentioned. But how do we be in the world in a way that is helpful, in the same way that Fumilakirti was helpful, or that Ro Khan was helpful, or that Tosui was helpful. So this is the challenge of our practice. And there are all kinds of vocations that one can have in which one does that. So thank you very much for joining our Ancient Dragon Chapel squad. Tell me your name again. Solano. Please come again. Other comments or questions or music or movie recommendations or just other responses to any of this. Well, thank you all very much.

[53:32]

We're here in Arządão in Lincoln Square or online joining us soon. Hope to see you all.

[53:45]

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